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| | | Author: | christor  | | Posted: | Apr 23, 2023 18:42 | | Subject: | Customs Forms etc - UK to EU low volume sales | | Viewed: | 92 times | | Topic: | Taxes | |
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| I am based in the UK and have sold a large used set to Denmark, but it's
the first time I've shipped out of the UK since a good while pre-Brexit,
and probably since BL was bought by TLC. There's a lot that has changed.
I have everything packaged up, invoiced, been paid, have purchased my shipping
online from Parcelforce UK, and then printed out the reams of customs forms that
it had me download. This is all new to me, have never been given this in the
past.
It is really hard to find actual practical advice that doesn't assume you
have lots of prior knowledge or are an export business. Most stuff I find is
really generic advice and either described in pages and pages of legal jargon
or in comments or posts that are brief and focus on one query only, but never
the whole process. Is there no 'shipping guidance and filling out customs
forms for dummies that only buy and sell occasional sets to support their hobby'?
It's really frustrating.
Q1. Since the set is worth over £135 GBP, I gather BL doesn't automatically
add the taxes on during the sale, instead, duties and VAT are charged to the
recipient upon arrival - correct?
Q2. Is the sales tax and duty status all the same, whether the set being sold
is new or used?
So I have figured out through various sources, that you have to include in a
clear plastic envelope stuck to the outside, all of the copies of all of the
forms (1 despatch note, 2 customs declarations, and 4(!) copies of the "commercial
invoice" generated by Parcelforce) - although I gather I should also include
a copy of the invoice from BL too - even though there's no tax or duty already
paid that needs evidencing (assume for a shipment under the £135 threshold that
this is all more relevant?)
Q3. Is the above correct?
One other aspect that seems unclear - as an occasional trader on Bricklink, I
always viewed myself as a private individual buying and selling sets to support
my hobby, and not as a "commercial exporter".
Q4. Is this still correct in a legal sense, or does even the slightest activity
peg me with that label and the obligations that go with it?
Q5. I'm not VAT registered, I fall way below that threshold, but what about
EORI registration? I have never heard of this before but everything I'm reading
suggests it's necessary - but I'm not a commercial export business????
So now I come to filling out those forms. First the customs declarations:
So HS tariff codes are all new to me too, it seems these are a requirement now,
and I have found what seems to be the right code - 9503003500.
Q6. Then it asks for export license number / certificate number which I think
are irrelevant if I'm not a licensed commercial export business, so it's
safe to leave these blank?
Q7. There's a space for Shipping Costs which Parcelforce has left blank,
although it knows full well the amount it charged me, and has entered those figures
on the invoices? Do I need to also fill it in here?
And so, onto the invoices themselves, all 4 copies:
Q8 (see Q5). There's a space for EORI number - but see above ... is this
required?
There is also then a line on the invoice that states "The exporter of the
products covered by this document declares that, except where otherwise and clearly
indicated, these products are of ________________ preferential origin."
Underneath that there is a declaration the goods aren't subject to prohibitions
or restrictions.
And then underneath that, is a space for signing and dating the declarations
"For and on behalf of the above named customer".
Q9. So firstly, can someone please explain if the second hand Lego I am selling
from the UK to Denmark is of preferential origin or not (and why?) and what the
blank space next to that is for? ("non-preferential origin"?). Do I need
to put something in here?
Q10. Secondly, is this invoice declaration intended to be filled out & signed
by me, the vendor, presumably on behalf of the customer (which seems weird?)
- or by the buyer - i.e. customer - upon receipt?
So sorry for the long post, but it is virtually impossible to find a practical
guide and I've searched BL but only get pieces of the picture. Many thanks
in advance for any help and advice anyone can provide.
Chris
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| | | | | Author: | Stuart9 | | Posted: | Apr 23, 2023 18:48 | | Subject: | Re: Customs Forms etc - UK to EU low volume sales | | Viewed: | 43 times | | Topic: | Taxes | |
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| This is exactly why I’m now sticking with U.K. sales only.
Can’t answer your questions as I don’t understand everything myself including
having to register in Germany regarding recycling.
In Taxes, christor writes:
| | I am based in the UK and have sold a large used set to Denmark, but it's
the first time I've shipped out of the UK since a good while pre-Brexit,
and probably since BL was bought by TLC. There's a lot that has changed.
I have everything packaged up, invoiced, been paid, have purchased my shipping
online from Parcelforce UK, and then printed out the reams of customs forms that
it had me download. This is all new to me, have never been given this in the
past.
It is really hard to find actual practical advice that doesn't assume you
have lots of prior knowledge or are an export business. Most stuff I find is
really generic advice and either described in pages and pages of legal jargon
or in comments or posts that are brief and focus on one query only, but never
the whole process. Is there no 'shipping guidance and filling out customs
forms for dummies that only buy and sell occasional sets to support their hobby'?
It's really frustrating.
Q1. Since the set is worth over £135 GBP, I gather BL doesn't automatically
add the taxes on during the sale, instead, duties and VAT are charged to the
recipient upon arrival - correct?
Q2. Is the sales tax and duty status all the same, whether the set being sold
is new or used?
So I have figured out through various sources, that you have to include in a
clear plastic envelope stuck to the outside, all of the copies of all of the
forms (1 despatch note, 2 customs declarations, and 4(!) copies of the "commercial
invoice" generated by Parcelforce) - although I gather I should also include
a copy of the invoice from BL too - even though there's no tax or duty already
paid that needs evidencing (assume for a shipment under the £135 threshold that
this is all more relevant?)
Q3. Is the above correct?
One other aspect that seems unclear - as an occasional trader on Bricklink, I
always viewed myself as a private individual buying and selling sets to support
my hobby, and not as a "commercial exporter".
Q4. Is this still correct in a legal sense, or does even the slightest activity
peg me with that label and the obligations that go with it?
Q5. I'm not VAT registered, I fall way below that threshold, but what about
EORI registration? I have never heard of this before but everything I'm reading
suggests it's necessary - but I'm not a commercial export business????
So now I come to filling out those forms. First the customs declarations:
So HS tariff codes are all new to me too, it seems these are a requirement now,
and I have found what seems to be the right code - 9503003500.
Q6. Then it asks for export license number / certificate number which I think
are irrelevant if I'm not a licensed commercial export business, so it's
safe to leave these blank?
Q7. There's a space for Shipping Costs which Parcelforce has left blank,
although it knows full well the amount it charged me, and has entered those figures
on the invoices? Do I need to also fill it in here?
And so, onto the invoices themselves, all 4 copies:
Q8 (see Q5). There's a space for EORI number - but see above ... is this
required?
There is also then a line on the invoice that states "The exporter of the
products covered by this document declares that, except where otherwise and clearly
indicated, these products are of ________________ preferential origin."
Underneath that there is a declaration the goods aren't subject to prohibitions
or restrictions.
And then underneath that, is a space for signing and dating the declarations
"For and on behalf of the above named customer".
Q9. So firstly, can someone please explain if the second hand Lego I am selling
from the UK to Denmark is of preferential origin or not (and why?) and what the
blank space next to that is for? ("non-preferential origin"?). Do I need
to put something in here?
Q10. Secondly, is this invoice declaration intended to be filled out & signed
by me, the vendor, presumably on behalf of the customer (which seems weird?)
- or by the buyer - i.e. customer - upon receipt?
So sorry for the long post, but it is virtually impossible to find a practical
guide and I've searched BL but only get pieces of the picture. Many thanks
in advance for any help and advice anyone can provide.
Chris
|
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| | | | | | | Author: | christor | | Posted: | Apr 24, 2023 20:26 | | Subject: | Re: Customs Forms etc - UK to EU low volume sales | | Viewed: | 30 times | | Topic: | Taxes | |
|
| In Taxes, Stuart9 writes:
| | This is exactly why I’m now sticking with U.K. sales only.
Can’t answer your questions as I don’t understand everything myself including
having to register in Germany regarding recycling.
|
Yeah, I'm starting to wonder myself if it's worth the hassle going forwards!
| |
In Taxes, christor writes:
| | I am based in the UK and have sold a large used set to Denmark, but it's
the first time I've shipped out of the UK since a good while pre-Brexit,
and probably since BL was bought by TLC. There's a lot that has changed.
I have everything packaged up, invoiced, been paid, have purchased my shipping
online from Parcelforce UK, and then printed out the reams of customs forms that
it had me download. This is all new to me, have never been given this in the
past.
It is really hard to find actual practical advice that doesn't assume you
have lots of prior knowledge or are an export business. Most stuff I find is
really generic advice and either described in pages and pages of legal jargon
or in comments or posts that are brief and focus on one query only, but never
the whole process. Is there no 'shipping guidance and filling out customs
forms for dummies that only buy and sell occasional sets to support their hobby'?
It's really frustrating.
Q1. Since the set is worth over £135 GBP, I gather BL doesn't automatically
add the taxes on during the sale, instead, duties and VAT are charged to the
recipient upon arrival - correct?
Q2. Is the sales tax and duty status all the same, whether the set being sold
is new or used?
So I have figured out through various sources, that you have to include in a
clear plastic envelope stuck to the outside, all of the copies of all of the
forms (1 despatch note, 2 customs declarations, and 4(!) copies of the "commercial
invoice" generated by Parcelforce) - although I gather I should also include
a copy of the invoice from BL too - even though there's no tax or duty already
paid that needs evidencing (assume for a shipment under the £135 threshold that
this is all more relevant?)
Q3. Is the above correct?
One other aspect that seems unclear - as an occasional trader on Bricklink, I
always viewed myself as a private individual buying and selling sets to support
my hobby, and not as a "commercial exporter".
Q4. Is this still correct in a legal sense, or does even the slightest activity
peg me with that label and the obligations that go with it?
Q5. I'm not VAT registered, I fall way below that threshold, but what about
EORI registration? I have never heard of this before but everything I'm reading
suggests it's necessary - but I'm not a commercial export business????
So now I come to filling out those forms. First the customs declarations:
So HS tariff codes are all new to me too, it seems these are a requirement now,
and I have found what seems to be the right code - 9503003500.
Q6. Then it asks for export license number / certificate number which I think
are irrelevant if I'm not a licensed commercial export business, so it's
safe to leave these blank?
Q7. There's a space for Shipping Costs which Parcelforce has left blank,
although it knows full well the amount it charged me, and has entered those figures
on the invoices? Do I need to also fill it in here?
And so, onto the invoices themselves, all 4 copies:
Q8 (see Q5). There's a space for EORI number - but see above ... is this
required?
There is also then a line on the invoice that states "The exporter of the
products covered by this document declares that, except where otherwise and clearly
indicated, these products are of ________________ preferential origin."
Underneath that there is a declaration the goods aren't subject to prohibitions
or restrictions.
And then underneath that, is a space for signing and dating the declarations
"For and on behalf of the above named customer".
Q9. So firstly, can someone please explain if the second hand Lego I am selling
from the UK to Denmark is of preferential origin or not (and why?) and what the
blank space next to that is for? ("non-preferential origin"?). Do I need
to put something in here?
Q10. Secondly, is this invoice declaration intended to be filled out & signed
by me, the vendor, presumably on behalf of the customer (which seems weird?)
- or by the buyer - i.e. customer - upon receipt?
So sorry for the long post, but it is virtually impossible to find a practical
guide and I've searched BL but only get pieces of the picture. Many thanks
in advance for any help and advice anyone can provide.
Chris
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| | | | | Author: | 1001bricks | | Posted: | Apr 23, 2023 19:09 | | Subject: | Re: Customs Forms etc - UK to EU low volume sales | | Viewed: | 61 times | | Topic: | Taxes | |
|
| | | It is really hard to find actual practical advice that doesn't assume you
have lots of prior knowledge or are an export business.
|
You're selling, you've a shop, you're supposed to be an informed
seller.
Including your and the others taxes. Sorry.
| | Q1. Since the set is worth over £135 GBP, I gather BL doesn't automatically
add the taxes on during the sale
|
Yes.
| | instead, duties and VAT are charged to the
recipient upon arrival - correct?
|
Yes.
| | Q2. Is the sales tax and duty status all the same, whether the set being sold
is new or used?
|
Yes. It's just the value: $1000 used or $1000 new or $1000 bananas are the
same tax, it's about $1000 (to simplify).
| | So I have figured out through various sources, that you have to include in a
clear plastic envelope stuck to the outside, all of the copies of all of the
forms (1 despatch note, 2 customs declarations, and 4(!) copies of the "commercial
invoice" generated by Parcelforce)
|
Yes, outside, important !!!
But 2 or 4 copies doesn't really matter, at least 2 copies of the invoice.
| | although I gather I should also include
a copy of the invoice from BL too - even though there's no tax or duty already
paid that needs evidencing (assume for a shipment under the £135 threshold that
this is all more relevant?)
|
BL doesn't provide ANY invoice; just orders.
Or if you set it up, an Invoice by e-mail, then put this e-mail printed as a
PDF?
But you can make an invoice "manually" as long as it's as legal as
possible.
| | One other aspect that seems unclear - as an occasional trader on Bricklink, I
always viewed myself as a private individual buying and selling sets to support
my hobby, and not as a "commercial exporter".
|
Occasional status?
That doesn't exist.
Either you make a GIFT, unsollicitated (otherwise it's not a gift), and you
and the recipient can prove it, or it's a taxable shipment.
| | Q5. I'm not VAT registered, I fall way below that threshold, but what about
EORI registration? I have never heard of this before but everything I'm reading
suggests it's necessary - but I'm not a commercial export business????
|
Again, you've to manage all this, or not have a shop, or not to export.
All in all, LEGO Sets are mainly originated from Denmark, you fill the forms
and sign yourself of course, not the buyer.
HTH?
|
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| | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | Author: | christor | | Posted: | Apr 24, 2023 19:55 | | Subject: | Re: Customs Forms etc - UK to EU low volume sales | | Viewed: | 39 times | | Topic: | Taxes | |
|
| In Taxes, 1001bricks writes:
| | | | It is really hard to find actual practical advice that doesn't assume you
have lots of prior knowledge or are an export business.
|
You're selling, you've a shop, you're supposed to be an informed
seller.
Including your and the others taxes. Sorry.
|
That's a little bit uncharitable, as I've been trying to research and
find out, but nowhere seems to explain the process and country to country differences
in plain English - especially re Brexit changes. I'm not unaware of the need
for payment of taxes and duties, but understanding the details of the current
process is complicated for someone that hasn't made thousands of trades,
and picked up on all of the incremental changes and nuances along the way. That
said, thank you for the rest of your advice.
| |
| | Q1. Since the set is worth over £135 GBP, I gather BL doesn't automatically
add the taxes on during the sale
|
Yes.
|
OK, good.
| |
| | instead, duties and VAT are charged to the
recipient upon arrival - correct?
|
Yes.
|
OK, good also.
| |
| | Q2. Is the sales tax and duty status all the same, whether the set being sold
is new or used?
|
Yes. It's just the value: $1000 used or $1000 new or $1000 bananas are the
same tax, it's about $1000 (to simplify).
|
OK, that is clear. I guess fundamentally it just seems morally wrong to me for
any nation to charge VAT on sales of second hand items*, but that is a whole
separate discussion! Duty of course, is another matter, and I've no issue
there. *Imagine if people had to charge VAT at car boot sales or garage sales
... ugh!
| |
| | So I have figured out through various sources, that you have to include in a
clear plastic envelope stuck to the outside, all of the copies of all of the
forms (1 despatch note, 2 customs declarations, and 4(!) copies of the "commercial
invoice" generated by Parcelforce)
|
Yes, outside, important !!!
But 2 or 4 copies doesn't really matter, at least 2 copies of the invoice.
|
OK. Do you know where I'd find a reference confirming this?
| |
| | although I gather I should also include
a copy of the invoice from BL too - even though there's no tax or duty already
paid that needs evidencing (assume for a shipment under the £135 threshold that
this is all more relevant?)
|
BL doesn't provide ANY invoice; just orders.
|
I probably mis-spoke there, but I was picking up on another answer in another
thread. I think probably they meant just a print of the order confirmation which
shows any shipping, taxes or duty paid or not paid etc.
| |
Or if you set it up, an Invoice by e-mail, then put this e-mail printed as a
PDF?
But you can make an invoice "manually" as long as it's as legal as
possible.
|
I guess what I'm really asking is would the (at least 2 copies of) the commercial
invoices generated by the carrier be enough, or do I also need to put a printout
order confirmation from BL in too? Or if not required, is it advisable?
| |
| | One other aspect that seems unclear - as an occasional trader on Bricklink, I
always viewed myself as a private individual buying and selling sets to support
my hobby, and not as a "commercial exporter".
|
Occasional status?
That doesn't exist.
|
So you're saying that in the eyes of the powers that be, that having a Bricklink
store page and even selling just one set abroad makes me a "commercial exporter"?
I guess in a very strict & singular definition, that is true. But to use a football
analogy, I am very much an amateur, not a professional in this - as are many.
| |
Either you make a GIFT, unsollicitated (otherwise it's not a gift), and you
and the recipient can prove it, or it's a taxable shipment.
|
I am aware and understand this. This has not changed since I first opened my
store page 20 odd years ago. It's the details, process and proliferation
of acronyms and jargon that has become way more complicated.
| |
| | Q5. I'm not VAT registered, I fall way below that threshold, but what about
EORI registration? I have never heard of this before but everything I'm reading
suggests it's necessary - but I'm not a commercial export business????
|
Again, you've to manage all this, or not have a shop, or not to export.
|
Thanks, but this doesn't answer my question. Does everyone on BL need EORI
registration? If so, why is it so hard to find clear guidance on it? This feels
akin to an occasional garage seller needing to buy a market trading license.
| |
All in all, LEGO Sets are mainly originated from Denmark, you fill the forms
and sign yourself of course, not the buyer.
|
You say 'of course' but the wording is 'for and on behalf of the
above named customer' which in my business implies someone representing the
customer's own organisation, or their Agent (which they could do when approached
to cover their tax and duty liabilities) - and not the seller (the customs form
has a different box clearly asking for that).
Except for the ones that were made in factories in other countries! (But does
that even matter - if the originating company is based in Denmark, then is that
the overriding factor?) Either way, what is meant by "originating country"
in this context? Denmark, as that's where the set was manufactured, or the
UK, where this particular trade and shipment originates? I have read conflicting
advice on this, and several of my other queries, which is why I'm asking
for guidance.
I think so, but there's a lot to understand.
Can you clarify what is the purpose of the blank space within the 'preferential
origin' declaration I quoted? It seems that this declaration is effectively
a waiver, or substitute for the need to provide a formal 'Statement of Origin',
that should avoid the need for detailed investigations at the other end? And
it appears, that I do not need to write anything into that blank space, it is
OK as is? Have I understood this correctly?
Thanks again.
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | Author: | 1001bricks | | Posted: | Apr 24, 2023 21:46 | | Subject: | Re: Customs Forms etc - UK to EU low volume sales | | Viewed: | 55 times | | Topic: | Taxes | |
|
| [snip]
| | OK, that is clear. I guess fundamentally it just seems morally wrong to me for
any nation to charge VAT on sales of second hand items*, but that is a whole
separate discussion! Duty of course, is another matter, and I've no issue
there. *Imagine if people had to charge VAT at car boot sales or garage sales
|
That's your vision of fair taxes.
It may be the same, or not, of your Gov, but who cares here for shipping a parcel?
| | | | But 2 or 4 copies doesn't really matter, at least 2 copies of the invoice.
|
OK. Do you know where I'd find a reference confirming this?
|
65000 orders shipped?
| | I probably mis-spoke there, but I was picking up on another answer in another
thread. I think probably they meant just a print of the order confirmation which
shows any shipping, taxes or duty paid or not paid etc.
|
No.
INVOICE is NOT order.
I'm almost sure you can print an order as an "amateur" (sorry), but
both aren't the same.
| | So you're saying that in the eyes of the powers that be, that having a Bricklink
store page and even selling just one set abroad makes me a "commercial exporter"?
|
No.
There is no commercial exporter/personnal exporter (to simplify).
You're a grand'ma sending a gift, you go to the post office, they'll
help you to fill the gift thing.
Otherwise, you're a _exporter_, dot.
| | Thanks, but this doesn't answer my question. Does everyone on BL need EORI
registration?
|
You should read your local pages and understand them, or ask local advise,
like postal, IRS, Customs, Gov website, etc.
| | You say 'of course' but the wording is 'for and on behalf of the
above named customer' which in my business implies someone representing the
customer's own organisation, or their Agent (which they could do when approached
to cover their tax and duty liabilities) - and not the seller (the customs form
has a different box clearly asking for that).
|
?
[snip]
?
Take your Set, package it nicely (not in a recycled shoe box!), put a CN22, put
150 GBP value (or whatever it is *really*), put 2 or 3 or 1000 copies of the
Invoice (like the BrickLink invoice email - NOT the order) in a transparent Customs
pocket outside the box, date, sign, and that's it.
Pfew!
Don't over complicate things, but on the other side read and get the info
by yourself.
People selling here have read 100s or 1000s of pages to start to understand.
Frankly you can't expect a 20 lines answer in your specific case, sorry.
PS: but I agree, it was easier before.
|
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| | | | | |
| | | | | Author: | SylvainLS | | Posted: | Apr 23, 2023 19:28 | | Subject: | Re: Customs Forms etc - UK to EU low volume sales | | Viewed: | 60 times | | Topic: | Taxes | |
|
| Disclaimer: not a BrickLink employee, not a Customs agent, not a lawyer, not
a plumber, maybe a cat….
In Taxes, christor writes:
| | […]
Q1. Since the set is worth over £135 GBP, I gather BL doesn't automatically
add the taxes on during the sale, instead, duties and VAT are charged to the
recipient upon arrival - correct?
|
Yes (except the limit is the equivalent of €150 in DKK, which was about £135
in 2016-2018 when the EU directive & UK law were written).
| | Q2. Is the sales tax and duty status all the same, whether the set being sold
is new or used?
|
(Just for info, “import VAT,“ not “sales tax” (they don’t work the same way).)
Duties and VAT are two different things. Duties apply only on the product (not
shipping). VAT applies to everything, including duties (haha).
Duties are about 2-5% and start being levied at, surprise, surprise, €150.
That’s why BL only collects under €150: above, there’s duty and VAT on the duty,
and that, BL can’t work it out and can’t collect & remitt (contrarily to VAT).
So it has to be done at reception.
There’s a 2.5% flat rate that the buyer/importer can apply below €700. I’m not
sure the postal services apply it. (I think the rate for toys is around 2.3%
anyway.)
New or Used, or even commercial or not doesn’t matter (gifts are taxed!).
| | So I have figured out through various sources, that you have to include in a
clear plastic envelope stuck to the outside, all of the copies of all of the
forms (1 despatch note, 2 customs declarations, and 4(!) copies of the "commercial
invoice" generated by Parcelforce) - although I gather I should also include
a copy of the invoice from BL too - even though there's no tax or duty already
paid that needs evidencing (assume for a shipment under the £135 threshold that
this is all more relevant?)
|
Er, you only get the special BL invoice and BL IOSS number when BL collected
something.
Or are you talking about _your_ invoice, with the items and their values?
| | Q3. Is the above correct?
One other aspect that seems unclear - as an occasional trader on Bricklink, I
always viewed myself as a private individual buying and selling sets to support
my hobby, and not as a "commercial exporter".
Q4. Is this still correct in a legal sense, or does even the slightest activity
peg me with that label and the obligations that go with it?
|
See it from the point of view of the country where you’re sending your stuff:
1. They don’t know you.
2. Maybe you aren’t considered a professional in your country, but would you
be in theirs?
(Unfair competition.)
3. Anyway, you’re sending things in their country and money is going out of their
country. They don’t like that.
| | Q5. I'm not VAT registered, I fall way below that threshold, but what about
EORI registration? I have never heard of this before but everything I'm reading
suggests it's necessary - but I'm not a commercial export business????
|
You’re working through postal/courrier services. _They_ interact with Customs
and so _they_ have an EORI.
| | So now I come to filling out those forms. First the customs declarations:
So HS tariff codes are all new to me too, it seems these are a requirement now,
and I have found what seems to be the right code - 9503003500.
|
For a set, yes.
Seems like you’re filling the long/complete CN-23. A CN-22 may be enough (I
think the threshold to use it is around €270).
Anyway, first, you’re the one who sends the package abroad, so _you_ sign it.
Second, the postal/courrier should help you fill it, they are the ones who talk
to both UK and DK Customs.
|
|
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| | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | Author: | christor | | Posted: | Apr 24, 2023 20:25 | | Subject: | Re: Customs Forms etc - UK to EU low volume sales | | Viewed: | 33 times | | Topic: | Taxes | |
|
| In Taxes, SylvainLS writes:
| | Disclaimer: not a BrickLink employee, not a Customs agent, not a lawyer, not
a plumber, maybe a cat….
|
Understood!
| | In Taxes, christor writes:
| | […]
Q1. Since the set is worth over £135 GBP, I gather BL doesn't automatically
add the taxes on during the sale, instead, duties and VAT are charged to the
recipient upon arrival - correct?
|
Yes (except the limit is the equivalent of €150 in DKK, which was about £135
in 2016-2018 when the EU directive & UK law were written).
|
OK, that makes sense. Presumably, the limit remains €150 but is subject to currency
fluctuations over time?
| |
| | Q2. Is the sales tax and duty status all the same, whether the set being sold
is new or used?
|
(Just for info, “import VAT,“ not “sales tax” (they don’t work the same way).)
|
I guess I just used 'sales tax' as that is the more common parlance for
VAT in North America and some other places, in my experience - as well as just
being a generic description.
| | Duties and VAT are two different things. Duties apply only on the product (not
shipping). VAT applies to everything, including duties (haha).
|
Indeed, and understood - and ha! Tax gets its claws into everything ...
| |
Duties are about 2-5% and start being levied at, surprise, surprise, €150.
That’s why BL only collects under €150: above, there’s duty and VAT on the duty,
and that, BL can’t work it out and can’t collect & remitt (contrarily to VAT).
So it has to be done at reception.
|
Understood and thanks for the added details.
| | There’s a 2.5% flat rate that the buyer/importer can apply below €700. I’m not
sure the postal services apply it. (I think the rate for toys is around 2.3%
anyway.)
New or Used, or even commercial or not doesn’t matter (gifts are taxed!).
|
I refer you to my comment above about claws! (and to my comment in my other reply
about VAT on second hand sales .. grrr)
| |
| | So I have figured out through various sources, that you have to include in a
clear plastic envelope stuck to the outside, all of the copies of all of the
forms (1 despatch note, 2 customs declarations, and 4(!) copies of the "commercial
invoice" generated by Parcelforce) - although I gather I should also include
a copy of the invoice from BL too - even though there's no tax or duty already
paid that needs evidencing (assume for a shipment under the £135 threshold that
this is all more relevant?)
|
Er, you only get the special BL invoice and BL IOSS number when BL collected
something.
|
Ah, that makes sense.
| | Or are you talking about _your_ invoice, with the items and their values?
|
I guess so - it was really picking up on a comment in another thread that mentioned
they put a copy of their BL order confirmation printout (at least I think that's
what they meant) inside, and attached to the package for inspection.
| |
| | Q3. Is the above correct?
One other aspect that seems unclear - as an occasional trader on Bricklink, I
always viewed myself as a private individual buying and selling sets to support
my hobby, and not as a "commercial exporter".
Q4. Is this still correct in a legal sense, or does even the slightest activity
peg me with that label and the obligations that go with it?
|
See it from the point of view of the country where you’re sending your stuff:
1. They don’t know you.
2. Maybe you aren’t considered a professional in your country, but would you
be in theirs?
(Unfair competition.)
3. Anyway, you’re sending things in their country and money is going out of their
country. They don’t like that.
|
I guess it's what I'm asking - how do EU countries view micro scale traders
on a webpage like Bricklink - in this day and age? In the past, it was just a
case of paying for shipping, filling out some very simple forms stating the nature
and value of the goods, and then the rest would just be handled by customs upon
entry to the receiving country.
| |
| | Q5. I'm not VAT registered, I fall way below that threshold, but what about
EORI registration? I have never heard of this before but everything I'm reading
suggests it's necessary - but I'm not a commercial export business????
|
You’re working through postal/courrier services. _They_ interact with Customs
and so _they_ have an EORI.
|
OK, that makes some sense. So I don't need to worry about that?
| |
| | So now I come to filling out those forms. First the customs declarations:
So HS tariff codes are all new to me too, it seems these are a requirement now,
and I have found what seems to be the right code - 9503003500.
|
For a set, yes.
|
OK, great.
| |
Seems like you’re filling the long/complete CN-23. A CN-22 may be enough (I
think the threshold to use it is around €270).
|
One of the forms is CN-23, yes. It was given to me as part of the documents package
to download from the shipping company and is mostly pre-filled based on the questions
it asked me while ordering shipping.
| |
Anyway, first, you’re the one who sends the package abroad, so _you_ sign it.
Second, the postal/courrier should help you fill it, they are the ones who talk
to both UK and DK Customs.
|
Yes, I have signed the CN-23 (2 joined copies). It's the copy commercial
invoices that the shipping company generated that appear curious - the signature
box on those asks for the signature "for and on behalf of the above named
customer" - which surely means the purchaser or their representative? Unless
it expects me, the seller, to sign it on their behalf? It seems to me to be a
form that the recipient signs upon receipt when contacted regarding VAT and duty
to pay? But there's an absence of guidance notes to explain this.
I guess I will just ask these remaining questions when I take the package to
the post office counter to drop it off?
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | Author: | SylvainLS | | Posted: | Apr 25, 2023 10:21 | | Subject: | Re: Customs Forms etc - UK to EU low volume sales | | Viewed: | 30 times | | Topic: | Taxes | |
|
| In Taxes, christor writes:
| | […]
OK, that makes sense. Presumably, the limit remains €150 but is subject to currency
fluctuations over time?
|
Not exactly. It was €150 and the local currencies equivalents at the time of
writing the directive and implementing it into local laws. It doesn’t change
over time (unless the directive is amended).
AFAIK, there’s not much fluctuation between local EU currencies and Euro anyway.
| | […]
I guess I will just ask these remaining questions when I take the package to
the post office counter to drop it off?
|
Yes. I think they gave you too many forms.
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United Kingdom, England
France, Provence-Alpes-Côte d'Azur
