| Discussion Forum: Thread 346453 |
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| | | Author: | unrefined  | | Posted: | Sep 12, 2023 09:28 | | Subject: | Confirm multiple variations in same set | | Viewed: | 64 times | | Topic: | Catalog Identification | |
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| I am rebuilding some old sets and I would like to confirm that sets from the
1980s and 1990s used multiple mold variations of the same part in the same set.
Primarily I am looking to confirm that these older sets used pieces (plates)
with both solid posts and hollow posts.
My main goal is to rebuild some older sets as accurately as possible but seeing
as how there is no confirmed answer to when the hollow posts started being made,
and how long it took to phase out the solid posts, I am unsure of my accuracy.
I think the best way to confirm this is with someone who owns a new, open-box
set from this period, and can look through the unopened bags to confirm that
both molds are present in the same bag/set.
I realize that this is a big ask but I feel like it would help the community
greatly. If someone is willing to provide photo evidence of this I will use it
in a website that I am making to help with identifying parts.
Thank you!
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| | | | | Author: | jennnifer | | Posted: | Sep 12, 2023 09:34 | | Subject: | Re: Confirm multiple variations in same set | | Viewed: | 30 times | | Topic: | Catalog Identification | |
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| In Catalog Identification, unrefined writes:
| | I am rebuilding some old sets and I would like to confirm that sets from the
1980s and 1990s used multiple mold variations of the same part in the same set.
Primarily I am looking to confirm that these older sets used pieces (plates)
with both solid posts and hollow posts.
My main goal is to rebuild some older sets as accurately as possible but seeing
as how there is no confirmed answer to when the hollow posts started being made,
and how long it took to phase out the solid posts, I am unsure of my accuracy.
I think the best way to confirm this is with someone who owns a new, open-box
set from this period, and can look through the unopened bags to confirm that
both molds are present in the same bag/set.
I realize that this is a big ask but I feel like it would help the community
greatly. If someone is willing to provide photo evidence of this I will use it
in a website that I am making to help with identifying parts.
Thank you!
|
It's a nice theory... but there was and is significant variation within LEGO
sets and their production. One person opening one set does not definitely prove
a part never appeared in that set. You can look through our extensive list of
Alternates to try and get a sense of the scale of the problem.
Good luck with your project!
~Jen
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| | | | | Author: | crazylegoman | | Posted: | Sep 12, 2023 10:11 | | Subject: | Re: Confirm multiple variations in same set | | Viewed: | 38 times | | Topic: | Inventories | |
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| The parts you have pictured are the version with the groove (hence the "b"
at the end of the part number.) That version of the part, hollow bottom pin
or not, was not made until 2005. If you're rebuilding sets from the 1980s
and 90s, then they would definitely not have the version with the groove around
the bottom.
David
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| | | | | Author: | unrefined | | Posted: | Sep 12, 2023 16:40 | | Subject: | Re: Confirm multiple variations in same set | | Viewed: | 30 times | | Topic: | Catalog Identification | |
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| Thank you for the responses.
I am new to BrickLinks community board so I am not sure how to respond to particular
people so I will just respond to both comments here:
1: I understand that one person's validation, or invalidation of a theory
does not make it true or false. I am hoping that if at least one person finds
evidence of the use of two variations of a part in a set, it COULD be true for
more. And the more people that are able to verify, the better. This is a question
that I think causes a lot of confusion and I for one would like to attempt to
validate/confirm it.
2: I am also aware that the picture I chose is of the '3097b' element
which represents the grooved variant. I was using this picture as a visual example
of what I was referring to as the 'solid' and 'hollow' posts.
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| | | | | | | Author: | SylvainLS | | Posted: | Sep 12, 2023 17:08 | | Subject: | Re: Confirm multiple variations in same set | | Viewed: | 29 times | | Topic: | Catalog Identification | |
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| In Catalog Identification, unrefined writes:
| | Thank you for the responses.
I am new to BrickLinks community board so I am not sure how to respond to particular
people so I will just respond to both comments here:
|
You can hit “reply” to each post you want to answer… or you can make a global
response.
Your choice 
| | 1: I understand that one person's validation, or invalidation of a theory
does not make it true or false.
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Er, one invalidation does make a theory false. That’s a principle of logic 
| | I am hoping that if at least one person finds
evidence of the use of two variations of a part in a set, it COULD be true for
more. And the more people that are able to verify, the better. This is a question
that I think causes a lot of confusion and I for one would like to attempt to
validate/confirm it.
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For the unrecognized “hollow-pin” plates variants, I don’t know for sure, it
was during my Dark Ages. But it wouldn’t surprise me because the rule is that
LEGO uses what’s available!
For other / any variant:
In inventories here, there’s only two entries:
— in the Regular section: N parts P-a in colour C,
— in the Alternate section: N parts P-b in colour C.
But that doesn’t mean people only found the two cases (either all P-a or all
P-b).
It means that some people found some combination and you can find any combination
yourself.
You can check that in the changelog of some inventory: when people make inventory
change requests to specify variants and add Alternates, they often say how many
of each variant they got. For instance, they ask for adding the ‘b’ variant
as Alternate for colour C and say something like “all the parts in colour D were
variant ‘a’” or “I got 6 ‘a’ and 4 ‘b’ in colour C.”
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | unrefined | | Posted: | Sep 13, 2023 16:52 | | Subject: | Re: Confirm multiple variations in same set | | Viewed: | 27 times | | Topic: | Catalog Identification | |
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| In Catalog Identification, SylvainLS writes:
| | In Catalog Identification, unrefined writes:
| | Thank you for the responses.
I am new to BrickLinks community board so I am not sure how to respond to particular
people so I will just respond to both comments here:
|
You can hit “reply” to each post you want to answer… or you can make a global
response.
Your choice
| | 1: I understand that one person's validation, or invalidation of a theory
does not make it true or false.
|
Er, one invalidation does make a theory false. That’s a principle of logic
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Lol. yes. What I meant, was that if someone looks in a set and does not see mixed
molds that does not disprove the theory so much as confirm that it is nondeterministic.
I was merely looking to see if at least one, or perhaps a few people could provide
evidence which would indeed validate the theory. This is why I love posting on
message boards x)
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| | I am hoping that if at least one person finds
evidence of the use of two variations of a part in a set, it COULD be true for
more. And the more people that are able to verify, the better. This is a question
that I think causes a lot of confusion and I for one would like to attempt to
validate/confirm it.
|
For the unrecognized “hollow-pin” plates variants, I don’t know for sure, it
was during my Dark Ages. But it wouldn’t surprise me because the rule is that
LEGO uses what’s available!
For other / any variant:
In inventories here, there’s only two entries:
— in the Regular section: N parts P-a in colour C,
— in the Alternate section: N parts P-b in colour C.
But that doesn’t mean people only found the two cases (either all P-a or all
P-b).
It means that some people found some combination and you can find any combination
yourself.
You can check that in the changelog of some inventory: when people make inventory
change requests to specify variants and add Alternates, they often say how many
of each variant they got. For instance, they ask for adding the ‘b’ variant
as Alternate for colour C and say something like “all the parts in colour D were
variant ‘a’” or “I got 6 ‘a’ and 4 ‘b’ in colour C.”
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That is very helpful. Thank you for that. It seems as though that only confirms
functional element variants and not mold variants but it may be helpful.
Here is another fun mold change that I would love to know the years for:
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Brickitty | | Posted: | Sep 13, 2023 17:14 | | Subject: | Re: Confirm multiple variations in same set | | Viewed: | 26 times | | Topic: | Catalog Identification | |
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| In Catalog Identification, unrefined writes:
| | Here is another fun mold change that I would love to know the years for:
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I have these mold differences separated in my store. As best as I could trace
it a few years ago, the one with the embossed logo in the center was the only
variant up until around 2008-2009, when they introduced the one with no logo.
Both molds were included in sets until around 2011-2012, when the one with the
embossed logo was fully phased out. Note that these years are just my best estimations
based on a variety of sets, when new colors of the part were introduced, etc.
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| | | | | Author: | Brickitty | | Posted: | Sep 12, 2023 17:16 | | Subject: | Re: Confirm multiple variations in same set | | Viewed: | 27 times | | Topic: | Catalog Identification | |
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| In Catalog Identification, unrefined writes:
| | I am rebuilding some old sets and I would like to confirm that sets from the
1980s and 1990s used multiple mold variations of the same part in the same set.
Primarily I am looking to confirm that these older sets used pieces (plates)
with both solid posts and hollow posts.
My main goal is to rebuild some older sets as accurately as possible but seeing
as how there is no confirmed answer to when the hollow posts started being made,
and how long it took to phase out the solid posts, I am unsure of my accuracy.
I think the best way to confirm this is with someone who owns a new, open-box
set from this period, and can look through the unopened bags to confirm that
both molds are present in the same bag/set.
I realize that this is a big ask but I feel like it would help the community
greatly. If someone is willing to provide photo evidence of this I will use it
in a website that I am making to help with identifying parts.
Thank you!
|
Yes, I have opened sealed sets from the mid-to-late-'90s and '00s that
included both hollow and solid bottom pins in plates, modified plates, bricks,
and modified bricks in the same set.
For the '80s, I have only opened a couple of sealed sets, but every single
part had solid bottom pins. Based on available evidence, including discussion
forums, part release dates, and experience with sets that weren't sealed
but had been kept built for decades, I believe that hollow bottom pins didn't
exist until sometime in the early '90s.
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USA, Massachusetts
France, Nouvelle-Aquitaine
