| Redisplay Messages: Compact | Brief | All | Full Show Messages: All | Without Replies| Author: | 62Bricks  | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2020 13:16 | | Subject: | Re: Set 75248 Inventory Awareness | | Viewed: | 56 times | | Topic: | Inventories | |
| In Inventories, StormChaser writes:
| | In Inventories, 62Bricks writes:
| | The parts list determines whether a part is extra or not, and not the building instructions.
|
In this recent set, yes:
In this recent set, no:
So there is an inconsistent approach.
Nevertheless, we need the ability to display and use inventories in different
ways based on the needs of the person viewing that inventory. You don't
think so, because you want inventories to be structured in the specific way that
you feel is best for users of the site.
Why not just agree with me that inventories can do more than the system currently
allows and join me in the push for customizable inventories?
|
This feels like a false choice. Of course we would all like to see greater convenience
and functionality, but that does not mean we should allow information and functionality
to be removed now in the hope that someday we'll have a system
that lets us put it back. How about we use the existing functionality,
which will support all the information people want, including the full box contents
as they were packaged as well as the parts that form a "complete" set, and then
when (if) those extra features come along we can talk about how to use them?
Because we have put the cart firmly before the horse, here. There are thousands
of complete set listings right now that do not include all the parts Bricklink
says they should - some of them quite expensive parts. This is not due to any
error or wrongdoing by the sellers. It is purely the result of inventory changes
that have been made to accord with bad policies. I don't hear anybody really
defending that. I'm not surprised, as it seems indefensible.
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| Author: | StormChaser | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2020 12:57 | | Subject: | Re: Set 75248 Inventory Awareness | | Viewed: | 53 times | | Topic: | Inventories | |
| In Inventories, 62Bricks writes:
| | The parts list determines whether a part is extra or not, and not the building instructions.
|
In this recent set, yes:
In this recent set, no:
So there is an inconsistent approach.
Nevertheless, we need the ability to display and use inventories in different
ways based on the needs of the person viewing that inventory. You don't
think so, because you want inventories to be structured in the specific way that
you feel is best for users of the site.
Why not just agree with me that inventories can do more than the system currently
allows and join me in the push for customizable inventories?
|
|
| Author: | 62Bricks | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2020 12:10 | | Subject: | Re: Set 75248 Inventory Awareness | | Viewed: | 44 times | | Topic: | Inventories | |
| In Inventories, Hygrotus writes:
| | In Inventories, 62Bricks writes:
| | Nobody disputes that if three darts came in the
box, three darts should appear somewhere on the inventory page for the set. However
as is demonstrated by the existence of this thread, there are many people who
have come to understand that the regular section represents only the parts included
in the building instructions. For purposes of classifying parts within the inventory,
|
For the record about this set. Instruction clearly shows three darts being used
in build process  (step 101, so this is not an extra part)
|
Yes, the OP is correct, but for the wrong reason. The inventory would still be
"correct" even if the instructions only showed the two darts that can be held
by the model, because there are three darts in the parts list. The parts list
determines whether a part is extra or not, and not the building instructions.
|
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| Author: | Hygrotus | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2020 11:51 | | Subject: | Re: Set 75248 Inventory Awareness | | Viewed: | 44 times | | Topic: | Inventories | |
| In Inventories, 62Bricks writes:
| | Nobody disputes that if three darts came in the
box, three darts should appear somewhere on the inventory page for the set. However
as is demonstrated by the existence of this thread, there are many people who
have come to understand that the regular section represents only the parts included
in the building instructions. For purposes of classifying parts within the inventory,
|
For the record about this set. Instruction clearly shows three darts being used
in build process (step 101, so this is not an extra part)
|
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| Author: | 62Bricks | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2020 11:33 | | Subject: | Re: Set 75248 Inventory Awareness | | Viewed: | 44 times | | Topic: | Inventories | |
| In Inventories, StormChaser writes:
| | In Inventories, 62Bricks writes:
| | Bricklink set inventories are not based on the building instructions at all.
|
That is absolutely false. From BrickLink guidelines for what should be included
in the Regular Items section of an inventory:
"Parts required to build the main model and any secondary models plus
any other parts on the official parts list. In the absence of an official parts
list, the official parts count, the instructions, and/or images on the packaging
are used to determine as closely as possible the contents of this section."
|
| | In Inventories, 62Bricks writes:
| | The printed parts list is the only thing that matters.
|
That is absolutely false. From the Standards for Inventorying a Set section,
which explicitly states that the source of an inventory should be a physical
copy of a set:
|
You have forgotten to boldface plus any other parts on the official parts
list.
Since there will be no parts in the building instructions that are not also on
the parts list, the parts list is all that matters.
| |
"You should have a physical copy of the set you are inventorying to properly
identify the parts and colors. When this is not possible for old or rare sets,
then it is acceptable to use the instructions, set picture, or parts list (sometimes
printed on the box or in the instructions) to complete the inventory."
I hope the following sentence clears the confusion:
BrickLink inventories are based on what actually came in the box or bag.
Parts lists have errors. Set photos have errors. Building instructions have
errors. You like the idea of simple, straightforward, commonsense guidelines,
Don. Well, the sentence in bold text above is as simple and as sensible as you
can possibly get and you should applaud this if you stand behind your principles.
|
As I have pointed out elsewhere, packing a lot of vagueness into a short statement
does not make it more simple. "Based on" is the slippery term, here.
You are playing fast and loose with the definition of "inventory." The discussion
here is not about the complete inventory page, but in what section the parts
appear within that inventory. Nobody disputes that if three darts came in the
box, three darts should appear somewhere on the inventory page for the set. However
as is demonstrated by the existence of this thread, there are many people who
have come to understand that the regular section represents only the parts included
in the building instructions. For purposes of classifying parts within the inventory,
the building instructions do not matter.
| |
I understand and have participated in the debate about how to best represent
what came in the box or bag, but saying that BrickLink bases inventories on the
parts list only and that inventories are not based on the building instructions
at all is spreading misinformation.
|
I disagree. The building instructions are not used to determine whether a part
is in the Extras sections or the Regular section. The parts list is used for
this determination. The building instructions do not matter.
Where the building instructions do matter is in the determination of a
"complete" set. Unfortunately, since the fairly recent romp through the inventories,
Bricklink is no longer a reference point for this information. It is now up to
each individual seller to verify their own complete set listing against the building
instructions. It takes about thirty seconds to amass thousands of listings for
used, complete sets with the remarks that they do not include the "extras." What
sellers almost always mean by "extras" is "the parts listed in the Extras section
of the inventory."
The admins know this, but the official response is, well, you know, it says at
the bottom of the page the inventory is just a guide, so, you know, let's
just pretend that our actions have no consequences and make with the change requests.
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