Redisplay Messages: Compact | Brief | All | Full Show Messages: All | Without Replies| Author: | Rick_S.  | | Posted: | May 21, 2015 18:18 | | Subject: | Re: Checkboxes to describe sellers (part II) | | Viewed: | 38 times | | Topic: | Suggestions | |
|
| In Suggestions, FigBits writes:
| | Yes, but section 18, under Order Cancellation Policy, states that it is okay
to cancel under certain circumstances.
http://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=79
Including: Mutual agreement to cancel between buyer and seller
It is certainly not a violation of the TOS for a buyer and seller to agree to
cancel an order.
--
Marc.
|
ok well lets look under that policy shall we?
| | Valid Reasons:
1.Mutual agreement to cancel between buyer and seller
|
this part here is confusing since what does mutual agreement constitute since
you would think it would have to apply to one of the following reasons.
| | 2.Seller did not respond to emails
|
Seller doesn't respond, is understandable since you can't complete a
transaction if the seller does not communicate.
| | 3.Seller did not have items after order was submitted
|
as a buyer I would eb irked if a seller lists some items then turns out they
don't have them.
| | 4.Seller listed item with error
|
this one is not so prevalent since most listings are based on the item guide.
| | 5.Seller provided a shipping fee that was too high (not clearly stated in T&C)
|
what is constituted as too high, the one seller in that other thread had a pretty
reasonable S&H fee, so what is too high? in fact this should be able to be contested
by the seller if they so choose, with evidence their S&H is spot on or there
abouts.
| | 6.Seller is using an exchange rate inconsistent with Exchange Rate Policy
|
seller violated the rules, understandable
| | 7.Seller did not ship order after payment was made
|
Seller failed to deliver
| | 8.Seller is underage (under 18 years old)
|
seller violated the rules once again
| | 9.Seller is no longer registered
|
can't complete a transaction with someone who is not there.
10.System problem during order submission (excluding not receiving order notification
e-mail)
BL screw up.
now heres the reasons not allowed for cancellation which occurs too often, and
yet you expect sellers to violate said rules:
| | Invalid Reasons:
1.Buyer no longer wants the items - This is the most common example which BrickLink does not tolerate. Buyer should make sure he or she wants to buy the items before submitting an order, not after. After an order is submitted, the buyer enters into a legally binding contract with the seller to purchase all items in that order.
|
many buyers use this excuse or more to the point they say S&H was too high because
they changed their mind.
| | 2.Buyer found items cheaper somewhere else - Buyer should be confident that he or she is.
ready to pay the asking prices before submitting an order. After an order is submitted, the buyer enters into a legally binding contract with the seller to purchase all items in that order.
|
another intolerable reason and yet buyers will have this excuse and use the S&H
too high excuse.
now that's just for the buyer, by these policies it is to easy for a buyer
to complain S&H is too high even with no proof.
|
 |
| Author: | Rick_S. | | Posted: | May 21, 2015 17:59 | | Subject: | Re: Checkboxes to describe sellers (part II) | | Viewed: | 47 times | | Topic: | Suggestions | |
|
| In Suggestions, kzinti writes:
| | | | Most problems arise from new buyers, who may not know how much shipping costs.
Just because there is no cheaper option, doesn't mean it can't catch
someone off guard. Now maybe it could have been avoided with a little research,
but I don't think that should be necessary for a modern marketplace website,
which is why we need to get automated checkout working already.
|
I believe it will create a bunch of headaches due to the unique nature of order
dimensions and weights here. Either the Seller will get stuck with higher costs,
or the Buyer will be overpaying for shipping. I'd prefer to quote due to
the large variety of packaging and shipping options.
|
all this suggestion is, is a way for some buyers to go, were better then the
others and in my opinion its nothing but grandstanding, if people don't like
the S&H don't blame the seller (most of the times) blame the post office.
|
|
| Author: | Rick_S. | | Posted: | May 21, 2015 17:39 | | Subject: | Re: Checkboxes to describe sellers (part II) | | Viewed: | 37 times | | Topic: | Suggestions | |
|
| In Suggestions, FigBits writes:
| | In Suggestions, Rick_S. writes:
| | In Suggestions, FigBits writes:
| | Some sellers do not allow buyers to back out of a purchase if they change their
mind before payment. Others do (and some are required to do so by law).
Right now, this option is left to each store to describe in their store terms
if they allow it (or not). Usually, it is never mentioned at all, which can cause
some confusion among new buyers.
To help alleviate this confusion, and to help buyers more easily find stores
that have terms that they would like to support, I would like to see this option
be added as a checkbox that sellers can choose (or not) for their store.
This is an extension of the suggestion I posted here: http://www.bricklink.com/messageThread.asp?ID=173897
That suggestion listed a number of such checkboxes that would be useful. I believe
that this option of allowing sellers to state whether they accept cancellations
or not would be just as useful as anything else discussed in that earlier thread.
--
Marc.
|
Not sure I could go with a suggestion that suggests sellers have the option to
violate the ToS since a buyer is responsible for completing of their purchase,
|
Agreeing to cancel isn't a violation of the TOS. Any seller is free to do
so. BL even explicitly provides that option: buyer and seller agree to camcel.
Marc.
|
from BrickLink ToS:
4.Buying:
If you place an order in a store, you are obligated to complete the purchase.
5.Selling:
If you have a store and receive a valid order then you are obligated to complete
the transaction.
http://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=1919
|
|
| Author: | Rick_S. | | Posted: | May 21, 2015 17:19 | | Subject: | Re: Checkboxes to describe sellers (part II) | | Viewed: | 51 times | | Topic: | Suggestions | |
|
| In Suggestions, kzinti writes:
| | How do you determine too high shipping? What is the metric for that? If I am
quoted only standard local postal rates for shipping weight and then opt to cancel
due to shipping being too high, where else will I go to get it shipped cheaper?
Nowhere. The argument that shipping is too high is invalid in this case.
I believe the new Quote option was designed to specifically allow this kind of
window shopping. "I want this, what will it cost to ship?" and when they find
out, "Oh, my! Um, no thanks". No harm, no foul.
|
if its (shipping) not free its too much 
|
|
| Author: | Rick_S. | | Posted: | May 21, 2015 17:18 | | Subject: | Re: Checkboxes to describe sellers (part II) | | Viewed: | 50 times | | Topic: | Suggestions | |
|
| In Suggestions, FigBits writes:
| | Some sellers do not allow buyers to back out of a purchase if they change their
mind before payment. Others do (and some are required to do so by law).
Right now, this option is left to each store to describe in their store terms
if they allow it (or not). Usually, it is never mentioned at all, which can cause
some confusion among new buyers.
To help alleviate this confusion, and to help buyers more easily find stores
that have terms that they would like to support, I would like to see this option
be added as a checkbox that sellers can choose (or not) for their store.
This is an extension of the suggestion I posted here: http://www.bricklink.com/messageThread.asp?ID=173897
That suggestion listed a number of such checkboxes that would be useful. I believe
that this option of allowing sellers to state whether they accept cancellations
or not would be just as useful as anything else discussed in that earlier thread.
--
Marc.
|
Not sure I could go with a suggestion that suggests sellers have the option to
violate the ToS since a buyer is responsible for completing of their purchase,
cause lets face it if a seller says they are forgiving of buyers who want to
back out, how many buyers will those sellers get who do such a thing, while the
sellers who will follow the ToS, don't worry about the buyers backing out
since they will face the consequences.
|
|
| Author: | Rick_S. | | Posted: | May 21, 2015 15:56 | | Subject: | Re: New Member tutorial | | Viewed: | 35 times | | Topic: | Suggestions | |
|
| In Suggestions, mabccc writes:
| | In Suggestions, Rick_S. writes:
| | In Suggestions, CoachMcGuirk writes:
| | In Suggestions, Rick_S. writes:
| | In Suggestions, CoachMcGuirk writes:
| | In Suggestions, Rick_S. writes:
| | ok with all the threads about new buyers and sellers, or a very long thread about
a new buyer, maybe a tutorial should be instituted for both new buyers and new
sellers that they would go thru as part of the sign up process so as to avoid
some of the confusion that is occurring (hopefully).
it could be any one of things from a video tutorial or a written tutorial or
? any of which must be completed before official member status is given.
this is just a suggestive thought.
|
People don't want to read lengthy documents or spend 5 minutes watching
a training video before making a simple purchase. This is likely why people don't
read store's ToS (which many are quite needlessly lengthy in my opinion)
leading to this problem.
Many people (myself included) spend lots of time on here and get the feel for
things, but lots of people just want to buy something and go away - maybe they
don't even care for Lego and give it away as a gift. If the time to make
that initial purchase is too burdensome, you'll either lose those sales or
you'll keep running into this problem, in my opinion.
The only solution to this problem, in my opinion, is to have an industry standard
e-commerce check-out system.
|
Problem is this is not one business, but several businesses in several locations
with various degrees of shipping, payment and so forth, it is a lot easier to
do a tutorial then to try to come up with one wrap around program that will probably
cause rates for sellers to go up and take up lots of space and cause more problems.
|
Isn't it actually the exact same? If the tutorial doesn't explain all
the variations in all the processes in all the different business on here, it
is just as useless as not having one. If a new seller sits through the tutorial
and encounters a slightly different service agreement than what they just spent
5 minutes figuring out, they'll potentially place an order incorrectly or
give up.
Also there are many, many off-the shelf products available to handle e-commerce.
So, I'd say its easier to use something already existing than make something
new 99% of the time.
Would automatic checkout solve all the problems? No. It would probably even create
some as you say. But I believe it will be the only way to fix this specific problem
of buyers placing orders they no longer want.
Side question, what space? I'm lost and very curious on this.
|
you do know the space this site is on? they had to close up the Chat room because
of it.
furthermore a tutorial can give the basics like how to navigate, how unless the
buyer says free shipping, there will be shipping and so on. what you suggest
would be a disaster in the making.
|
Having the buyer decide when to get free shipping would also be a disaster.
Tutorials are a waste of time. You cannot force people to follow them, and people
will still make mistakes.
|
but they would have to say watch the tutorial video to get the password to unlock
their account, and thereby doing they have no excuse, there is a South Park Episode
where Stan signs an Apple agreement without reading it, he became part of a human
centipad, people should really read those agreements they agree too.
|
|
| Author: | Rick_S. | | Posted: | May 21, 2015 13:37 | | Subject: | Re: New Member tutorial | | Viewed: | 32 times | | Topic: | Suggestions | |
|
| In Suggestions, Rick_S. writes:
| | ok with all the threads about new buyers and sellers, or a very long thread about
a new buyer, maybe a tutorial should be instituted for both new buyers and new
sellers that they would go thru as part of the sign up process so as to avoid
some of the confusion that is occurring (hopefully).
it could be any one of things from a video tutorial or a written tutorial or
? any of which must be completed before official member status is given.
this is just a suggestive thought.
|
bump up.
|
|
| Author: | Rick_S. | | Posted: | May 20, 2015 19:25 | | Subject: | Re: New Member tutorial | | Viewed: | 39 times | | Topic: | Suggestions | |
|
| In Suggestions, j7r7o7c7k7 writes:
| | In Suggestions, Rick_S. writes:
| | In Suggestions, therobo writes:
| | In Suggestions, Rick_S. writes:
| | ok with all the threads about new buyers and sellers, or a very long thread about
a new buyer, maybe a tutorial should be instituted for both new buyers and new
sellers that they would go thru as part of the sign up process so as to avoid
some of the confusion that is occurring (hopefully).
it could be any one of things from a video tutorial or a written tutorial or
? any of which must be completed before official member status is given.
this is just a suggestive thought.
|
http://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2215
|
but is that part of the sign up process, or one of those things that is hidden
away and unknown, since I didn't even know of this video.
|
I had no idea this video was there. And I have looked at a ton of things on this
site just to learn stuff and where things are.
As for the OP. I like the idea as well. But like said, most people don't
read what they sign up for. Honestly how reads all the terms and conditions for
everything you sign up for. When some of them would take you a hour or more
if you are a good reader. And they always use words and terms you have to be
a rocket scientist to understand. And if people don't read terms why on earth
would they read something like this or watch a video. They will just say screw
it and buy from the bay. I like the idea but just don't think it will fix
much of anything overall. It might cut out 1-2 people from doing a no no but
when there is 10000 what is 1 or 2. I don't know if there is a fool proof
fix anyway. Cause like with the video they will just start it and then go do
something while it watches its self. I have started many previews (dvds that
wont let you skip them) and commercials (video ads) and I will just go make something
to eat or hit the bathroom or whatever and then come back in a few mins when
its ready to go and get to what I really wanted to do and didn't pay in mind
to the other crap.
|
well the trick is to supply a codeword in the video that is used to unlock the
feature access of the site.
|
|
| Author: | Rick_S. | | Posted: | May 20, 2015 19:23 | | Subject: | Re: New Member tutorial | | Viewed: | 27 times | | Topic: | Suggestions | |
|
| In Suggestions, jodawill writes:
| | In Suggestions, Rick_S. writes:
| | In Suggestions, CoachMcGuirk writes:
| | In Suggestions, Rick_S. writes:
| | In Suggestions, CoachMcGuirk writes:
| | In Suggestions, Rick_S. writes:
| | ok with all the threads about new buyers and sellers, or a very long thread about
a new buyer, maybe a tutorial should be instituted for both new buyers and new
sellers that they would go thru as part of the sign up process so as to avoid
some of the confusion that is occurring (hopefully).
it could be any one of things from a video tutorial or a written tutorial or
? any of which must be completed before official member status is given.
this is just a suggestive thought.
|
People don't want to read lengthy documents or spend 5 minutes watching
a training video before making a simple purchase. This is likely why people don't
read store's ToS (which many are quite needlessly lengthy in my opinion)
leading to this problem.
Many people (myself included) spend lots of time on here and get the feel for
things, but lots of people just want to buy something and go away - maybe they
don't even care for Lego and give it away as a gift. If the time to make
that initial purchase is too burdensome, you'll either lose those sales or
you'll keep running into this problem, in my opinion.
The only solution to this problem, in my opinion, is to have an industry standard
e-commerce check-out system.
|
Problem is this is not one business, but several businesses in several locations
with various degrees of shipping, payment and so forth, it is a lot easier to
do a tutorial then to try to come up with one wrap around program that will probably
cause rates for sellers to go up and take up lots of space and cause more problems.
|
Isn't it actually the exact same? If the tutorial doesn't explain all
the variations in all the processes in all the different business on here, it
is just as useless as not having one. If a new seller sits through the tutorial
and encounters a slightly different service agreement than what they just spent
5 minutes figuring out, they'll potentially place an order incorrectly or
give up.
Also there are many, many off-the shelf products available to handle e-commerce.
So, I'd say its easier to use something already existing than make something
new 99% of the time.
Would automatic checkout solve all the problems? No. It would probably even create
some as you say. But I believe it will be the only way to fix this specific problem
of buyers placing orders they no longer want.
Side question, what space? I'm lost and very curious on this.
|
you do know the space this site is on? they had to close up the Chat room because
of it.
furthermore a tutorial can give the basics like how to navigate, how unless the
buyer says free shipping, there will be shipping and so on. what you suggest
would be a disaster in the making.
|
It's my understanding that the chatroom was closed because it was a major
security problem due to sloppy coding, so they just scrapped the whole thing.
|
from what I remember is it took up to much space on the server and caused other
parts of the site to crash.
|
|
| Author: | Rick_S. | | Posted: | May 20, 2015 18:35 | | Subject: | Re: New Member tutorial | | Viewed: | 27 times | | Topic: | Suggestions | |
|
| In Suggestions, CoachMcGuirk writes:
| | In Suggestions, Rick_S. writes:
| | In Suggestions, CoachMcGuirk writes:
| | In Suggestions, Rick_S. writes:
| | ok with all the threads about new buyers and sellers, or a very long thread about
a new buyer, maybe a tutorial should be instituted for both new buyers and new
sellers that they would go thru as part of the sign up process so as to avoid
some of the confusion that is occurring (hopefully).
it could be any one of things from a video tutorial or a written tutorial or
? any of which must be completed before official member status is given.
this is just a suggestive thought.
|
People don't want to read lengthy documents or spend 5 minutes watching
a training video before making a simple purchase. This is likely why people don't
read store's ToS (which many are quite needlessly lengthy in my opinion)
leading to this problem.
Many people (myself included) spend lots of time on here and get the feel for
things, but lots of people just want to buy something and go away - maybe they
don't even care for Lego and give it away as a gift. If the time to make
that initial purchase is too burdensome, you'll either lose those sales or
you'll keep running into this problem, in my opinion.
The only solution to this problem, in my opinion, is to have an industry standard
e-commerce check-out system.
|
Problem is this is not one business, but several businesses in several locations
with various degrees of shipping, payment and so forth, it is a lot easier to
do a tutorial then to try to come up with one wrap around program that will probably
cause rates for sellers to go up and take up lots of space and cause more problems.
|
Isn't it actually the exact same? If the tutorial doesn't explain all
the variations in all the processes in all the different business on here, it
is just as useless as not having one. If a new seller sits through the tutorial
and encounters a slightly different service agreement than what they just spent
5 minutes figuring out, they'll potentially place an order incorrectly or
give up.
Also there are many, many off-the shelf products available to handle e-commerce.
So, I'd say its easier to use something already existing than make something
new 99% of the time.
Would automatic checkout solve all the problems? No. It would probably even create
some as you say. But I believe it will be the only way to fix this specific problem
of buyers placing orders they no longer want.
Side question, what space? I'm lost and very curious on this.
|
you do know the space this site is on? they had to close up the Chat room because
of it.
furthermore a tutorial can give the basics like how to navigate, how unless the
buyer says free shipping, there will be shipping and so on. what you suggest
would be a disaster in the making.
|
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