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| | | Author: | StarBrick  | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 15:18 | | Subject: | ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 234 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| And in the second part of the message:
If you do not believe this applies to you at the moment, starting from Jan
2023 we will begin requesting more information when applying for new stores.
And further down the line, we will be requesting more information for all current
stores.
What more information is BL going to request?
What is this.... BL sellers are either commercially registered sellers (then
I get this move) or private natural persona like selling in yard sale. In
a private yard sale there are no legislations regarding businesses. As far as
I am aware.
Are we going to see company-sellers only here on BL?
|
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| | | | | Author: | Stuart9 | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 15:23 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 89 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| If it’s future is registered companies only then that would surely decimate the
number of sellers here.
We’ll have to wait and see.
In General, StarBrick writes:
| | And in the second part of the message:
If you do not believe this applies to you at the moment, starting from Jan
2023 we will begin requesting more information when applying for new stores.
And further down the line, we will be requesting more information for all current
stores.
What more information is BL going to request?
What is this.... BL sellers are either commercially registered sellers (then
I get this move) or private natural persona like selling in yard sale. In
a private yard sale there are no legislations regarding businesses. As far as
I am aware.
Are we going to see company-sellers only here on BL?
|
|
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| | | | | |
| | | | | Author: | 1001bricks | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 15:27 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 106 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| In General, StarBrick writes:
| | And in the second part of the message:
|
Which one? Can you send me a copy? Don't receive their announcements 
|
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| | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | Author: | Fenneke_Jose | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 15:30 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 136 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| In General, 1001bricks writes:
| | In General, StarBrick writes:
| | And in the second part of the message:
|
Which one? Can you send me a copy? Don't receive their announcements
|
This is the full message:
Account cleanup before January 1, 2023
Since EU distance selling has been implemented, we are seeing many new duplicate
accounts and accounts with inaccurate information.
This is why we are requesting that you
1. Double check if the following information is correct and up to date:
• Buyer name;
• Buyer address;
• Store name;
• Store address.
2. Unregister duplicate accounts created with no prior permission from the
administration.
Refer to our Terms of Service for duplicate account policy:
" You are limited to one (1) account on this Site unless we have granted you
permission to have additional accounts, such permission being in our sole discretion.
You may access the Site with your account credentials. You may not transfer or
sell your account or account credentials to another party. "
Reasons for permission to have another account from the administration may include
short-term travel, store settings testing, etc.
Please make sure to make necessary changes and get rid of any duplicate accounts
before January 1, 2023.
Use your store management page to make changes.
Use this page to unregister duplicate accounts if any (you have to be logged
into the account you are unregistering).
If you do not believe this applies to you at the moment, starting from Jan 2023
we will begin requesting more information when applying for new stores. And further
down the line, we will be requesting more information for all current stores.
We appreciate your cooperation.
Thank you.
BrickLink Team
|
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | 1001bricks | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 15:38 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 93 times | | Topic: | General | |
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| Thanks!
| | 2. Unregister duplicate accounts created with no prior permission from the
administration.
|
I asked and did receive authorization from Dan at this time; I should still have
the e-mail.
I mainly use it to test our Shipping Methods. With 100+ of them, there's
no way I could be sure of what we do without testing with another account.
Sylvain
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | Author: | 1001bricks | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 15:45 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 99 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| | | If you do not believe this applies to you at the moment, starting from Jan 2023 [...]
|
BTW
I don't know you, but I've bad feelings for 2023.
Climate, gas, energy, war, inflation, more taxes and rules, the web being less
and less open and free... I don't like what's to come, soon
|
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Stuart9 | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 15:48 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 88 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| Not on your own there.
In General, 1001bricks writes:
| | | | If you do not believe this applies to you at the moment, starting from Jan 2023 [...]
|
BTW
I don't know you, but I've bad feelings for 2023.
Climate, gas, energy, war, inflation, more taxes and rules, the web being less
and less open and free... I don't like what's to come, soon
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | UTLF | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 17:26 | | Subject: | (Cancelled) | | Viewed: | 69 times | | Topic: | General | |
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| | (Cancelled) |
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | 1001bricks | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 17:39 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 55 times | | Topic: | General | |
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| | | only difference is we're more technologically advanced
|
You mean, you've got implants?
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | UTLF | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 18:11 | | Subject: | (Cancelled) | | Viewed: | 50 times | | Topic: | General | |
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| | (Cancelled) |
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | 1001bricks | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 18:30 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 54 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| In General, 1P writes:
| | | | You mean, you've got implants?
|
Yes, but if you wanted to see them we would have to visit another website
|
What a coincidence, I'm also a fan of brickhub!
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | TheCuteGiraffe | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 18:32 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 57 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| ........
mmmm??!?
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | SylvainLS | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 17:41 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 66 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| In General, 1P writes:
| | | | I don't like what's to come, soon
|
Soon? It's been happening for the past 6,000 years
|
Indeed, the oldest written materials we have is all about “Where’s the world
going to? It was better before!”
But it undoubtedly was not new at the time (they invented writing, not language).
| | - only difference is we're more technologically advanced
|
We think 
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | TheCuteGiraffe | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 18:30 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 42 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| And as sad as this is, much like Stuart I agree. really its a bit dissapointing
but only inevitable, and as a famous person once said, "why dread the inevitable,
theres nothing you can do to stop it"......
The Cute Giraffe (in worry and a bit in fear)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | Author: | yorbrick | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 16:10 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 106 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| In General, Fenneke_Jose writes:
| | In General, 1001bricks writes:
| | In General, StarBrick writes:
| | And in the second part of the message:
|
Which one? Can you send me a copy? Don't receive their announcements
|
This is the full message:
Account cleanup before January 1, 2023
Since EU distance selling has been implemented, we are seeing many new duplicate
accounts and accounts with inaccurate information.
This is why we are requesting that you
1. Double check if the following information is correct and up to date:
• Buyer name;
• Buyer address;
• Store name;
• Store address.
2. Unregister duplicate accounts created with no prior permission from the
administration.
Refer to our Terms of Service for duplicate account policy:
" You are limited to one (1) account on this Site unless we have granted you
permission to have additional accounts, such permission being in our sole discretion.
You may access the Site with your account credentials. You may not transfer or
sell your account or account credentials to another party. "
Reasons for permission to have another account from the administration may include
short-term travel, store settings testing, etc.
Please make sure to make necessary changes and get rid of any duplicate accounts
before January 1, 2023.
Use your store management page to make changes.
Use this page to unregister duplicate accounts if any (you have to be logged
into the account you are unregistering).
If you do not believe this applies to you at the moment, starting from Jan 2023
we will begin requesting more information when applying for new stores. And further
down the line, we will be requesting more information for all current stores.
We appreciate your cooperation.
Thank you.
BrickLink Team
|
So is this EU sellers only, with naughty ones registering multiple accounts to
get around VAT collection limits?
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | peregrinator | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 16:23 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 76 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| In General, yorbrick writes:
| | So is this EU sellers only, with naughty ones registering multiple accounts to
get around VAT collection limits?
|
It definitely sounds like that.
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | StarBrick | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 16:28 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 76 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| In General, yorbrick writes:
| |
So is this EU sellers only, with naughty ones registering multiple accounts to
get around VAT collection limits?
|
Might be, but as I do not have multiple accounts, no.1 applies only for me.
I am worried what's in the last paragraph regarding changes to come.
Unclear what that will be makes migrating elsewhere a serious option now.
Lego takes a wrong turn if it turns out to BL is going to be a businesses-only
platform in or after 2023.....
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | jonwil | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 16:41 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 87 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| | | So is this EU sellers only, with naughty ones registering multiple accounts to
get around VAT collection limits?
|
I don't get why they need such complicated rules for VAT (i.e. the "if you
sell more than x through a marketplace, you need to do special stuff" rule).
If BrickLink (or any other marketplace) is properly collecting and remitting
VAT for every sale a seller makes, why should it matter if that seller has sold
€50 worth of stuff or €50,000,000 worth of stuff?
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | wildchicken13 | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 17:10 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 74 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| In General, jonwil writes:
| | I don't get why they need such complicated rules for VAT (i.e. the "if you
sell more than x through a marketplace, you need to do special stuff" rule).
If BrickLink (or any other marketplace) is properly collecting and remitting
VAT for every sale a seller makes, why should it matter if that seller has sold
€50 worth of stuff or €50,000,000 worth of stuff?
|
If a seller makes €50 then it's not really worth making them do a lot of
tax paperwork. If they make €50,000,000 then it may be worth the time.
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | yorbrick | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 17:15 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 69 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| In General, jonwil writes:
| | | | So is this EU sellers only, with naughty ones registering multiple accounts to
get around VAT collection limits?
|
I don't get why they need such complicated rules for VAT (i.e. the "if you
sell more than x through a marketplace, you need to do special stuff" rule).
If BrickLink (or any other marketplace) is properly collecting and remitting
VAT for every sale a seller makes, why should it matter if that seller has sold
€50 worth of stuff or €50,000,000 worth of stuff?
|
It is so you cannot effectively run a business in a market such as Denmark with
higher VAT from a nearby country such as Germany with lower VAT, paying the lower
rate to Germany because you are located there. Otherwise companies relocate to
low VAT countries yet still serve the original customers.
Plus government, EU, etc bureaucrats love complicated rules, no matter which
country or trading block they work for!
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | SylvainLS | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 17:26 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 81 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| In General, jonwil writes:
| | […]
I don't get why they need such complicated rules for VAT (i.e. the "if you
sell more than x through a marketplace, you need to do special stuff" rule).
|
The rules are not complicated… they are just badly explained and badly understood.
(Sometimes in bad faith: who doesn’t like to bash taxes and red tape?)
| | If BrickLink (or any other marketplace) is properly collecting and remitting
VAT for every sale a seller makes, why should it matter if that seller has sold
€50 worth of stuff or €50,000,000 worth of stuff?
|
BL does NOT collect VAT on ANY sales a EU seller makes inside EU.
Once again, BL only has to¹ collect and only collects those taxes:
— From EU buyers who buy from out of EU for less than €150.
— From UK buyers who buy from out of UK for less than £135.
— From US buyers who reside in one of the US states with sales tax and a marketplace
law (= most of them).
(¹Well, there’s Canada and Norway and South Africa and… who are knocking at the
door….)
For BL, the €10,000 limit is not about collecting/remitting, it’s about ensuring
the sellers abide by the law and do collect VAT.
(Longer explanation for the €10,000 limit. You can skip it and only retain the
above.
Every country (EU or not) has a threshold under which a seller is not obligated
to register as a business and/or collect VAT. Let’s call this the LMRT local
mandatory registration threshold.
In EU, that LMRT can go from a few thousands Euros to €100,000 (no typo).
Now, the EU is a common market. That means there’s no borders for people and
money and trade. That meant (past tense), that if you were a seller in EU, you
had to check the LMRT for each and every EU country you sold to and you had to
register in them one by one.
The new law is just a simplification of that:
— There’s now a global threshold for non-domestic sales, €10,000, so you only
to check your LMRT for domestic sales and the €10,000 one for all the rest of
EU.
— You don’t have to register in each country separetely, there’s a simple, online
One-Shop-Stop (OSS).
There also was the problem that there could be tax competition between EU countries:
locate your business in a low VAT & high LMRT EU country and sell to all EU with
an unfair advantage.
Now, above €10,000, the seller has to use the buyer’s country’s VAT rate (and
it’s correctly and directly declared and remitted to that country).
Plus, there was all the unfair competition from non-EU sellers and their locating
warehouses inside the EU and frauding VAT (they didn’t have to pay it when importing
to warehouses and they “forgot” to account for it when selling or disappeared
when it was time to pay).
IOW: don’t forget EU is not one country but 27.
)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | StarBrick | | Posted: | Nov 24, 2022 02:33 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 63 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| Thanks for starting to explain something that can only be misunderstood if explained
badly.
Circular reasoning here....
"You don’t have to register in each country separetely, there’s a simple, online
One-Shop-Stop (OSS)."
Okay, help me understand that part please.
OSS is for registered business according to the website of the Dutch Tax Office.
Not for private people who do not run a business.
When I sell my used or new-in-box-never-used garden tools in a yard sale to my
neighbour, there is NO business involved, NO tax rules to follow.
Same applies in adds I place in local newspapers for people to buy my 2nd hand
books. NO business, NO tax rules. As long as I stay under LMRT locally and EU-wide.
Is that correct or where is the flaw in that reasoning?
Please help me (and the rest) to understand what to expect to come and what options
one has.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | SylvainLS | | Posted: | Nov 24, 2022 03:53 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 63 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| In General, StarBrick writes:
| | Thanks for starting to explain something that can only be misunderstood if explained
badly.
Circular reasoning here....
|
I made no cause-effect relation between “badly explained” and “badly understood”,
so it can’t be a circular reasoning on my part
I just meant that with a small effort and openness (= no disingenuity) on both
parts (the explainer and the explainee), the rules are not that complicated to
explain and understand.
| | "You don’t have to register in each country separetely, there’s a simple, online
One-Shop-Stop (OSS)."
Okay, help me understand that part please.
OSS is for registered business according to the website of the Dutch Tax Office.
Not for private people who do not run a business.
|
First, my understanding is that it’s a grey area: what you need is a VAT number
to register on the OSS and individuals can have one without incorporating / being
a business.
But then again, as I said multiple times and especially for that very same question:
I’m not a lawyer, I’m not an accountant, I’m not a tax specialist (and I’m not
BrickLink). Don’t take advice from some guy on the Internet and go seek real
advice by a professional, a live one.
Second, the rule is that you need to register to the OSS (or to each country
you sell to) if you are above the €10,000 threshold. If that means that you
have to become a business even if you are under the LMRT of your country of residence,
so what?
See it that way: Would you find it fair if someone in France could sell in NL
for, say, €50k and not be a business because the LMRT in France is €86k, while
you, in NL, have to be a business from €20k?
So, yeah, your LMRT might say you don’t need to be a business while the OSS €10k
rule implies you need to be. The LMRT isn’t the only reason to be or not a business.
| | When I sell my used or new-in-box-never-used garden tools in a yard sale to my
neighbour, there is NO business involved, NO tax rules to follow.
Same applies in adds I place in local newspapers for people to buy my 2nd hand
books. NO business, NO tax rules. As long as I stay under LMRT locally and EU-wide.
Is that correct or where is the flaw in that reasoning?
|
Well, you basically said “there’s no rules provided you follow the rules,” so,
yeah, there’s a flaw in the reasoning 
The other flaw is that the examples you gave:
— don’t all involve distance selling,
— don’t involve a professional marketplace,
— don’t involve international / cross-border sales.
And the rules in question here are exactly about international distance selling
through a marketplace.
So, your examples are like saying “I can go around naked in my bedroom, why does
a fair organizer want to look at me to know if I’m naked on the village fair
ground? It’s outrageous!”
| | Please help me (and the rest) to understand what to expect to come and what options
one has.
|
Once again, I’m not BrickLink and I have no insider information but I read the
e-mail multiple time and can’t find anywhere that says “you’ll have to be a business
to sell on BL!” It just says “we have to start asking you for more info to ensure
you follow the laws (because the laws make us responsible to ensure you also
follow the laws) because some smarty pants are frauding.”
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | peregrinator | | Posted: | Nov 24, 2022 06:52 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 43 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| In General, StarBrick writes:
| | "You don’t have to register in each country separetely, there’s a simple, online
One-Shop-Stop (OSS)."
Okay, help me understand that part please.
OSS is for registered business according to the website of the Dutch Tax Office.
Not for private people who do not run a business.
|
BrickLink is the One-Stop-Shop that is registered in the EU. They are obligated
to enforce the tax rules.
| | When I sell my used or new-in-box-never-used garden tools in a yard sale to my
neighbour, there is NO business involved, NO tax rules to follow.
Same applies in adds I place in local newspapers for people to buy my 2nd hand
books. NO business, NO tax rules. As long as I stay under LMRT locally and EU-wide.
|
The same would be true if you sold Lego out of your garage, but not if you're
selling on a huge internet marketplace.
|
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | SylvainLS | | Posted: | Nov 24, 2022 07:21 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 52 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| In General, peregrinator writes:
| | […]
BrickLink is the One-Stop-Shop that is registered in the EU.
|
Precision: BrickLink is not an OSS, it is registered on the IOSS as a
marketplace (I = international, because BL is not based in EU).
There’s two parts of the whole “OSS” thing:
1. Marketplaces need to collect and remitt Import VAT when a EU buyer buys from
out of EU (for less than €150). So they need to register on the IOSS to declare
and remitt the collected VAT.
(Non-EU sellers who don’t use a marketplace also need to register on the IOSS,
but as a seller. And, of course, that doesn’t concern BL sellers )
2. EU sellers need to collect and remitt intra-EU VAT (not domestic) when they
sell inside EU for more than €10,000. So they need to register on the OSS to
declare and remitt the collected VAT.
| | They are obligated to enforce the tax rules.
|
True.
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | StarBrick | | Posted: | Nov 24, 2022 08:37 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 47 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| In General, SylvainLS writes:
| | In General, peregrinator writes:
| | […]
BrickLink is the One-Stop-Shop that is registered in the EU.
|
Precision: BrickLink is not an OSS, it is registered on the IOSS as a
marketplace (I = international, because BL is not based in EU).
There’s two parts of the whole “OSS” thing:
1. Marketplaces need to collect and remitt Import VAT when a EU buyer buys from
out of EU (for less than €150). So they need to register on the IOSS to declare
and remitt the collected VAT.
(Non-EU sellers who don’t use a marketplace also need to register on the IOSS,
but as a seller. And, of course, that doesn’t concern BL sellers )
2. EU sellers need to collect and remitt intra-EU VAT (not domestic) when they
sell inside EU for more than €10,000. So they need to register on the OSS to
declare and remitt the collected VAT.
| | They are obligated to enforce the tax rules.
|
True.
|
Thanks for this as well.
As I am not BL (1) does not apply to me but to BL (=TLC). I get that. And that
doesn’t require me to give any information or registration obligations. As long
as I as EU seller do not sell outside the EU. Correct?
(2) does only apply when the 10.000 EU-wide is not reached
Correct?
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | SylvainLS | | Posted: | Nov 24, 2022 10:54 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 52 times | | Topic: | General | |
|
| In General, StarBrick writes:
| | […]
Thanks for this as well.
As I am not BL (1) does not apply to me but to BL (=TLC). I get that. And that
doesn’t require me to give any information or registration obligations. As long
as I as EU seller do not sell outside the EU. Correct?
|
Mostly: (1) doesn’t apply to you at all.
IOSS is only for:
— marketplaces,
— or non-EU sellers who sells in EU without going through a marketplace.
And you’re neither 
| | (2) does only apply when the 10.000 EU-wide is not reached
Correct?
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Yes.
But BL still needs to check that you don’t have multiple accounts or that you
are not trying to skirt the law another way.
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| | | | | Author: | BricksOfFaith | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 15:29 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 92 times | | Topic: | General | |
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| In General, StarBrick writes:
| | And in the second part of the message:
If you do not believe this applies to you at the moment, starting from Jan
2023 we will begin requesting more information when applying for new stores.
And further down the line, we will be requesting more information for all current
stores.
What more information is BL going to request?
What is this.... BL sellers are either commercially registered sellers (then
I get this move) or private natural persona like selling in yard sale. In
a private yard sale there are no legislations regarding businesses. As far as
I am aware.
Are we going to see company-sellers only here on BL?
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Can you pm me the full message?
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| | | | | Author: | TheCuteGiraffe | | Posted: | Nov 23, 2022 18:13 | | Subject: | Re: ... more information ? BL commercial-only? | | Viewed: | 55 times | | Topic: | General | |
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| Meaning maybe larger stores could come on here, which would decimate small businesses.
great job lego *clap clap*
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Netherlands, Gelderland
United Kingdom, England
France, Provence-Alpes-Côte d'Azur
Canada, British Columbia
Australia, Victoria
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