Redisplay Messages: Compact | Brief | All | Full Show Messages: All | Without Replies| Author: | Tracyd  | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 14:47 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 35 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| In Help, zorbanj writes:
| | Your buyer doesn't seem unreasonable and you handled this transaction poorly.
You got some good advice on this thread from others, I hope you take it into
consideration for the future.
Also, you're going to have alot of trouble if you ship internationally and
refuse to refund shipping for incomplete orders. You might skate by when shipping
is a few dollars but otherwise this is going to keep happening to you.
Lastly, most buyers don't read the TOS.
|
Also, the TOS do not supersede any consumer protection laws that may exist in
either country. If you sell to that country, you agree to their laws. And it's
your responsibility to know them and follow them.
|
 |
| Author: | SezaR | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 14:45 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 21 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| In Help, Gaston.La.Brick writes:
| | For a seller, the order is fulfilled when the buyer receives ALL items ordered.
It's the seller his obligation to make sure the buyer receives the complete
order.
If the seller fails to do so, a simple refund of the missing items is not sufficient
as the buyer needs to put time in searching a new store to purchase from AND
to pay shipping costs again.
The seller can offer:
A) The buyer returns the full order, with a full refund (including original shipping
costs AND including the return shipping costs, since it was a seller's problem).
Seems expensive for the seller, but it's the seller's fault to begin
with.
B) Refund missing items and reasonable part of the original shipping costs. Or
completely. So the buyer isn't forced to pay shipping costs at another store
from his own pocket.
C) Make sure the buyer receives the items. If you (the seller) doens't have
it in stock, you can place the order yourself at another store, and re-ship (or
just choose a dropshipping method).
I know all options will eat (part of) your profit, but it was your error to begin
with. The buyer can't be held accountable for the mistakes a seller made.
So for a seller you can only sigh, take the cost and learn to get better and
order fulfilling to spot missing items.
The solution you offered to simply refund the actual costs of the missing items,
without even reaching out to the buyer first to discuss options, is not a good
one. I usually go for option C) because I find it my obligation as a seller to
make sure I fully fulfill the order without extra work for my customer. All efforts
and costs to rectify a problem, should come from the seller.
I understand BrickLink used to have more of a "kindred spirits" without
a true enforced "buyer-seller relationship with commercial and legal obligations".
But things have evolved over time, as more and more people found their way to
BrickLink. As a result, the commercial and legal obligations become more and
more important, so it's important for sellers to be aware of these obligations
and act correctly to follow these obligations.
Lastly, I don't think it really professional to post this issue here in the
thread and mention the related user. It might even be considered a privacy violation
to do so? I think it is. But in any case, as a seller, stay professional. This
isn't really a professional action.
You might continue by stoplisting my account as well based on the fact you will
probably not like this reply. It's just how I think about this situation
and give you some other point of view you might consider.
|
Well said
+1
I already gave up to share my opinion with this seller. It looks like he thinks
he is 100% right and nobody should object that.
https://www.bricklink.com/message.asp?ID=1460502
|
|
| Author: | Familybuild | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 14:15 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 29 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| You seem to hold on to your ToS very tightly..
A ToS still needs to uphold the law.
Stating in a ToS that shipping cost wont be refunded for example (just a example
have not checked yours) is a wonderfull way to protect yourself to go wet on
shipping on one order.
But if i where to buy from you, and you shipped it towards me in the netherlands.
You also have to work in line with our local laws.
This means i could ask you for a full refund including shipping and any other
fees.
I offcoarse have to send it back retour to the seller ,
But because i have to at one point also receive a refund on the initial shipping
cost,
I would find it reasonable to receice a shipping label upfront.
Send the items back, after processing by the seller i would get the remaining
refund (items+ fees , excl shipping cost that where already refunded)
On this case: honestly im not seeing anything outragous from the buyer,
For my personal store i started to contact buyers when something is not right,
When i packed the order. Asking if they would still receive the order if its
small, or a refund.
The latter when communicated rightly is the 98% choise, when the missing items
are refunded before shipped on agreement; the missing items are also technical
not part of the order any longer, and when done right should not evolve to negative
feedback i think.
And remember, life is 20% what happens , 80% how you react to it.
Best of luck with this
Regards
|
|
| Author: | zorbanj | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 14:03 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 31 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| Your buyer doesn't seem unreasonable and you handled this transaction poorly.
You got some good advice on this thread from others, I hope you take it into
consideration for the future.
Also, you're going to have alot of trouble if you ship internationally and
refuse to refund shipping for incomplete orders. You might skate by when shipping
is a few dollars but otherwise this is going to keep happening to you.
Lastly, most buyers don't read the TOS.
In Help, Shintaku writes:
| | Hello,
I'm here since 2007, it makes 17 happy years on bricklink for me and it's
a site I use daily.
I want to say that I also wrote several LEGO books and dedicated one to the late
Dan Jezek, who in my opinion built this site with an ethical view in his mind.
But there's one thing I always have problems, because now I would really
like to leave a negative feedback and I feel my hands are tied.
This user, you can look within his feedbacks, is at his second attempt to get
money from sellers for factitious reasons. He was passive-aggressive and tried
to extort me money. When I refused only because I know PayPal's TOS, this
user tried to trick me into giving him back all the shipping costs.
The last message he wrote me, as you can see, is something that should NOT be
tolerable on this platform. Though what he says, I have never ever insulted a
bricklink user in my life, I have never told a single lie, and being insulted
this way is something that should never be accepted here.
I believe bricklink should have a "report" button when an user says such
infamous things to another user.
Here we trade bricks, things that should carry happyness and joy.
I just sell stuff to buy more LEGO for myself, I am not a professional, still
I try to act in the most professional way I can.
But users like this and the fact they can pasture here on bricklink because if
I leave him a negative he will retaliate and this is more a damage for me than
for him... it's something that saddens me.
I suggest you to block this user as I did, and forgive me for my rant, I hope
this reaches to the mod team and they can start thinking something about this.
Like, for example, I would be very happy if they prevented such user to leave
me a feedback, so that I can leave a negative with no second thoughts.
Thanks
|
|
|
| Author: | randyf | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 13:58 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 33 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| In Help, Gaston.La.Brick writes:
| | For a seller, the order is fulfilled when the buyer receives ALL items ordered.
It's the seller his obligation to make sure the buyer receives the complete
order.
If the seller fails to do so, a simple refund of the missing items is not sufficient
as the buyer needs to put time in searching a new store to purchase from AND
to pay shipping costs again.
The seller can offer:
A) The buyer returns the full order, with a full refund (including original shipping
costs AND including the return shipping costs, since it was a seller's problem).
Seems expensive for the seller, but it's the seller's fault to begin
with.
B) Refund missing items and reasonable part of the original shipping costs. Or
completely. So the buyer isn't forced to pay shipping costs at another store
from his own pocket.
C) Make sure the buyer receives the items. If you (the seller) doens't have
it in stock, you can place the order yourself at another store, and re-ship (or
just choose a dropshipping method).
I know all options will eat (part of) your profit, but it was your error to begin
with. The buyer can't be held accountable for the mistakes a seller made.
So for a seller you can only sigh, take the cost and learn to get better and
order fulfilling to spot missing items.
The solution you offered to simply refund the actual costs of the missing items,
without even reaching out to the buyer first to discuss options, is not a good
one. I usually go for option C) because I find it my obligation as a seller to
make sure I fully fulfill the order without extra work for my customer. All efforts
and costs to rectify a problem, should come from the seller.
I understand BrickLink used to have more of a "kindred spirits" without
a true enforced "buyer-seller relationship with commercial and legal obligations".
But things have evolved over time, as more and more people found their way to
BrickLink. As a result, the commercial and legal obligations become more and
more important, so it's important for sellers to be aware of these obligations
and act correctly to follow these obligations.
Lastly, I don't think it really professional to post this issue here in the
thread and mention the related user. It might even be considered a privacy violation
to do so? I think it is. But in any case, as a seller, stay professional. This
isn't really a professional action.
You might continue by stoplisting my account as well based on the fact you will
probably not like this reply. It's just how I think about this situation
and give you some other point of view you might consider.
|
Wonderful post. 👍
This is a shining example of how a seller should respond in a situation like
this.
|
|
| Author: | zorbanj | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 13:55 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 33 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| In Help, BrickDeals writes:
| |
Sellers shouldn't be able to leave feedback for buyers.
|
There are two parties to every transaction and each one should be able to leave
feedback.
| | Every other platform, eBay, Amazon, etsy, the owners realized that allowing sellers
to leave feedback is toxic.
|
Do you sell on eBay or Amazon?
|
|
| Author: | PlanetEarthToys | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 12:10 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 41 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| In Help, BrickDeals writes:
| | In Help, Shintaku writes:
| | Hello,
I'm here since 2007, it makes 17 happy years on bricklink for me and it's
a site I use daily.
I want to say that I also wrote several LEGO books and dedicated one to the late
Dan Jezek, who in my opinion built this site with an ethical view in his mind.
But there's one thing I always have problems, because now I would really
like to leave a negative feedback and I feel my hands are tied.
This user, you can look within his feedbacks, is at his second attempt to get
money from sellers for factitious reasons. He was passive-aggressive and tried
to extort me money. When I refused only because I know PayPal's TOS, this
user tried to trick me into giving him back all the shipping costs.
The last message he wrote me, as you can see, is something that should NOT be
tolerable on this platform. Though what he says, I have never ever insulted a
bricklink user in my life, I have never told a single lie, and being insulted
this way is something that should never be accepted here.
I believe bricklink should have a "report" button when an user says such
infamous things to another user.
Here we trade bricks, things that should carry happyness and joy.
I just sell stuff to buy more LEGO for myself, I am not a professional, still
I try to act in the most professional way I can.
But users like this and the fact they can pasture here on bricklink because if
I leave him a negative he will retaliate and this is more a damage for me than
for him... it's something that saddens me.
I suggest you to block this user as I did, and forgive me for my rant, I hope
this reaches to the mod team and they can start thinking something about this.
Like, for example, I would be very happy if they prevented such user to leave
me a feedback, so that I can leave a negative with no second thoughts.
Thanks
|
Sellers shouldn't be able to leave feedback for buyers.
Every other platform, eBay, Amazon, etsy, the owners realized that allowing sellers
to leave feedback is toxic.
The buyer had one job, they paid you. If they didn't because you don't
use instant checkout for some insane reason, file an NPB.
If there are disputes afterward deal with it through Paypal.
Bad sellers hurt the marketplace much more than bad buyers.
I say this with 20 years experience on Bricklink.
|
just imagine the in-real-life brick & mortar storefront conversation scenarios
this would be.....
{popcorn is $1.00..}
but honestly, mutual feedback is good...
my buyers on sites i buy & sell on more frequently can see how i am as both a
buyer & a seller. which creates more trust in the purchase & thus in-turn the
seller (we) can see what type of buyer they are & possibly what they like to
buy & can shoot them a DM if the Seller might have a good deal on something that
the buyer would like.
*example*
you buy a old spaceman lego guy in near mint condition on ebay. $2.00 , awesome
deal.
would you want the seller to see what you like to buy via previous buyer feedback
& dm you to see if you want to buy a shoebox full of similar old figures for
$100...?
|
|
| Author: | Shintaku | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 12:03 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 38 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| | | Sellers shouldn't be able to leave feedback for buyers.
|
Yeah, so that scammers like this guy can prosperate.
Sorry sir, you are totally entitled to have your own opinion, but you don't
understand that bricklink is also a social network (here we have also the picture
collage, the MOC area, and so on).
I personally think, if you compare Bricklink to Ebay, that though you've
been here for 20 years, you don't understand the goal that Dan Jezek created
this for.
|
|
| Author: | Shintaku | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 12:01 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 28 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| In Help, PlanetEarthToys writes:
| | In Help, Shintaku writes:
| | In Help, PlanetEarthToys writes:
| | In Help, peregrinator writes:
| | In Help, Shintaku writes:
| | I don't want to be nitpicky or fussy, but your answer clearly shows that
you have your point of view to enforce over mine and you didn't even read
completely what I wrote.
I have a small shop, and I have lot of parts at the lowest price on the whole
bricklink.
To mantain this bargain for users there are some very simple rules to comply.
One is: if I make an error, and it happens, I just refund the part.
What are TOSs for if you don't read them and if you think that your point
of view is more important than the actual things?
|
What good are terms of service if they're not enforceable? BrickLink definitely
won't enforce your bespoke terms. It's entirely reasonable for a buyer
to ask for a partial shipping refund if there are parts missing from the order.
| | Last but not least, this is not a private conversation since all the bricklink
staff members can read it. So there is no difference into having an undefined
number of staff members reading it, or the whole bricklink forum people reading
it. Still it's a non private communication.
|
Quite wrong - it's a private conversation that can be read by BL staff members,
it is not a public conversation at all. You could maybe make it public in order
to refute the buyer's claims, if those are public; but leaving it here for
all and sundry to see is unprofessional.
|
agreed
OP selected to start the screenshot conversation with this member at the april
29th point ( mid-stream so to speak...) after the member mentioned the OP's
previous messages to them that apparently was unprofessional on the OP's
part & full of insults / lies.
if the OP is going to publicly call out a member like this, the OP should post
the full transcript of the conversation UNEDITED so we can see if what the member
is stating is true.. did the OP act in the manner described.
if the OP doesn't or refuses too... it just kinda shows they are trying to
obfuscate something in order to boost their own stance .
or maybe the user doxed here will kindly post their own sreenshots of this conversation,
so everyone is on the same page.
OP claims they never lie..
let's see
|
That's the last message actually.
Today is 29 April.
There is nothing after that.
|
no, of course not..
if you had screenshoted that last image just a little bit bigger, it would show
the part where you mention there was an on-going conversation that was occuring
between the 25th-29th with the member via private emails & you mention being
open to providing that conversation to bricklink admin's at any time.
but what you have done here is create godzilla, then jump scare to a destroyed
city & are saying "of course godzilla did it, he's godzilla...."
while hiding something that could destroy a city behind a curtain.
i don't care either way, leaving the forum now.. just found it fascinating
to read.
|
Yes, the buyer contacted me via email, I hitted reply and went on replying, and
then all these messages didn't appear on bricklink and I wasn't aware
of that.
Here, is where that person tried to extort me money.
BTW, it's fascinating, I agree with you.
I come here to warn about a user, who out of 25 orders did this trick twice (which
is a HUGE percentage) and who has a very short BL history.
Instead I, who even dedicated a book to the memory of Dan Jezek, who am here
since 2007, who have 3500+ feedbacks with just some spots mainly in the first
years here... I am the one who gets all the blames and all the suspicions.
This is simply hilarious from my POV. Even if I was suspicious about someone,
their feedback history should have tell me a clue about what's happening.
However, in a world in which people are against vaccines and people are cretided
to believe the Earth is flat... this is just what I should have expected to read.
|
|
| Author: | BrickDeals | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 11:56 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 32 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| In Help, Shintaku writes:
| | Hello,
I'm here since 2007, it makes 17 happy years on bricklink for me and it's
a site I use daily.
I want to say that I also wrote several LEGO books and dedicated one to the late
Dan Jezek, who in my opinion built this site with an ethical view in his mind.
But there's one thing I always have problems, because now I would really
like to leave a negative feedback and I feel my hands are tied.
This user, you can look within his feedbacks, is at his second attempt to get
money from sellers for factitious reasons. He was passive-aggressive and tried
to extort me money. When I refused only because I know PayPal's TOS, this
user tried to trick me into giving him back all the shipping costs.
The last message he wrote me, as you can see, is something that should NOT be
tolerable on this platform. Though what he says, I have never ever insulted a
bricklink user in my life, I have never told a single lie, and being insulted
this way is something that should never be accepted here.
I believe bricklink should have a "report" button when an user says such
infamous things to another user.
Here we trade bricks, things that should carry happyness and joy.
I just sell stuff to buy more LEGO for myself, I am not a professional, still
I try to act in the most professional way I can.
But users like this and the fact they can pasture here on bricklink because if
I leave him a negative he will retaliate and this is more a damage for me than
for him... it's something that saddens me.
I suggest you to block this user as I did, and forgive me for my rant, I hope
this reaches to the mod team and they can start thinking something about this.
Like, for example, I would be very happy if they prevented such user to leave
me a feedback, so that I can leave a negative with no second thoughts.
Thanks
|
Sellers shouldn't be able to leave feedback for buyers.
Every other platform, eBay, Amazon, etsy, the owners realized that allowing sellers
to leave feedback is toxic.
The buyer had one job, they paid you. If they didn't because you don't
use instant checkout for some insane reason, file an NPB.
If there are disputes afterward deal with it through Paypal.
Bad sellers hurt the marketplace much more than bad buyers.
I say this with 20 years experience on Bricklink.
|
|
| Author: | Shintaku | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 11:56 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 22 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| In Help, Shintaku writes:
| | In Help, TheBrickGuys writes:
| | Isn't this kind of a double standard? You left negative feedbacks as a customer
for not getting back shipping cost when parts were missing.
|
Did you read that in my case the seller didn't want to refund anything and
I had to make a paypal claim on it?
|
Adding, I ordered 4 minifigures and I only got 2.
18€ worth of minifigure and only got 6€?
This is where you can apply a shipping refund.
I asked exactly the same I offered here: a partial refund proportional to the
value of the missing bricks.
I really fail to understand why people like to blame me for acting right and
coherent and fail during it.
If I was a hypocritical, I would never have posted this... your argument makes
no sense at all.
|
|
| Author: | PlanetEarthToys | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 11:55 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 28 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| In Help, Shintaku writes:
| | In Help, PlanetEarthToys writes:
| | In Help, peregrinator writes:
| | In Help, Shintaku writes:
| | I don't want to be nitpicky or fussy, but your answer clearly shows that
you have your point of view to enforce over mine and you didn't even read
completely what I wrote.
I have a small shop, and I have lot of parts at the lowest price on the whole
bricklink.
To mantain this bargain for users there are some very simple rules to comply.
One is: if I make an error, and it happens, I just refund the part.
What are TOSs for if you don't read them and if you think that your point
of view is more important than the actual things?
|
What good are terms of service if they're not enforceable? BrickLink definitely
won't enforce your bespoke terms. It's entirely reasonable for a buyer
to ask for a partial shipping refund if there are parts missing from the order.
| | Last but not least, this is not a private conversation since all the bricklink
staff members can read it. So there is no difference into having an undefined
number of staff members reading it, or the whole bricklink forum people reading
it. Still it's a non private communication.
|
Quite wrong - it's a private conversation that can be read by BL staff members,
it is not a public conversation at all. You could maybe make it public in order
to refute the buyer's claims, if those are public; but leaving it here for
all and sundry to see is unprofessional.
|
agreed
OP selected to start the screenshot conversation with this member at the april
29th point ( mid-stream so to speak...) after the member mentioned the OP's
previous messages to them that apparently was unprofessional on the OP's
part & full of insults / lies.
if the OP is going to publicly call out a member like this, the OP should post
the full transcript of the conversation UNEDITED so we can see if what the member
is stating is true.. did the OP act in the manner described.
if the OP doesn't or refuses too... it just kinda shows they are trying to
obfuscate something in order to boost their own stance .
or maybe the user doxed here will kindly post their own sreenshots of this conversation,
so everyone is on the same page.
OP claims they never lie..
let's see
|
That's the last message actually.
Today is 29 April.
There is nothing after that.
|
no, of course not..
if you had screenshoted that last image just a little bit bigger, it would show
the part where you mention there was an on-going conversation that was occuring
between the 25th-29th with the member via private emails & you mention being
open to providing that conversation to bricklink admin's at any time.
but what you have done here is create godzilla, then jump scare to a destroyed
city & are saying "of course godzilla did it, he's godzilla...."
while hiding something that could destroy a city behind a curtain.
i don't care either way, leaving the forum now.. just found it fascinating
to read.
|
|
| Author: | Shintaku | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 11:44 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 31 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| In Help, PlanetEarthToys writes:
| | In Help, peregrinator writes:
| | In Help, Shintaku writes:
| | I don't want to be nitpicky or fussy, but your answer clearly shows that
you have your point of view to enforce over mine and you didn't even read
completely what I wrote.
I have a small shop, and I have lot of parts at the lowest price on the whole
bricklink.
To mantain this bargain for users there are some very simple rules to comply.
One is: if I make an error, and it happens, I just refund the part.
What are TOSs for if you don't read them and if you think that your point
of view is more important than the actual things?
|
What good are terms of service if they're not enforceable? BrickLink definitely
won't enforce your bespoke terms. It's entirely reasonable for a buyer
to ask for a partial shipping refund if there are parts missing from the order.
| | Last but not least, this is not a private conversation since all the bricklink
staff members can read it. So there is no difference into having an undefined
number of staff members reading it, or the whole bricklink forum people reading
it. Still it's a non private communication.
|
Quite wrong - it's a private conversation that can be read by BL staff members,
it is not a public conversation at all. You could maybe make it public in order
to refute the buyer's claims, if those are public; but leaving it here for
all and sundry to see is unprofessional.
|
agreed
OP selected to start the screenshot conversation with this member at the april
29th point ( mid-stream so to speak...) after the member mentioned the OP's
previous messages to them that apparently was unprofessional on the OP's
part & full of insults / lies.
if the OP is going to publicly call out a member like this, the OP should post
the full transcript of the conversation UNEDITED so we can see if what the member
is stating is true.. did the OP act in the manner described.
if the OP doesn't or refuses too... it just kinda shows they are trying to
obfuscate something in order to boost their own stance .
or maybe the user doxed here will kindly post their own sreenshots of this conversation,
so everyone is on the same page.
OP claims they never lie..
let's see
|
That's the last message actually.
Today is 29 April.
There is nothing after that.
|
|
|
| Author: | Shintaku | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 11:42 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 28 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| In Help, TheBrickGuys writes:
| | Isn't this kind of a double standard? You left negative feedbacks as a customer
for not getting back shipping cost when parts were missing.
|
Did you read that in my case the seller didn't want to refund anything and
I had to make a paypal claim on it?
|
|
| Author: | Shintaku | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 11:41 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 24 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| In Help, iprice writes:
| | Let's turn this around a bit.
Let's say that you were the buyer and you took your time to select a store
(out of the thousands on BL) with the particular parts you wanted at a price
that was right and you made your order and paid. You then waited for the parts
to arrive. One day they did ... and there were several missing, damaged and/or
incorrect coloured parts. Not the parts you needed, ordered and paid for.
Would you be happy? Then your seller refunded for only the incorrect, damaged
or missing parts. That's it. No thought about the buyer needing to go through
that whole process again because the seller cocked up. Looking. Ordering. Waiting
for parts to arrive.
All because the seller COCKED UP. Not the buyer. THE SELLER.
Do you not feel that is unfair? Do you feel that some sort of compensation is
due, even if only a partial refund of shipping costs for the other order he will
now have to make?
Bingo.
|
No. Zero. Not even close.
If I read the terms, it's written in the terms, and I don't like it,
it's my fault.
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| Author: | PlanetEarthToys | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 11:29 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 40 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| In Help, peregrinator writes:
| | In Help, Shintaku writes:
| | I don't want to be nitpicky or fussy, but your answer clearly shows that
you have your point of view to enforce over mine and you didn't even read
completely what I wrote.
I have a small shop, and I have lot of parts at the lowest price on the whole
bricklink.
To mantain this bargain for users there are some very simple rules to comply.
One is: if I make an error, and it happens, I just refund the part.
What are TOSs for if you don't read them and if you think that your point
of view is more important than the actual things?
|
What good are terms of service if they're not enforceable? BrickLink definitely
won't enforce your bespoke terms. It's entirely reasonable for a buyer
to ask for a partial shipping refund if there are parts missing from the order.
| | Last but not least, this is not a private conversation since all the bricklink
staff members can read it. So there is no difference into having an undefined
number of staff members reading it, or the whole bricklink forum people reading
it. Still it's a non private communication.
|
Quite wrong - it's a private conversation that can be read by BL staff members,
it is not a public conversation at all. You could maybe make it public in order
to refute the buyer's claims, if those are public; but leaving it here for
all and sundry to see is unprofessional.
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agreed
OP selected to start the screenshot conversation with this member at the april
29th point ( mid-stream so to speak...) after the member mentioned the OP's
previous messages to them that apparently was unprofessional on the OP's
part & full of insults / lies.
if the OP is going to publicly call out a member like this, the OP should post
the full transcript of the conversation UNEDITED so we can see if what the member
is stating is true.. did the OP act in the manner described.
if the OP doesn't or refuses too... it just kinda shows they are trying to
obfuscate something in order to boost their own stance .
or maybe the user doxed here will kindly post their own sreenshots of this conversation,
so everyone is on the same page.
OP claims they never lie..
let's see
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| Author: | TheBrickGuys | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 11:24 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 39 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| Isn't this kind of a double standard? You left negative feedbacks as a customer
for not getting back shipping cost when parts were missing.
Case in point where you left a negative:
You - Missing minifigures, unmannered and unfair attitude, worst experience ever.
Shop - Reply: Wanted shipping cost back, Paypal decided for me, now she is angry!
You - Follow-Up: She admitted her mistake, but she didn't provide a reasonable
refund!
Also you said that the customer was "The last message he wrote me, as you
can see, is something that should NOT be tolerable on this platform. Though what
he says, I have never ever insulted a bricklink user in my life, I have never
told a single lie, and being insulted this way is something that should never
be accepted here."
I dont see it. He seems very professional. What did he say that "that should
NOT be tolerable on this platform"?
Also, you stated that "This user, you can look within his feedbacks, is at
his second attempt to get money from sellers for factitious reasons."
The comment he left for the other seller just states " Missing part of an
important lot bc out of stock. Refunded missing pieces." It appears that
by looking at the sellers feedbacks in this case that he also dose not like to
refund shipping.
This metaspeed has left one negative and one neutral for missing pieces out
of 28 orders. This is not a pattern. The way it appears to me is that he is just
a customer that reasonably wants at least half of the shipping refunded when
stores dont send a full order.
Jim
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| Author: | iprice | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 09:20 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 58 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| Let's turn this around a bit.
Let's say that you were the buyer and you took your time to select a store
(out of the thousands on BL) with the particular parts you wanted at a price
that was right and you made your order and paid. You then waited for the parts
to arrive. One day they did ... and there were several missing, damaged and/or
incorrect coloured parts. Not the parts you needed, ordered and paid for.
Would you be happy? Then your seller refunded for only the incorrect, damaged
or missing parts. That's it. No thought about the buyer needing to go through
that whole process again because the seller cocked up. Looking. Ordering. Waiting
for parts to arrive.
All because the seller COCKED UP. Not the buyer. THE SELLER.
Do you not feel that is unfair? Do you feel that some sort of compensation is
due, even if only a partial refund of shipping costs for the other order he will
now have to make?
Bingo.
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| Author: | peregrinator | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 08:46 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 55 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| In Help, Shintaku writes:
| | I don't want to be nitpicky or fussy, but your answer clearly shows that
you have your point of view to enforce over mine and you didn't even read
completely what I wrote.
I have a small shop, and I have lot of parts at the lowest price on the whole
bricklink.
To mantain this bargain for users there are some very simple rules to comply.
One is: if I make an error, and it happens, I just refund the part.
What are TOSs for if you don't read them and if you think that your point
of view is more important than the actual things?
|
What good are terms of service if they're not enforceable? BrickLink definitely
won't enforce your bespoke terms. It's entirely reasonable for a buyer
to ask for a partial shipping refund if there are parts missing from the order.
| | Last but not least, this is not a private conversation since all the bricklink
staff members can read it. So there is no difference into having an undefined
number of staff members reading it, or the whole bricklink forum people reading
it. Still it's a non private communication.
|
Quite wrong - it's a private conversation that can be read by BL staff members,
it is not a public conversation at all. You could maybe make it public in order
to refute the buyer's claims, if those are public; but leaving it here for
all and sundry to see is unprofessional.
|
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| Author: | Shintaku | | Posted: | Apr 29, 2024 08:06 | | Subject: | Re: We should be able to get rid of some users | | Viewed: | 53 times | | Topic: | Help | |
| In Help, Gaston.La.Brick writes:
| | For a seller, the order is fulfilled when the buyer receives ALL items ordered.
It's the seller his obligation to make sure the buyer receives the complete
order.
If the seller fails to do so, a simple refund of the missing items is not sufficient
as the buyer needs to put time in searching a new store to purchase from AND
to pay shipping costs again.
The seller can offer:
A) The buyer returns the full order, with a full refund (including original shipping
costs AND including the return shipping costs, since it was a seller's problem).
Seems expensive for the seller, but it's the seller's fault to begin
with.
B) Refund missing items and reasonable part of the original shipping costs. Or
completely. So the buyer isn't forced to pay shipping costs at another store
from his own pocket.
C) Make sure the buyer receives the items. If you (the seller) doens't have
it in stock, you can place the order yourself at another store, and re-ship (or
just choose a dropshipping method).
I know all options will eat (part of) your profit, but it was your error to begin
with. The buyer can't be held accountable for the mistakes a seller made.
So for a seller you can only sigh, take the cost and learn to get better and
order fulfilling to spot missing items.
The solution you offered to simply refund the actual costs of the missing items,
without even reaching out to the buyer first to discuss options, is not a good
one. I usually go for option C) because I find it my obligation as a seller to
make sure I fully fulfill the order without extra work for my customer. All efforts
and costs to rectify a problem, should come from the seller.
I understand BrickLink used to have more of a "kindred spirits" without
a true enforced "buyer-seller relationship with commercial and legal obligations".
But things have evolved over time, as more and more people found their way to
BrickLink. As a result, the commercial and legal obligations become more and
more important, so it's important for sellers to be aware of these obligations
and act correctly to follow these obligations.
Lastly, I don't think it really professional to post this issue here in the
thread and mention the related user. It might even be considered a privacy violation
to do so? I think it is. But in any case, as a seller, stay professional. This
isn't really a professional action.
You might continue by stoplisting my account as well based on the fact you will
probably not like this reply. It's just how I think about this situation
and give you some other point of view you might consider.
|
I don't want to be nitpicky or fussy, but your answer clearly shows that
you have your point of view to enforce over mine and you didn't even read
completely what I wrote.
I have a small shop, and I have lot of parts at the lowest price on the whole
bricklink.
To mantain this bargain for users there are some very simple rules to comply.
One is: if I make an error, and it happens, I just refund the part.
What are TOSs for if you don't read them and if you think that your point
of view is more important than the actual things?
I don't put a gun against no one head forcing people to buy at mine's.
If they do these are the plus
1) I ship the day after I receive the order, usually
2) Orders are packaged in a very sofisticated and precise way
3) Prices are super reasonable
and just one minus
1) I don't reship. If I forget something, or something is strangely missing
from my store, you will get refunded.
All of these things are clearly specified in my TOS.
Your rule that the order is complete once they receive ALL the items in the order
is not a golden rule, is your point of view, you can't treat that as a law.
The order is complete once they receive all the items OR they are refunded for
the missing ones. Bricklink states this.
This is my rule, this is in my TOS, if people do not spend a minute reading them,
then it's them to blame, not me.
Last but not least, this is not a private conversation since all the bricklink
staff members can read it. So there is no difference into having an undefined
number of staff members reading it, or the whole bricklink forum people reading
it. Still it's a non private communication.
I believe that you, for your own reason, had something against me while reading
and you wanted to say I'm wrong regardless.
It happens, I won't stoplist you, it's not enough to worry me or get
me angry by the least.
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