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| | | Author: | 62Bricks  | | Posted: | Nov 2, 2014 13:03 | | Subject: | Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 117 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests (Entry) | | Status: | Open | |
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| Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Change 1 Part Yellow {3626bp01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Hollow to 3626ap01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Solid}
Comments from Submitter:
This minifig last appeared in sets in 1987, before the hollow stud version of the standard grin minifig head was in production (c.1991)
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| | | | | Author: | therobo | | Posted: | Nov 2, 2014 13:23 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 70 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Change 1 Part Yellow {3626bp01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Hollow to 3626ap01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Solid}
Comments from Submitter:
This minifig last appeared in sets in 1987, before the hollow stud version of the standard grin minifig head was in production (c.1991)
|
I assume, you will then message 85 sellers to check their figs?
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| | | | | | | Author: | 62Bricks | | Posted: | Nov 2, 2014 13:53 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 62 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| In Inventories Requests, therobo writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Change 1 Part Yellow {3626bp01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Hollow to 3626ap01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Solid}
Comments from Submitter:
This minifig last appeared in sets in 1987, before the hollow stud version of the standard grin minifig head was in production (c.1991)
|
I assume, you will then message 85 sellers to check their figs?
|
No, I will not.
Is that the reason these inventories have never been fixed? Because someone might
have relied on the wrong inventory when assembling their minifigs?
If so, it's not a very good reason.
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | RobErNat | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 13:45 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 49 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, therobo writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Change 1 Part Yellow {3626bp01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Hollow to 3626ap01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Solid}
Comments from Submitter:
This minifig last appeared in sets in 1987, before the hollow stud version of the standard grin minifig head was in production (c.1991)
|
I assume, you will then message 85 sellers to check their figs?
|
No, I will not.
Is that the reason these inventories have never been fixed? Because someone might
have relied on the wrong inventory when assembling their minifigs?
If so, it's not a very good reason.
|
Actually, it's because the way Minifigs have been inventoried in the past
has been placed in a Standards for Inventorying a Minifig 'rule': check
under 'heads'.
http://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=200&q=minifig
The 'rule' is oudated as now there is a 'c'-type head... but
on old figs it has always been done like that, doens't mean you're not
right, but it's simply not done that way... Any change to such figs would
impact the listings of many sellers, probably the reason why this 'rule'
was made in the first place... Some sellers do specify the head type in their
listing.
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | 62Bricks | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 13:57 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 45 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| In Inventories Requests, RobErNat writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, therobo writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Change 1 Part Yellow {3626bp01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Hollow to 3626ap01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Solid}
Comments from Submitter:
This minifig last appeared in sets in 1987, before the hollow stud version of the standard grin minifig head was in production (c.1991)
|
I assume, you will then message 85 sellers to check their figs?
|
No, I will not.
Is that the reason these inventories have never been fixed? Because someone might
have relied on the wrong inventory when assembling their minifigs?
If so, it's not a very good reason.
|
Actually, it's because the way Minifigs have been inventoried in the past
has been placed in a Standards for Inventorying a Minifig 'rule': check
under 'heads'.
http://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=200&q=minifig
The 'rule' is oudated as now there is a 'c'-type head... but
on old figs it has always been done like that, doens't mean you're not
right, but it's simply not done that way... Any change to such figs would
impact the listings of many sellers, probably the reason why this 'rule'
was made in the first place... Some sellers do specify the head type in their
listing.
|
That rule was incorrect when it was adopted. Adhering to it in cases when it
is obviously incorrect is not defensible, in my opinion. The inventory should
be corrected and the rule changed. I take it from your response that the policy
is not to fix mistakes that are the fault of Bricklink's erroneous standards?
The incorrect rule is more important than an accurate listing?
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | viejos | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 14:14 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 59 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, RobErNat writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, therobo writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Change 1 Part Yellow {3626bp01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Hollow to 3626ap01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Solid}
Comments from Submitter:
This minifig last appeared in sets in 1987, before the hollow stud version of the standard grin minifig head was in production (c.1991)
|
I assume, you will then message 85 sellers to check their figs?
|
No, I will not.
Is that the reason these inventories have never been fixed? Because someone might
have relied on the wrong inventory when assembling their minifigs?
If so, it's not a very good reason.
|
Actually, it's because the way Minifigs have been inventoried in the past
has been placed in a Standards for Inventorying a Minifig 'rule': check
under 'heads'.
http://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=200&q=minifig
The 'rule' is oudated as now there is a 'c'-type head... but
on old figs it has always been done like that, doens't mean you're not
right, but it's simply not done that way... Any change to such figs would
impact the listings of many sellers, probably the reason why this 'rule'
was made in the first place... Some sellers do specify the head type in their
listing.
|
That rule was incorrect when it was adopted. Adhering to it in cases when it
is obviously incorrect is not defensible, in my opinion. The inventory should
be corrected and the rule changed. I take it from your response that the policy
is not to fix mistakes that are the fault of Bricklink's erroneous standards?
The incorrect rule is more important than an accurate listing?
|
I once had a teacher that told me there were reasons for everything - it's
just that some of them are more apparent than others. I believe the core issue
here is that sellers of newer parts and figs want a share in the vintage replacement
parts market. This is another huge reason why some sellers want undetermined
entries and they want them linked to the old inventories. When a customer is
looking to complete a set, they will often add the missing parts and figs directly
from the inventory, and in the case of an undetermined (or wrong) inventory item,
may receive modern variant parts in their order.
Of course the argument is that many people don't care about such details,
but in reality it's that many people don't know about them. When they
do know about them, I think the percentage of people who want the original parts
will be much higher than is often touted around the Forum (e.g. 99% of buyers
don't care, etc, etc).
Russell
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | 62Bricks | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 14:39 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 46 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| In Inventories Requests, viejos writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, RobErNat writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, therobo writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Change 1 Part Yellow {3626bp01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Hollow to 3626ap01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Solid}
Comments from Submitter:
This minifig last appeared in sets in 1987, before the hollow stud version of the standard grin minifig head was in production (c.1991)
|
I assume, you will then message 85 sellers to check their figs?
|
No, I will not.
Is that the reason these inventories have never been fixed? Because someone might
have relied on the wrong inventory when assembling their minifigs?
If so, it's not a very good reason.
|
Actually, it's because the way Minifigs have been inventoried in the past
has been placed in a Standards for Inventorying a Minifig 'rule': check
under 'heads'.
http://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=200&q=minifig
The 'rule' is oudated as now there is a 'c'-type head... but
on old figs it has always been done like that, doens't mean you're not
right, but it's simply not done that way... Any change to such figs would
impact the listings of many sellers, probably the reason why this 'rule'
was made in the first place... Some sellers do specify the head type in their
listing.
|
That rule was incorrect when it was adopted. Adhering to it in cases when it
is obviously incorrect is not defensible, in my opinion. The inventory should
be corrected and the rule changed. I take it from your response that the policy
is not to fix mistakes that are the fault of Bricklink's erroneous standards?
The incorrect rule is more important than an accurate listing?
|
I once had a teacher that told me there were reasons for everything - it's
just that some of them are more apparent than others. I believe the core issue
here is that sellers of newer parts and figs want a share in the vintage replacement
parts market. This is another huge reason why some sellers want undetermined
entries and they want them linked to the old inventories. When a customer is
looking to complete a set, they will often add the missing parts and figs directly
from the inventory, and in the case of an undetermined (or wrong) inventory item,
may receive modern variant parts in their order.
Of course the argument is that many people don't care about such details,
but in reality it's that many people don't know about them. When they
do know about them, I think the percentage of people who want the original parts
will be much higher than is often touted around the Forum (e.g. 99% of buyers
don't care, etc, etc).
Russell
|
I think the reason for this rule was to cover a shortcoming in the design of
the database which did not allow for alternate parts in Minifig inventories.
There are a small handful of Minifig heads that exist in both solid and hollow
stud versions and during a short period around 1992 there may have been a transition
period when a new figure might have had either version. Since the catalog could
not indicate these possible alternates, it seems a decision was made that the
hollow stud version should be used. That standard was then applied to ALL Minifigs,
even those that were firmly produced only with solid stud heads. It was a bad
standard then, and it is even more incorrect now. Not to change it because too
many people may have relied on the bad information is wrong. The longer it stays
In place the more listings will be affected, meaning it will never be fixed.
Please fix it. Please update the inventory with the correct part.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | viejos | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 15:08 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 43 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | I think the reason for this rule was to cover a shortcoming in the design of
the database which did not allow for alternate parts in Minifig inventories.
|
This was not an issue of not being able to do so, but an unwillingness to do
so. Dan could have programmed minifig inventories to have alternates, just like
he could have enabled counterparts to be selected when parting a set. But he
didn't. He had his reasons, I am sure, but one of them was *not* that it
couldn't be done.
| | Please fix it. Please update the inventory with the correct part.
|
I agree. At least the figs up to 1992 should have the solid stud head.
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Andy_Bell | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 15:13 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 41 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| In Inventories Requests, viejos writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | I think the reason for this rule was to cover a shortcoming in the design of
the database which did not allow for alternate parts in Minifig inventories.
|
This was not an issue of not being able to do so, but an unwillingness to do
so. Dan could have programmed minifig inventories to have alternates, just like
he could have enabled counterparts to be selected when parting a set. But he
didn't. He had his reasons, I am sure, but one of them was *not* that it
couldn't be done.
| | Please fix it. Please update the inventory with the correct part.
|
I agree. At least the figs up to 1992 should have the solid stud head.
|
Nope it is more that LEGO rarely identifies mold variants* - even when it makes
a difference to a build. Sets are packed with what ever parts are on hand and
shipped out. Very common to get parts in different variants in the same package.
The idea that there is a 'right' inventory adds a level of 'black
and white' to these mold variants that LEGO never worked from.
Andy
And they don't always observe the color variants the way BL and other AFOLs
want to. Been discussed more than once that several 'different' colors
on BL are the same color internally at LEGO.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Proprietor | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 15:23 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 32 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| Still, there are windows of predictability.
Did LEGO change the grays or browns prior to 2004? I know they mixed for a
while, but it's safe to assume that sets from the 90's and earlier are
always the old colors. And that sets that stopped being sold years before the
introduction of the "b" head never had that head in its inventory. Why let
the cusp situations control? And why continue with the "b" default?
In Inventories Requests, Andy_Bell writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, viejos writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | I think the reason for this rule was to cover a shortcoming in the design of
the database which did not allow for alternate parts in Minifig inventories.
|
This was not an issue of not being able to do so, but an unwillingness to do
so. Dan could have programmed minifig inventories to have alternates, just like
he could have enabled counterparts to be selected when parting a set. But he
didn't. He had his reasons, I am sure, but one of them was *not* that it
couldn't be done.
| | Please fix it. Please update the inventory with the correct part.
|
I agree. At least the figs up to 1992 should have the solid stud head.
|
Nope it is more that LEGO rarely identifies mold variants* - even when it makes
a difference to a build. Sets are packed with what ever parts are on hand and
shipped out. Very common to get parts in different variants in the same package.
The idea that there is a 'right' inventory adds a level of 'black
and white' to these mold variants that LEGO never worked from.
Andy
And they don't always observe the color variants the way BL and other AFOLs
want to. Been discussed more than once that several 'different' colors
on BL are the same color internally at LEGO.
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Andy_Bell | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 16:49 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 43 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| In Inventories Requests, Proprietor writes:
| | Still, there are windows of predictability.
Did LEGO change the grays or browns prior to 2004? I know they mixed for a
while, but it's safe to assume that sets from the 90's and earlier are
always the old colors. And that sets that stopped being sold years before the
introduction of the "b" head never had that head in its inventory. Why let
the cusp situations control? And why continue with the "b" default?
|
Just to point out the obvious - the color shift was big - and LEGO promised to
never mix colors in the same box, which they did anyway later. They have never
promised any such thing for mold variants.
For this particular minifig it may make sense to change the head in the inventory
as there is a few years of separation.
But there are many others that can't be known. And the older brick molds
are added into inventories. This is also problematic as there are many more mold
variants that the catalog recognizes. This creates a false sense that the inventory
is 'right'
This is just my opinion.
I'd have one 2x4 for inventories and general use and then a reference chart
that shows introduction dates of differing variants and let sellers/re-creators
use that as a guide for which variants are correct for the age of the set.
There are few hard transition dates.
All the variants are there for use by sellers and buyers as they see fit. This
gives those who care the information and ability.
Andy
| |
In Inventories Requests, Andy_Bell writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, viejos writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | I think the reason for this rule was to cover a shortcoming in the design of
the database which did not allow for alternate parts in Minifig inventories.
|
This was not an issue of not being able to do so, but an unwillingness to do
so. Dan could have programmed minifig inventories to have alternates, just like
he could have enabled counterparts to be selected when parting a set. But he
didn't. He had his reasons, I am sure, but one of them was *not* that it
couldn't be done.
| | Please fix it. Please update the inventory with the correct part.
|
I agree. At least the figs up to 1992 should have the solid stud head.
|
Nope it is more that LEGO rarely identifies mold variants* - even when it makes
a difference to a build. Sets are packed with what ever parts are on hand and
shipped out. Very common to get parts in different variants in the same package.
The idea that there is a 'right' inventory adds a level of 'black
and white' to these mold variants that LEGO never worked from.
Andy
And they don't always observe the color variants the way BL and other AFOLs
want to. Been discussed more than once that several 'different' colors
on BL are the same color internally at LEGO.
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Andy_Bell | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 16:57 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 31 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| In Inventories Requests, Andy_Bell writes:
| |
This is just my opinion.
I'd have one 2x4 for inventories and general use and then a reference chart
that shows introduction dates of differing variants and let sellers/re-creators
use that as a guide for which variants are correct for the age of the set.
There are few hard transition dates.
All the variants are there for use by sellers and buyers as they see fit. This
gives those who care the information and ability.
Andy
|
I say this an AFOL who likes the era in question - -
https://www.flickr.com/photos/asbpics/sets/72157645805524096/
I am right now putting together the January 2015 setup-
The goal is all Classic Town sets from 78-88 with a few 88-89 sets.
It's fun, but once the hat or wig is in place the open or solid stud does
not matter. In the 3 years I set up the 6000 Idea Book. I was never asked if
they were all the right (mold) parts.
Most common question - Are those yours from when you were a kid? (yeah right!)
or from AFOLs are those original stickers?
Andy
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Proprietor | | Posted: | Nov 11, 2014 00:52 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 36 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| Great project and beautiful pix. Thanks for sharing.
Maybe the issue is predictability and consistency.
We have a 3001 and 3001old in the catalog. Functionally identical (I believe),
but a distinction is made.
Should inventories be as correct or accurate as possible or not? Either way,
they should be consistent.
And while no one asks about the molds in your display, I do get asked by buyers
of vintage sets if the parts are correct (eg patent pending, pip location, etc.).
At the very least, a price guide that means anything needs to be based on consistency.
Sure the comments help, but if replacement parts are allowed in complete sets
then the price guide will get skewed down, which isn't accurate or fair.
I understand that the rule is (or was) no more undetermined items, that they
were remnants of the old days for variations that can't be confirmed. I
actually think every part with a variation should have an undertermined category
for buyers and sellers who don't care (even though those items won't
be linked to any set) and so that when a part is listed as a or b or c it actually
is.
And when the distinction is clear, like the a heads for classic space and castle,
the inventories should be correct. Also, eliminate the now outdated preference
for the b head.
Onward!
In Inventories Requests, Andy_Bell writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, Andy_Bell writes:
| |
This is just my opinion.
I'd have one 2x4 for inventories and general use and then a reference chart
that shows introduction dates of differing variants and let sellers/re-creators
use that as a guide for which variants are correct for the age of the set.
There are few hard transition dates.
All the variants are there for use by sellers and buyers as they see fit. This
gives those who care the information and ability.
Andy
|
I say this an AFOL who likes the era in question - -
https://www.flickr.com/photos/asbpics/sets/72157645805524096/
I am right now putting together the January 2015 setup-
The goal is all Classic Town sets from 78-88 with a few 88-89 sets.
It's fun, but once the hat or wig is in place the open or solid stud does
not matter. In the 3 years I set up the 6000 Idea Book. I was never asked if
they were all the right (mold) parts.
Most common question - Are those yours from when you were a kid? (yeah right!)
or from AFOLs are those original stickers?
Andy
|
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | 62Bricks | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 15:30 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 40 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| In Inventories Requests, Andy_Bell writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, viejos writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | I think the reason for this rule was to cover a shortcoming in the design of
the database which did not allow for alternate parts in Minifig inventories.
|
This was not an issue of not being able to do so, but an unwillingness to do
so. Dan could have programmed minifig inventories to have alternates, just like
he could have enabled counterparts to be selected when parting a set. But he
didn't. He had his reasons, I am sure, but one of them was *not* that it
couldn't be done.
| | Please fix it. Please update the inventory with the correct part.
|
I agree. At least the figs up to 1992 should have the solid stud head.
|
Nope it is more that LEGO rarely identifies mold variants* - even when it makes
a difference to a build. Sets are packed with what ever parts are on hand and
shipped out. Very common to get parts in different variants in the same package.
The idea that there is a 'right' inventory adds a level of 'black
and white' to these mold variants that LEGO never worked from.
Andy
And they don't always observe the color variants the way BL and other AFOLs
want to. Been discussed more than once that several 'different' colors
on BL are the same color internally at LEGO.
|
Again, this is not really about alternates, because these vintage minifigs did
not have alternate heads. There is indeed a "right" part for these figures because
there was only one version of the part produced at the time they were sold.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | QCBricks | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 15:48 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 39 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, Andy_Bell writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, viejos writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | I think the reason for this rule was to cover a shortcoming in the design of
the database which did not allow for alternate parts in Minifig inventories.
|
This was not an issue of not being able to do so, but an unwillingness to do
so. Dan could have programmed minifig inventories to have alternates, just like
he could have enabled counterparts to be selected when parting a set. But he
didn't. He had his reasons, I am sure, but one of them was *not* that it
couldn't be done.
| | Please fix it. Please update the inventory with the correct part.
|
I agree. At least the figs up to 1992 should have the solid stud head.
|
Nope it is more that LEGO rarely identifies mold variants* - even when it makes
a difference to a build. Sets are packed with what ever parts are on hand and
shipped out. Very common to get parts in different variants in the same package.
The idea that there is a 'right' inventory adds a level of 'black
and white' to these mold variants that LEGO never worked from.
Andy
And they don't always observe the color variants the way BL and other AFOLs
want to. Been discussed more than once that several 'different' colors
on BL are the same color internally at LEGO.
|
Again, this is not really about alternates, because these vintage minifigs did
not have alternate heads. There is indeed a "right" part for these figures because
there was only one version of the part produced at the time they were sold.
|
I think that Andy's point is that it is a completely slippery slope. There
are hundreds of small issues throughout the catalog in terms of what parts are
in what sets or which parts are extras. There are some extras in inventories
that literally no one other than the inventory submitter has ever seen in a set.
In some cases, the community decides that changes can be made such as:
in 2013 sets.
But, that does not happen that often. In that particular case, there may have
been issues that influenced the issue one way or the other. (Price?...I don't
remember)
Yet, there are other cases that are never changed.
We broke something like 200
and none of them ever contained an extra 4L bar. Does not mean that they never
did, but that judgement is not made here. It is up to sellers to check their
sets...just like it is up to buyers to ensure that they are receiving a particular
mold variation if that is important to them.
So be it. BL will never be the world's most perfect catalog site, and that
is not even why the site is here. It is here to connect sellers and buyers.
Scott
|
|
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | 62Bricks | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 16:02 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 35 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| In Inventories Requests, QCBricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, Andy_Bell writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, viejos writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | I think the reason for this rule was to cover a shortcoming in the design of
the database which did not allow for alternate parts in Minifig inventories.
|
This was not an issue of not being able to do so, but an unwillingness to do
so. Dan could have programmed minifig inventories to have alternates, just like
he could have enabled counterparts to be selected when parting a set. But he
didn't. He had his reasons, I am sure, but one of them was *not* that it
couldn't be done.
| | Please fix it. Please update the inventory with the correct part.
|
I agree. At least the figs up to 1992 should have the solid stud head.
|
Nope it is more that LEGO rarely identifies mold variants* - even when it makes
a difference to a build. Sets are packed with what ever parts are on hand and
shipped out. Very common to get parts in different variants in the same package.
The idea that there is a 'right' inventory adds a level of 'black
and white' to these mold variants that LEGO never worked from.
Andy
And they don't always observe the color variants the way BL and other AFOLs
want to. Been discussed more than once that several 'different' colors
on BL are the same color internally at LEGO.
|
Again, this is not really about alternates, because these vintage minifigs did
not have alternate heads. There is indeed a "right" part for these figures because
there was only one version of the part produced at the time they were sold.
|
I think that Andy's point is that it is a completely slippery slope. There
are hundreds of small issues throughout the catalog in terms of what parts are
in what sets or which parts are extras. There are some extras in inventories
that literally no one other than the inventory submitter has ever seen in a set.
In some cases, the community decides that changes can be made such as:
in 2013 sets.
But, that does not happen that often. In that particular case, there may have
been issues that influenced the issue one way or the other. (Price?...I don't
remember)
Yet, there are other cases that are never changed.
We broke something like 200
and none of them ever contained an extra 4L bar. Does not mean that they never
did, but that judgement is not made here. It is up to sellers to check their
sets...just like it is up to buyers to ensure that they are receiving a particular
mold variation if that is important to them.
So be it. BL will never be the world's most perfect catalog site, and that
is not even why the site is here. It is here to connect sellers and buyers.
Scott
|
It is not a slippery slope in the case of these classic space figures. They are
no longer in production, and the re-issues are significantly different. They
were never produced with hollow heads and had been out of production for years
by the time the hollow stud head appeared. This is not a case where a figure
might have had one variant or another.
And as far as connecting sellers and buyers, these figures are currently in high
demand. The people who want them are usually restoring their own sets from their
childhood. They want the real thing. Bricklink's incorrect inventory is not
good for buyers and sellers.
|
|
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Andy_Bell | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 16:39 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 46 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, QCBricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, Andy_Bell writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, viejos writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | I think the reason for this rule was to cover a shortcoming in the design of
the database which did not allow for alternate parts in Minifig inventories.
|
This was not an issue of not being able to do so, but an unwillingness to do
so. Dan could have programmed minifig inventories to have alternates, just like
he could have enabled counterparts to be selected when parting a set. But he
didn't. He had his reasons, I am sure, but one of them was *not* that it
couldn't be done.
| | Please fix it. Please update the inventory with the correct part.
|
I agree. At least the figs up to 1992 should have the solid stud head.
|
Nope it is more that LEGO rarely identifies mold variants* - even when it makes
a difference to a build. Sets are packed with what ever parts are on hand and
shipped out. Very common to get parts in different variants in the same package.
The idea that there is a 'right' inventory adds a level of 'black
and white' to these mold variants that LEGO never worked from.
Andy
And they don't always observe the color variants the way BL and other AFOLs
want to. Been discussed more than once that several 'different' colors
on BL are the same color internally at LEGO.
|
Again, this is not really about alternates, because these vintage minifigs did
not have alternate heads. There is indeed a "right" part for these figures because
there was only one version of the part produced at the time they were sold.
|
I think that Andy's point is that it is a completely slippery slope. There
are hundreds of small issues throughout the catalog in terms of what parts are
in what sets or which parts are extras. There are some extras in inventories
that literally no one other than the inventory submitter has ever seen in a set.
|
|
| | | |
So be it. BL will never be the world's most perfect catalog site, and that
is not even why the site is here. It is here to connect sellers and buyers.
Scott
|
It is not a slippery slope in the case of these classic space figures. They are
no longer in production, and the re-issues are significantly different. They
were never produced with hollow heads and had been out of production for years
by the time the hollow stud head appeared. This is not a case where a figure
might have had one variant or another.
And as far as connecting sellers and buyers, these figures are currently in high
demand. The people who want them are usually restoring their own sets from their
childhood. They want the real thing. Bricklink's incorrect inventory is not
good for buyers and sellers.
|
Perhaps for the head it is incorrect. But it is also incorrect for the other
variants not in the catalog. Are they less important the the head stud for someone
who wants an 'original?'
What about these other variants from the 82-87 time frame?
Did they have:
The short ribs or hollow torso?
Light yellow or normal yellow hands?
Light yellow or normal yellow air tanks?
Squarish or normal radius heads?
'heavy' or 'light' face printing?
I can tell you these variants are much more common than:
But it is in the catalog. I have many examples of the other variants - none of
this helmet.
What about the helmet variants? They were present from 82-87?
Should the inventory list the thin or thick chinstraps?
I am not saying accuracy is bad. In this case- in this minifigure- perhaps we
can say yes they only came in solid stud. What about the minifigs that span the
transition?
Should there be alternates? What about all the other variants?
And when LEGO would pack both in the same set? The more variants and alternates
there are the more diluted the catalog becomes the harder it is for buyers and
sellers to connect.
Andy
|
|
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | 62Bricks | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 17:16 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 46 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| In Inventories Requests, Andy_Bell writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, QCBricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, Andy_Bell writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, viejos writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | I think the reason for this rule was to cover a shortcoming in the design of
the database which did not allow for alternate parts in Minifig inventories.
|
This was not an issue of not being able to do so, but an unwillingness to do
so. Dan could have programmed minifig inventories to have alternates, just like
he could have enabled counterparts to be selected when parting a set. But he
didn't. He had his reasons, I am sure, but one of them was *not* that it
couldn't be done.
| | Please fix it. Please update the inventory with the correct part.
|
I agree. At least the figs up to 1992 should have the solid stud head.
|
Nope it is more that LEGO rarely identifies mold variants* - even when it makes
a difference to a build. Sets are packed with what ever parts are on hand and
shipped out. Very common to get parts in different variants in the same package.
The idea that there is a 'right' inventory adds a level of 'black
and white' to these mold variants that LEGO never worked from.
Andy
And they don't always observe the color variants the way BL and other AFOLs
want to. Been discussed more than once that several 'different' colors
on BL are the same color internally at LEGO.
|
Again, this is not really about alternates, because these vintage minifigs did
not have alternate heads. There is indeed a "right" part for these figures because
there was only one version of the part produced at the time they were sold.
|
I think that Andy's point is that it is a completely slippery slope. There
are hundreds of small issues throughout the catalog in terms of what parts are
in what sets or which parts are extras. There are some extras in inventories
that literally no one other than the inventory submitter has ever seen in a set.
|
|
| | | |
So be it. BL will never be the world's most perfect catalog site, and that
is not even why the site is here. It is here to connect sellers and buyers.
Scott
|
It is not a slippery slope in the case of these classic space figures. They are
no longer in production, and the re-issues are significantly different. They
were never produced with hollow heads and had been out of production for years
by the time the hollow stud head appeared. This is not a case where a figure
might have had one variant or another.
And as far as connecting sellers and buyers, these figures are currently in high
demand. The people who want them are usually restoring their own sets from their
childhood. They want the real thing. Bricklink's incorrect inventory is not
good for buyers and sellers.
|
Perhaps for the head it is incorrect. But it is also incorrect for the other
variants not in the catalog. Are they less important the the head stud for someone
who wants an 'original?'
What about these other variants from the 82-87 time frame?
Did they have:
The short ribs or hollow torso?
Light yellow or normal yellow hands?
Light yellow or normal yellow air tanks?
Squarish or normal radius heads?
'heavy' or 'light' face printing?
I can tell you these variants are much more common than:
But it is in the catalog. I have many examples of the other variants - none of
this helmet.
What about the helmet variants? They were present from 82-87?
Should the inventory list the thin or thick chinstraps?
I am not saying accuracy is bad. In this case- in this minifigure- perhaps we
can say yes they only came in solid stud. What about the minifigs that span the
transition?
Should there be alternates? What about all the other variants?
And when LEGO would pack both in the same set? The more variants and alternates
there are the more diluted the catalog becomes the harder it is for buyers and
sellers to connect.
Andy
|
Yes, those variations exist. I'm not asking for any new entries for those
variations. I'm asking that the inventory for this figure represent the actual
part for which there already a separate entry, and which is NOT a variation on
this minifig. None of your "slippery slope" examples apply here.
The helmet issue could be fixed by allowing alternates for minifig inventories,
without adding any new entries.
Fixing this would require no new definitions or entries. The wrong part is listed.
The correct part has been in the catalog for a decade. Time to get it right.
|
|
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | QCBricks | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 16:45 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 38 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, QCBricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, Andy_Bell writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, viejos writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | I think the reason for this rule was to cover a shortcoming in the design of
the database which did not allow for alternate parts in Minifig inventories.
|
This was not an issue of not being able to do so, but an unwillingness to do
so. Dan could have programmed minifig inventories to have alternates, just like
he could have enabled counterparts to be selected when parting a set. But he
didn't. He had his reasons, I am sure, but one of them was *not* that it
couldn't be done.
| | Please fix it. Please update the inventory with the correct part.
|
I agree. At least the figs up to 1992 should have the solid stud head.
|
Nope it is more that LEGO rarely identifies mold variants* - even when it makes
a difference to a build. Sets are packed with what ever parts are on hand and
shipped out. Very common to get parts in different variants in the same package.
The idea that there is a 'right' inventory adds a level of 'black
and white' to these mold variants that LEGO never worked from.
Andy
And they don't always observe the color variants the way BL and other AFOLs
want to. Been discussed more than once that several 'different' colors
on BL are the same color internally at LEGO.
|
Again, this is not really about alternates, because these vintage minifigs did
not have alternate heads. There is indeed a "right" part for these figures because
there was only one version of the part produced at the time they were sold.
|
I think that Andy's point is that it is a completely slippery slope. There
are hundreds of small issues throughout the catalog in terms of what parts are
in what sets or which parts are extras. There are some extras in inventories
that literally no one other than the inventory submitter has ever seen in a set.
In some cases, the community decides that changes can be made such as:
in 2013 sets.
But, that does not happen that often. In that particular case, there may have
been issues that influenced the issue one way or the other. (Price?...I don't
remember)
Yet, there are other cases that are never changed.
We broke something like 200
and none of them ever contained an extra 4L bar. Does not mean that they never
did, but that judgement is not made here. It is up to sellers to check their
sets...just like it is up to buyers to ensure that they are receiving a particular
mold variation if that is important to them.
So be it. BL will never be the world's most perfect catalog site, and that
is not even why the site is here. It is here to connect sellers and buyers.
Scott
|
It is not a slippery slope in the case of these classic space figures. They are
no longer in production, and the re-issues are significantly different. They
were never produced with hollow heads and had been out of production for years
by the time the hollow stud head appeared. This is not a case where a figure
might have had one variant or another.
And as far as connecting sellers and buyers, these figures are currently in high
demand. The people who want them are usually restoring their own sets from their
childhood. They want the real thing. Bricklink's incorrect inventory is not
good for buyers and sellers.
|
Yet, they can be completed without using only period specific parts, just as
it says in the notes on the entry. For the handful of buyers that want militantly
original parts, the option is there to contact the sellers. For the sellers
that want to let buyers know that they have only original parts, that option
is there as well.
It is no different than any other part.
As Andy Bell said in another post, BL has never tried to account for every variation
in every case and this is no different. If we are going to say one version of
"x only happened when y" has merit, then there are likely 10 others that we can
come up with for just this fig.
Multiply that by thousands of parts that have had minor variations over the years
and that is just not a project that the great majority of BL members are interested
in. It is far easier to leave the entries as they are and allow those interested
to work around the issues to suit how they want to buy or sell rather than trying
to force the catalog into a single, very strict place.
There are much bigger fish to fry throughout the catalog.
Scott
|
|
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | viejos | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 21:46 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 48 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| In Inventories Requests, Andy_Bell writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, viejos writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | I think the reason for this rule was to cover a shortcoming in the design of
the database which did not allow for alternate parts in Minifig inventories.
|
This was not an issue of not being able to do so, but an unwillingness to do
so. Dan could have programmed minifig inventories to have alternates, just like
he could have enabled counterparts to be selected when parting a set. But he
didn't. He had his reasons, I am sure, but one of them was *not* that it
couldn't be done.
| | Please fix it. Please update the inventory with the correct part.
|
I agree. At least the figs up to 1992 should have the solid stud head.
|
Nope it is more that LEGO rarely identifies mold variants* - even when it makes
a difference to a build. Sets are packed with what ever parts are on hand and
shipped out. Very common to get parts in different variants in the same package.
|
| | The idea that there is a 'right' inventory adds a level of 'black
and white' to these mold variants that LEGO never worked from.
|
There is a sensible, practical way to do inventory work on BL that is neither
too laissez faire nor too pedantic, and it takes into account issues of production.
Just because we can't be 100% accurate doesn't mean we shouldn't
make corrections.
Russell
|
|
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | TakeAbricK | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 14:44 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 49 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| In Inventories Requests, RobErNat writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, therobo writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Change 1 Part Yellow {3626bp01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Hollow to 3626ap01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Solid}
Comments from Submitter:
This minifig last appeared in sets in 1987, before the hollow stud version of the standard grin minifig head was in production (c.1991)
|
I assume, you will then message 85 sellers to check their figs?
|
No, I will not.
Is that the reason these inventories have never been fixed? Because someone might
have relied on the wrong inventory when assembling their minifigs?
If so, it's not a very good reason.
|
Actually, it's because the way Minifigs have been inventoried in the past
has been placed in a Standards for Inventorying a Minifig 'rule': check
under 'heads'.
http://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=200&q=minifig
The 'rule' is oudated as now there is a 'c'-type head... but
on old figs it has always been done like that, doens't mean you're not
right, but it's simply not done that way... Any change to such figs would
impact the listings of many sellers, probably the reason why this 'rule'
was made in the first place... Some sellers do specify the head type in their
listing.
|
I think this rule was made because otherwise there would be (at least) twice
as much Minifigs in the catalogue. Most Figs from the early days were released
with solid stud heads and later on with Hollow stud heads.
It's about the same as Santa right now.
First with head:
[p=3626bpb798]
and in set 10245 with head
[p=3626cpb798]
Diana
|
|
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Andy_Bell | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 15:05 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 37 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| In Inventories Requests, TakeAbricK writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, RobErNat writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, therobo writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Change 1 Part Yellow {3626bp01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Hollow to 3626ap01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Solid}
Comments from Submitter:
This minifig last appeared in sets in 1987, before the hollow stud version of the standard grin minifig head was in production (c.1991)
|
I assume, you will then message 85 sellers to check their figs?
|
No, I will not.
Is that the reason these inventories have never been fixed? Because someone might
have relied on the wrong inventory when assembling their minifigs?
If so, it's not a very good reason.
|
Actually, it's because the way Minifigs have been inventoried in the past
has been placed in a Standards for Inventorying a Minifig 'rule': check
under 'heads'.
http://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=200&q=minifig
The 'rule' is oudated as now there is a 'c'-type head... but
on old figs it has always been done like that, doens't mean you're not
right, but it's simply not done that way... Any change to such figs would
impact the listings of many sellers, probably the reason why this 'rule'
was made in the first place... Some sellers do specify the head type in their
listing.
|
I think this rule was made because otherwise there would be (at least) twice
as much Minifigs in the catalogue. Most Figs from the early days were released
with solid stud heads and later on with Hollow stud heads.
|
Exponential rather than double because if we decide to go to that extent then
the torso styles need to be included.
And what about the different hand styles?
Of the different print thickness of the standard smiley face?
Or the different head radius on standard smiley heads?
http://www.leggodt.nl/items/lego/themes-minifigs.php
In my opinion 99% of the part mold variants are a waste of time and effort and
hassle for most buyers. Adding this additionally level of unnecessary complexity
would not be beneficial.
Back in the day... there was a sense of the catalog was to facilitate bringing
buyers and sellers together. Not as an historical archive of all mold and part
variants. There are places for that, but it is not BrickLink.
Andy
|
|
|
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | QCBricks | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 16:47 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 34 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| In Inventories Requests, Andy_Bell writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, TakeAbricK writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, RobErNat writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, therobo writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Change 1 Part Yellow {3626bp01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Hollow to 3626ap01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Solid}
Comments from Submitter:
This minifig last appeared in sets in 1987, before the hollow stud version of the standard grin minifig head was in production (c.1991)
|
I assume, you will then message 85 sellers to check their figs?
|
No, I will not.
Is that the reason these inventories have never been fixed? Because someone might
have relied on the wrong inventory when assembling their minifigs?
If so, it's not a very good reason.
|
Actually, it's because the way Minifigs have been inventoried in the past
has been placed in a Standards for Inventorying a Minifig 'rule': check
under 'heads'.
http://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=200&q=minifig
The 'rule' is oudated as now there is a 'c'-type head... but
on old figs it has always been done like that, doens't mean you're not
right, but it's simply not done that way... Any change to such figs would
impact the listings of many sellers, probably the reason why this 'rule'
was made in the first place... Some sellers do specify the head type in their
listing.
|
I think this rule was made because otherwise there would be (at least) twice
as much Minifigs in the catalogue. Most Figs from the early days were released
with solid stud heads and later on with Hollow stud heads.
|
Exponential rather than double because if we decide to go to that extent then
the torso styles need to be included.
And what about the different hand styles?
Of the different print thickness of the standard smiley face?
Or the different head radius on standard smiley heads?
http://www.leggodt.nl/items/lego/themes-minifigs.php
In my opinion 99% of the part mold variants are a waste of time and effort and
hassle for most buyers. Adding this additionally level of unnecessary complexity
would not be beneficial.
Back in the day... there was a sense of the catalog was to facilitate bringing
buyers and sellers together. Not as an historical archive of all mold and part
variants. There are places for that, but it is not BrickLink.
Andy
|
Ninja'd
Should do less talking while typing.
Scott
|
|
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Proprietor | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 15:07 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 32 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| Maybe, but the early space and castle minifigs were only ever sold with the solid
stud "a" head.
And the preference for the "b" head was decided at a time when that was the current
head. For a "c" head only figure it would make no sense to only use the equivalent
"b" head (if there is one), yet that's the rule.
Maybe it's time for alternate parts to be allowed in minifig inventories
but if not, then maybe an "a", "b" etc suffix for variations, eg SP006a, SP006b,
etc.
In Inventories Requests, TakeAbricK writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, RobErNat writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, therobo writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Change 1 Part Yellow {3626bp01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Hollow to 3626ap01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Solid}
Comments from Submitter:
This minifig last appeared in sets in 1987, before the hollow stud version of the standard grin minifig head was in production (c.1991)
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I assume, you will then message 85 sellers to check their figs?
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No, I will not.
Is that the reason these inventories have never been fixed? Because someone might
have relied on the wrong inventory when assembling their minifigs?
If so, it's not a very good reason.
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Actually, it's because the way Minifigs have been inventoried in the past
has been placed in a Standards for Inventorying a Minifig 'rule': check
under 'heads'.
http://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=200&q=minifig
The 'rule' is oudated as now there is a 'c'-type head... but
on old figs it has always been done like that, doens't mean you're not
right, but it's simply not done that way... Any change to such figs would
impact the listings of many sellers, probably the reason why this 'rule'
was made in the first place... Some sellers do specify the head type in their
listing.
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I think this rule was made because otherwise there would be (at least) twice
as much Minifigs in the catalogue. Most Figs from the early days were released
with solid stud heads and later on with Hollow stud heads.
It's about the same as Santa right now.
First with head:
[p=3626bpb798]
and in set 10245 with head
[p=3626cpb798]
Diana
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| | | | | | | Author: | LordSkylark | | Posted: | Mar 5, 2015 23:18 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 54 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| In Inventories Requests, therobo writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Change 1 Part Yellow {3626bp01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Hollow to 3626ap01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Solid}
Comments from Submitter:
This minifig last appeared in sets in 1987, before the hollow stud version of the standard grin minifig head was in production (c.1991)
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I assume, you will then message 85 sellers to check their figs?
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How hard can it be to have an automatic system?
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | PurpleDave | | Posted: | Mar 6, 2015 00:23 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 40 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| In Inventories Requests, LordSkylark writes:
| | How hard can it be to have an automatic system?
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To message every affected member, right? Because automatically switching store
listings over to the correct version could cause people to sell the incorrect
parts. In this case, maybe a seller built the minifig according to the flawed
catalog listing and doesn't have the solid-stud head anymore.
But yeah, you'd think they would have had something built into the site where
the instant someone deletes a catalog entry, it sends out notifications to anyone
who has some listed for sale, has it want listed, or has bought any recently.
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | therobo | | Posted: | Mar 6, 2015 07:34 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 49 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| In Inventories Requests, LordSkylark writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, therobo writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Change 1 Part Yellow {3626bp01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Hollow to 3626ap01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Solid}
Comments from Submitter:
This minifig last appeared in sets in 1987, before the hollow stud version of the standard grin minifig head was in production (c.1991)
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I assume, you will then message 85 sellers to check their figs?
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How hard can it be to have an automatic system?
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I guess it won't be difficult to program a button which would allow to notify
sellers when an inventory was changed. However it was always BrickLink's
philosophy not to mass-e-mail members for inventory changes. It could very fast
lead to be considered SPAM, depending on the amount of e-mails. An additional
action item in MyBrickLink would be a less obtrusive way to notify sellers. But
as always said, someone needs to care for this idea and implement it. Catalog
and inventory admins already send e-mails to sellers on occasion, but it depends
on the individual situation.
Ronald
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| | | | | Author: | Proprietor | | Posted: | Nov 5, 2014 14:36 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 47 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Change 1 Part Yellow {3626bp01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Hollow to 3626ap01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Solid}
Comments from Submitter:
This minifig last appeared in sets in 1987, before the hollow stud version of the standard grin minifig head was in production (c.1991)
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There is a note on the catalog page for this figure:
Additional Notes:
Production of this minifigure ended in 1988, but some of the parts comprising
it have been in production since that time in modern variations. A figure composed
of parts completely authentic to the period would have a solid stud head as well
as a torso with small (or no) prongs for attachment to the legs. Buyers to whom
such details are important should verify with the seller before purchase. Likewise
sellers may wish to indicate if the minifigs they are listing are composed of
parts authentic to the period rather than modern replacement parts.
But I agree that the rule makes no sense, never did, and should be changed.
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| | | | | Author: | 62Bricks | | Posted: | Jan 4, 2015 16:42 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Minifig sp007 | | Viewed: | 47 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| In Inventories Requests, 62Bricks writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Change 1 Part Yellow {3626bp01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Hollow to 3626ap01 Minifig, Head Standard Grin Pattern - Stud Solid}
Comments from Submitter:
This minifig last appeared in sets in 1987, before the hollow stud version of the standard grin minifig head was in production (c.1991)
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This request has been languishing for a couple months, during which time several
objections have been raised and much discussion has taken place. I'd like
to renew the request and address some of the common objections that have been
made:
1. There is no clear information on when the change was made from solid to
hollow stud heads, so changing it would only be a guess.
As per its usual practice, LEGO did not have a hard cutoff point when sets went
from containing solid to hollow stud heads. However through the work of hundreds
of LEGO fans and collectors, it has been established that the change took place
around 1990-91. http://www.leggodt.nl/items/lego/themes-minifigs.php?language=en
The last original Classic Space minifig appeared in 1988 sets, two years before
the first hollow-stud heads are documented. This fact is acknowledged in the
Bricklink catalog in the note attached to these figures. This figure was never
originally released with a hollow stud head.
2. This should not be changed because sellers may have figures currently listed
based on the present inventory
This is true of every inventory change. If this is the case, then we should
never make any inventory changes at all. Yet changes are made almost every day.
3. This should not be changed because it's an alternate part and currently
minifig inventories do not support alternate parts.
This is true of some minifigs, but not this particular one. There are several
other classic minifigs that were only ever produced with solid stud heads. This
information is widely accepted and documented by respected members of this community.
4. Sellers can just add a note to their listings that the figure has a solid
stud
This is true, but this is not how inventory errors are usually handled. In hundreds
of other cases, requests are approved and the inventories are updated or corrected.
There is nothing special about this figure that should prevent it from being
updated like any other inventory.
5. There is already a note on the listing that says it originally came with
a solid stud head.
This is true, but in my opinion the fact that the inventory admins have already
recognized that the inventory is wrong is even more reason to correct it.
6. Changing the head type would require creating a new listing, which would
create problems with the catalog.
The fact is that minifig inventories are being changed all the time without creating
new listings - including changes to heads with different stud types.
On Dec. 11, 2014, this minifig inventory was changed to delete a hollow stud
head and replace it with a recessed stud head with the same pattern: http://www.bricklink.com/catalogInvChangeItem.asp?itemType=M&itemNo=twn204&viewDate=Y&viewStatus=1
On Feb. 27, 2014, the helmet in this Classic Space minifig inventory was
changed from undetermined visor dimples to visor dimples: http://www.bricklink.com/catalogInvChangeItem.asp?itemType=M&itemNo=sp005&viewDate=Y&viewStatus=1
These are just a couple recent examples. Browsing the change logs for minifig
inventories show many more. There is nothing special about this minifig inventory
that should prevent it from being updated. Changes have been made to other Classic
Space figures with no objections.
7. The Bricklink catalog is a selling platform and is not intended to be a
definitive reference source.
This is a concern for sellers. In the case of the Classic Space minifigs,
these are some of the most in-demand classic figures on the market. Some of the
figures have also been re-issued recently, meaning there are modern versions
with modern parts. Demand for original figures has steadily increased as people
who played with these sets as children look to replace or restore their childhood
sets. The release of the LEGO Movie and Benny's Spaceship has only sharpened
this demand.
Distinguishing original items from later re-issues is extremely important in
every collectible market, including minifigs. An accurate inventory for
this figure (and others like it) will increase confidence among buyers that Bricklink
is the place to find an authentic original classic figure. That's
good for buyers, sellers and Bricklink.
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Germany, Berlin
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