BrickLink Discussion Forum

In Suggestions, axaday writes:

[…]

And speaking of numbers, I'm thinking the first step in harmonization would
be to replace the BrickLink color numbers with official LEGO numbers. What do
people think of THAT idea. When we speak to internal folks, they tend to use
the numbers instead of the names, so there is value in those numbers.

Would that move the giant modulex gap out of my color chart?

Well, in a sense it would because LEGO didn’t always give different numbers for
Modulex colours when they were the same as already existing colours (a colour
is a colour, Modulex or not)… but they also used the same numbers for different
colours (e.g. 3 is “normal” Light Yellow AND Modulex Black).

http://www.ryanhowerter.net/colors.php

Does Lego use every number sequentially?

It seems LEGO used numbers sequentially as they were needed but there are unexplained
holes (no 51-79, no 92-99, etc.) and what I think are “never used colours” or
“not used yet colours” (e.g. 361 & 365, missing opal colours?).

Also that doesn’t address the many-to-one, one-to-many, many-to-many relations
between BL and LEGO colours.

And, finally, it would ruin a tonload of files that use BL’s numbering. Wanted
Lists and Inventories that use the BL numbers but also all the compatibility
databases out there.

So I’d say: not a good idea.

Author:

pikachu3

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 15:36

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, axaday writes:

Would that move the giant modulex gap out of my color chart? Does Lego use every
number sequentially?

Yes and, more importantly, no. There are colors that have more than one number
within Lego's system. There are many colors that were given a number but
never actually used in anything other than prototypes. There are numbers which
probably have a color, but we just haven't found a reference to it yet. And
there are many, many numbers which just refer to "Multicombination" (marbled/dual-molded)
parts.

While I do like to use Lego's color numbers, they don't always work 1:1
with BrickLink colors. Some of them (like new and old Dark Pink) have two different
Lego IDs, but are impossible to tell apart IRL. Others (like all the different
coppers) have been consolidated to make things simpler for buyers/sellers, since
the parts they come in don't really have much overlap.

As for Modulex... Lego's IDs for them often overlap with normal Lego colors.
5 Brick Yellow and 5 Mx Buff are both the same tan color. Same with 11 (Mx) Pastel
Blue (maersk blue). Others have no color match, but may have conflicting IDs.

Author:

TBS

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 15:04

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, TBS writes:
Standard Green is actually 'Dark Green' but either way this topic is
not actually about revertng over to Lego colours

Ok, maybe i messed this one up,

It was the red which was the opposite, not the green. Just seen this on a blog.

Lego: Bright Red/ BL: Red .

Here is SOME more silly Lego-Colour-Names:

Sand Yellow/Dark Tan
Warm Gold/Pearl Gold
Bright Bluish Green/Dark Turquoise
Earth Blue/Dark Blue
Flame Yellowish Orange/Bright Light Orange
Bright Orange/Orange
Brick Yellow/Tan

When it comes to User-friendly, one should skip this idea already.

Author:

TBS

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 14:39

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, popsicle writes:

In Suggestions, Admin_Russell writes:

And speaking of numbers, I'm thinking the first step in harmonization would
be to replace the BrickLink color numbers with official LEGO numbers. What do
people think of THAT idea.

I think it's a good idea and logical first step towards harmonization.

To me, this seems and absolute bad idea. Because the LEGO naems are even more
confusing than the BL-Light,Bright,Standard,Dark Varitations.
I´d rather see LEGO adopting the BL-Names, than the other way around.
But doubt they ever will.

And switching to colour codes/numbers only. Oh i don´t know. htis makes it even
worse, especially by dealing for/with noobies.

If i remind correctly, these numbers aren´t even grouped?, correct?
Meaning, you can´t say Blues are 301 to 320 from light to dark...
They are 4 ,16, 51, 86, 325, 478 or so, because of their time/year being brought
in existence.

Could somebody check this ? Admin?

Author:

axaday

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 14:29

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, Admin_Russell writes:

In Suggestions, infinibrix writes:

I hope others will share the same logic in what I’m trying to suggest or perhaps
I’m barking up the wrong tree? Thoughts?

We have considered harmonization of colors in the past, and we continue to do
so. But one thing I will mention is that the word "OLD" is likely not a term
we will include in Item Names or Color Names.

On BrickLink, the color and item name are often concatenated, meaning they are
stuck together for use as a single term. The official color numbers of Modulex
were removed from the color name for this very reason, to keep people from getting
confused.

And speaking of numbers, I'm thinking the first step in harmonization would
be to replace the BrickLink color numbers with official LEGO numbers. What do
people think of THAT idea. When we speak to internal folks, they tend to use
the numbers instead of the names, so there is value in those numbers.

Would that move the giant modulex gap out of my color chart? Does Lego use every
number sequentially?

Author:

TBS

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 14:27

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, infinibrix writes:

In Suggestions, TBS writes:

Don´t change, Bluish, can even be seen in the difference.

Yes, they will have to learn. They gotta learn how BL works as well. No Problem
here?
The Point is, while you wan´t to make it super-easy, my approach is to make it
sillyproof.

When you change LBG to Light grey, and Old light grey we end up where we started,
having gained nothing. There are buyers who don´t see the difference in Here:
Light Grey and Light BLUISH Grey. They order and later complain, because they
didn´t pay Attention in the first place.

This is why i would go the "Light Bluish Grey" and "Old light Grey" route, to
make it even more discernable. If they don´t see the difference in the names
then, they most likely don´t care about the colour as well.

I think this is about trying to make the site as user friendly as possible for ALL newcomers
rather than just keeping things the way they are just because the regulars already
understand these differences?

See above, bullet-proof is more importnant than userfriendly to me. Because you´re
not the one getting send the parts back, refund, repeat all the work with the
order again, for no profit or turnover. Just avoidable work.

Standard Green is actually 'Dark Green' but either way this topic is
not actually about revertng over to Lego colours

Ok, maybe i messed this one up, however, saying earthblue instead of dark blue
makes no sense to me.

No, leave it as is... How is very shorter then pale? There is even Light and
Bright and what not. Very is a good one, and just applies to 2 or 3 Colours.

You don't think 'Pale Grey' is shorter than 'Very Light Bluish
Grey'?

ah, i see. i thought you would name it "pale light bluish grey". which is not
shorter than very.
I would pass here. The are 3 very colours, barely sought after.. useless work.
Also you´ll have to come up with "pale OLD light grey" (22 Parts) and "pale (-bluish,
-NEW) light grey" (50 parts) or so. Since its exactly the 2 light grey´s. That
even more confusing.
For very light orange, you have exactly ONE part, a cat:

https://www.bricklink.com/v2/catalog/catalogitem.page?P=6251px2#T=C&C=96

Renaming those seems useless to me.
I´d rather keep that pale idea in reserve, when some new colours come up again,
which fit neither Light or Bright.

Author:

popsicle

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 14:23

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, Admin_Russell writes:

In Suggestions, infinibrix writes:

I hope others will share the same logic in what I’m trying to suggest or perhaps
I’m barking up the wrong tree? Thoughts?

I think it's a good idea and logical first step towards harmonization.

When we speak to internal folks, they tend to use the numbers instead of the names, so there is value in those numbers.

Author:

Admin_Russell

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 14:13

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, infinibrix writes:

I hope others will share the same logic in what I’m trying to suggest or perhaps
I’m barking up the wrong tree? Thoughts?

Author:

infinibrix

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 13:30

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, TBS writes:

Don´t change, Bluish, can even be seen in the difference.

Yes it may look bluish in comparison to the older greys but if you present those
so called 'bluish greys' to anyone not familiar with Lego colours and
they will likey just describe them as Light Grey and Dark Grey, No? I think this
is about trying to make the site as user friendly as possible for ALL newcomers
rather than just keeping things the way they are just because the regulars already
understand these differences?

LEGO´s Colour names are the ones who are Bullshit.
How does Whatever "Stone" Shades look alike? Which stones they refer to? It is
as stupid as their "Earth Blue or Earth Green". Absolutely unintuitive. The same
that the BL-colour Green is named bright green from LEGO. How is standard Green,
Bright-Green?

Standard Green is actually 'Dark Green' but either way this topic is
not actually about revertng over to Lego colours (already tried that) this is
about using descriptions that better represent the core main colours i.e Dark
Grey makes more sense to me than Dark Bluish Grey?

No, leave it as is... How is very shorter then pale? There is even Light and
Bright and what not. Very is a good one, and just applies to 2 or 3 Colours.

You don't think 'Pale Grey' is shorter than 'Very Light Bluish
Grey'?

Author:

TBS

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 13:09

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, infinibrix writes:

I would also consider using the ‘Old/Classic’ tag for some other discontinued
colours too like Brown i.e ‘Old Brown’

I agree on this one. Renaming that into "OLD+Colour Name" makes sense, and discerns
the differnce between the colours even more.
You have buyers which are to new to be aware of this, and then they say. "That´s
not the correct parts... "

remaining as that is at least what Lego themselves call it but ‘bluish’ is a
made up bricklink term that has little relevance to the actual colour nor does
Lego use the term?

Don´t change, Bluish, can even be seen in the difference.
LEGO´s Colour names are the ones who are Bullshit.
How does Whatever "Stone" Shades look alike? Which stones they refer to? It is
as stupid as their "Earth Blue or Earth Green". Absolutely unintuitive. The same
that the BL-colour Green is named bright green from LEGO. How is standard Green,
Bright-Green?

Also wherever we use the term ‘Very Light’ can I suggest using the term ‘Pale’.
i.e ‘Pale Grey’ instead of ‘Very Light Bluish Grey’ as shorter names are much
easier for people to read off the site and to label/Inventory their stocks even
if that does mean some initial disruption?

No, leave it as is... How is very shorter then pale? There is even Light and
Bright and what not. Very is a good one, and just applies to 2 or 3 Colours.

Lastly shouldn’t we at least try and mirror Lego’s reference to Grey and use
‘Grey’ instead of ‘Gray’ in the descriptions?

As Non-Native English-speaker, is have no opinion on this.

Thoughts?

Delivered.

Author:

Sowhatbricks2.0

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 13:08

Subject:

lower the NPB timeframe

Viewed:

134 times

Topic:

Status:

Open

Vote:

[Yes|No]

Can we lower the NPB time from 7 days to 2 days? Giving buyers almost 2 weeks
before a NPB ticket is completed is to long. If they don't respond to Bricklink
invoices, messages or emails directly in the first 5 days they shouldn't
get another 7 days.

Author:

infinibrix

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 12:49

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, psusaxman2000 writes:

So if we were to rename the existing LG and LBG (in the future), how do you work
the compliment colors for these that were create for a short time of Very Light
Gray and Very Light Bluish Gray? If we are to stay constant, do we then rename
these as well to Very "Classic or Old" Gray?

'Very Light Grey' becomes 'Old Very Light Grey'

'Very Light Bluish Grey' becomes 'Very Light Grey'

But as per my original post I also made the suggestion to replace 'Very Light'
with 'Pale'
so they would be 'Old Pale Grey' and 'Pale Grey'

Colour shades would go from Light to Dark as:-

Pale
Light
Medium (or just the simple colour)
Dark

Author:

maxx3001

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 12:47

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, infinibrix writes:

We can start by calling light gray and dark grey as old light grey and old dark
grey.

Then over 6 months drop the bluish from the new greys and we are done.

Easy,
Maxx

Author:

infinibrix

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 12:39

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, misbi writes:

In Suggestions, infinibrix writes:

At the very least, it would be helpful if BL and TLG names didn't directly
contradict each other. Specifically: Dark Green

Let's start with that one!

Yes that one is a particular bad example though in fairness to BL I think Lego
got that one terribly wrong. To me it is the equivalent of what Lego call 'Bright
Red' and 'Bright Blue' and in truth Lego should have also called
this 'Bright Green' plus if it was'nt for the fact that these became
the main staple core colours maybe bricklink would have kept them with the Bright
tag after all they are much brighter than most of the other shades of blues green
and reds that we have since appeared!

Author:

misbi

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 11:59

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, infinibrix writes:

At the very least, it would be helpful if BL and TLG names didn't directly
contradict each other. Specifically: Dark Green

Let's start with that one!

Author:

psusaxman2000

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 11:23

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

At what interval does something become "old"?

At the point it just becomes inherently obvious that Lego has moved away from
the production of a main shade of a colour in prefernce for a new shade of colour.
Brow along with Light and dark gey I think everyone would consider old colours
that have fallen out of favour by the Lego Group.
It does'nt mean I think an obscure colour that Lego has'nt release for
a few years should also be considered old/discontinued but maybe the use of the
term 'Classic' to get around these concerns? though I prefer to reference
them 'old' myself

Point taken.

I agree with your point that they could easily be a new gray down the road at some point,

To be honest I think any new shade of grey that Lego create will only be to accompany
the exisitng Light/Dark grey rather than to replace them hence why I feel these
greys will remain the current staple greys for many years to come hence whi I
feel they deserve the proper accurate title of Light/Dark grey.

but is the fact that there are two and one is more "bluish" really an issue, or just because it's a longer name?

Author:

garbanzo

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 10:56

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, infinibrix writes:

I hope others will share the same logic in what I’m trying to suggest

You're getting into a real gray area when you start talking color names.
Lots of opinion involved.

Personally, I think "light black" is a good option.

Author:

axaday

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 10:47

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, psusaxman2000 writes:

At what interval does something become "old"?

When it reasonably seems retired. It is one thing that some colors sometimes
drop out of production. After some years Dark Turquoise came back. Purple could,
I think. Violet could.

But Light Gray, Dark Gray, Pink, and Brown were immediately replaced with new
colors intended to act as the same color. They are very unlikely to bring those
colors back.

Author:

infinibrix

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 10:42

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, Teup writes:

And this is exactly why I think we should add "old" or "classic" in front or
the non-reddish/bluish ones as fast as possible.

Then we can always decide later on (when it no longer causes confusion) whether
or not to change "Light bluish gray" to "Light gray".

Yes I think it is still helpful to mark those as old/classic even if no change
it to be made to the newer exisiting colours

Author:

Teup

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 10:38

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

Among the MOST confusing things we could do would be changing the name of a color
to the name that we just took away from another color.

In Suggestions, infinibrix writes:

It will be known to many that I’ve always favoured the idea of using official
Lego colour names not because I like them better or think they describe the
colours better (Many are very odd choices!) but simply because it creates less
uncertainty about what I’m selling and what the customer thinks they are buying
however I’ve made that argument already and now’s probably the time to accept
that Bricklink colour names are unlikely to match that of the Lego group!

However one thing that has always jarred me somewhat is the use of the term ‘Bluish’
to describe the greys when I’m sure if it was’nt for the need to fit around the
older existing greys already in the catalog both would have no doubt just been
given the simple description Dark/Light Grey instead of Dark/Light Bluish Grey?

The thing is the way I see it Bricklink uses its own colour names for three main
reasons:-

A) Lego never provided a colour name for them to use (at least not in the early
days!)

B) They wanted their colour names to better describe and match the actual shade
of colour!

C) They wanted their colour names to be short and to the point!

However when it comes to those last two points colours like ‘Dark Bluish Grey’
and ‘Light Bluish Grey’ both fail to meet that ideal objective compared to most
of the other colour names that have been created by Bricklink. Both descriptions
are lengthy and somewhat misleading? If anything I see more ‘Bluish Grey’ in
a colour like Sand blue than either of these two greys and when all said and
done they are basically just Light and Dark Grey?

So what does it matter and what to do?

Well because they are both what I would call very common CORE central colours
in Legos colour palette it stands to reason that we should perhaps think about
giving them the most suitably descriptive name for them (Light and Dark grey?)
after all that is what any newbie or anyone else for that matter would define
them as?

Both of these colours are ‘very current’ where as the discontinued greys are
not so current and therefore probably don’t warrant the need for the best descriptive
name for them any longer? In fact if we were to rename the existing Light and
Dark Grey as ‘Old Light Grey’ or ‘Classic Light Grey’ I think this would also
be very helpful to newbies when they are confronted with so many different shades
of grey?

I would also consider using the ‘Old/Classic’ tag for some other discontinued
colours too like Brown i.e ‘Old Brown’ I have less problem with Reddish brown
remaining as that is at least what Lego themselves call it but ‘bluish’ is a
made up bricklink term that has little relevance to the actual colour nor does
Lego use the term? Lego may have added more blue to the actual colour mix than
the old greys but in appearance they are simply intended to be a Light and Dark
Grey in a new and current form hence I feel we should refer to them as such?

Also wherever we use the term ‘Very Light’ can I suggest using the term ‘Pale’.
i.e ‘Pale Grey’ instead of ‘Very Light Bluish Grey’ as shorter names are much
easier for people to read off the site and to label/Inventory their stocks even
if that does mean some initial disruption?

Lastly shouldn’t we at least try and mirror Lego’s reference to Grey and use
‘Grey’ instead of ‘Gray’ in the descriptions?

I hope others will share the same logic in what I’m trying to suggest or perhaps
I’m barking up the wrong tree? Thoughts?

Author:

infinibrix

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 10:34

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic:

In Suggestions, psusaxman2000 writes:

In Suggestions, infinibrix writes:

In Suggestions, psusaxman2000 writes:

I understand your point about the names being long or drawn out, but I don't
agree with your point on sand blue.

When it comes to shading though, I've always been of the understand that
it's similar to a compass reading. so sand blue by shading would become Grayish Blue.

Okay by I think your side stepping away from my main point which is not so much
about how Sand Blue is named (I have no problem with the name) but what we call
Light/Dark Bluish grey?
That said I do still see more of both grey and blue in Sand Blue whereas for
the other colours I only really see Light and Dark grey

I remember when I first joined this site looking for the Stone greys I just thought
oh wait they must just be called Light/Dark grey, no wait Blusih grey?? What
the hell?

At what interval does something become "old"?

I agree with your point that they could easily be a new gray down the road at some point,

but is the fact that there are two and one is more "bluish" really an issue, or just because it's a longer name?

I don't think either of them warrant the term Bluish because bluish puts
the idea into someones head that the colour is a bluey grey type colour not disimilar
to how I see sand blue

There are other colors in the palette that have longer names too like Bright
Light Orange or Blue and some of the Trans parts inherently are long. I'm
not saying your point is at all invalid but is it worth the effort is all.

Yes but my thinking is for the CORE colours which I consider both these greys
to be it makes sense to stick to the basics i.e Light Grey, Dark Grey, Blue,
Dark Blue and only then should we feel it necessary to get elaborate with the
colour names. If you give the basis core colours the basic standard names people
will understand these to be the standard core colours within the vast colour
pallete

Author:

popsicle

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 10:32

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

Viewed:

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Topic:

In Suggestions, infinibrix writes:

Though I personally like TLG's more Shakespearean over Webster approach to
naming their color families, the terminology can be ambiguous or simply misleading.
Just to pick a few…

Brick Yellow for Tan

Earth Blue for Dark Blue and Earth Green for Dark Green

And what is “New” Dark Red?

Not exactly helpful descriptors to the casual Lego fan

I go back n'forth on this color terminology question, BL or TLG
https://www.bricklink.com/message.asp?ID=1175620

That is to say, I see both sides. I personally appreciate the more creative
names, while knowing the more descriptive term is the practical choice for the
casual Lego consumer, which is the bulk of Lego users worldwide.

Author:

psusaxman2000

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 10:06

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

Viewed:

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Topic:

In Suggestions, infinibrix writes:

In Suggestions, psusaxman2000 writes:

At what interval does something become "old"? For any individual that is part
of a community, a color palette is easier to remember and while shading is not
usually beneficial, it can make it easier. I agree with your point that they
could easily be a new gray down the road at some point, but is the fact that
there are two and one is more "bluish" really an issue, or just because it's
a longer name?

There are other colors in the palette that have longer names too like Bright
Light Orange or Blue and some of the Trans parts inherently are long. I'm
not saying your point is at all invalid but is it worth the effort is all. (I
hate when my job brain interferes with my hobby brain)

Author:

infinibrix

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 09:56

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

Viewed:

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Topic:

In Suggestions, tpr writes:

In Suggestions, axaday writes:

Among the MOST confusing things we could do would be changing the name of a color
to the name that we just took away from another color.

But it could be possible.
You could change Lt Grey etc to "Classic" or "Old" immediately and you could
give a notice period of when bluish grey would change to the existing Lt Grey
etc - during which time members and new members would get used to the Classic
colours

tpr

+1

Yes making the changes to the Old greys first would be a very good idea even
if that means Bricklink hold off changing bluish grey for quite a few months

At least it would feel like we're moving in the right direction in terms
of names that truly reflect the correct colours....

Author:

infinibrix

Posted:

Feb 16, 2021 09:44

Subject:

Re: Adjusting Colour Names such as Bluish Grey?

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Topic: