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| | | Author: | NoGravitasHere  | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 13:07 | | Subject: | Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 329 times | | Topic: | Catalog | | Status: | Open | |
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| I've contacted BrickLink support multiple times via the Help Desk link, and
been ignored every single time. The current system of silver classification is
laughably bad. There are 9 official Lego silvers/chromes/gunmetals, and you only
recognise 4.5, at best.
I have repeatedly offered you the information you need to fix this issue, and
have not once received even a reply for my efforts. Instead, BrickLink is more
interested in maintaining their poorly-categorised colours, removing accurate
listings (how can I include rubber bands with a set, when said rubber bands are
23 years old and dust?), and ignoring the fella trying to literally hand you
the answer to this issue, and also ruining your database by no longer tracking
part variants. You do realise some of those 'insignificant' changes actually
matter, right?
... Right?
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| | | | | Author: | 1001bricks | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 13:13 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 109 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | I've contacted BrickLink support multiple times
|
BEEP
| | I have repeatedly offered you the information you need to fix this issue
|
BEEEEP
| | Instead, BrickLink is more interested in maintaining their poorly-categorised colours
|
BEEEEEPPP
| | and also ruining your database by no longer tracking part variants.
|
BEEEEEEPPPPP
So many alert beeps!
I'm not sure it's the best way to ask for something and obtain even
only a reply 
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| | | | | Author: | Adjour | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 13:17 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 102 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | I've contacted BrickLink support multiple times via the Help Desk link, and
been ignored every single time. The current system of silver classification is
laughably bad. There are 9 official Lego silvers/chromes/gunmetals, and you only
recognise 4.5, at best.
I have repeatedly offered you the information you need to fix this issue, and
have not once received even a reply for my efforts. Instead, BrickLink is more
interested in maintaining their poorly-categorised colours, removing accurate
listings (how can I include rubber bands with a set, when said rubber bands are
23 years old and dust?), and ignoring the fella trying to literally hand you
the answer to this issue, and also ruining your database by no longer tracking
part variants. You do realise some of those 'insignificant' changes actually
matter, right?
... Right?
|
are you really proposing removing rubber bands from older set inventories?
The thought of adding more "metal" colors makes my head hurt, and I'm
better at the colors than the average user.
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| | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 13:42 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 104 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| Nah nah, removing rubber bands entirely would defs be overkill. But, forcing
older sets to be listed as Incomplete, when the parts required to 'complete'
them are almost all dead, is a bit frustrating. Listing as Incomplete hurts sales,
as a lot of people don't even include 'Incomplete' in their search
parameters.
As for the silvers, I'm not proposing making up new colours based on appearance.
The issue is that legitimate, official Lego silvers are currently being lumped
under umbrella names. Pearl Light Grey is 2-3 official colours, and Pearl Dark
Grey is 2. These aren't even that minor differences in some cases. I've
been working on trying to fix them ever since I realised that there was a massive
amount of data missing for Pearl Very Light Grey (or, to use its real name, 150
Light Grey Metallic).
I've reached out multiple times now, offering to just give them everything
I've collated over the past year or so, right down to the individual parts
affected, the legitimate, official variants they exist in, and the timeline for
their uses. Silvers aren't the only issue, don't get me started on the
4-Hole Kraahkan variant (Pearl Black, again an official piece, in an official
colour) that no-one's noticed for 20 years...Previous attempts at communication
were friendly, polite, and lacking the frustrated tone of this post. This is
the culmination of I dunno, maybe like 6-8 months of politely requesting some
sort of conversation about major colour/variant issue, and being ignored.
Bionicle's catalogue on BrickLink has been mismanaged pretty poorly, and
has resulted in a lot of misinformation leaking into the community as a whole.
If this were just production variations, or mismoulds, or anything unofficial,
I wouldn't be making a fuss. Hell, if they'd just replied with a 'thanks,
but no thanks' that'd be fine and dandy. Ignoring someone pointing out
a gaping hole in your database is just... Weird. Rude, even.
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | zorbanj | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 14:49 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 76 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| |
Nah nah, removing rubber bands entirely would defs be overkill. But, forcing
older sets to be listed as Incomplete, when the parts required to 'complete'
them are almost all dead, is a bit frustrating. Listing as Incomplete hurts sales,
as a lot of people don't even include 'Incomplete' in their search
parameters.
|
Older sets with stickers have have the same issue. I've brought it up several
times over the years, but nothing's going to be done about it.
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | Adjour | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 20:09 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 68 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| As someone who has been doing this a while. I'll tell you that Bionicle being
popular with collectors is a NEW thing. They were practically worthless until
the generation who grew up with them became adults with incomes. I remember predicting
it and watching the market start to tick up and then buying a ton in bulk for
next to nothing (compared to now)
The catalog is run by volunteers, which, not to speak for them, are probably
not your age bracket and probably honestly not that interested in Bionicle. I
would imagine its just not a priority.
Crystal
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| | | | | Author: | yorbrick | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 13:26 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 78 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| | | removing accurate listings (how can I include rubber bands with a set, when said rubber bands are 23 years old and dust?)
|
Like any other sets with broken parts, you leave them out and list the set as
incomplete saying no rubber bands.
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| | | | | | | Author: | zorbanj | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 14:50 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 61 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, yorbrick writes:
| | | | removing accurate listings (how can I include rubber bands with a set, when said rubber bands are 23 years old and dust?)
|
Like any other sets with broken parts, you leave them out and list the set as
incomplete saying no rubber bands.
|
I'm sure he knows that, and I don't think that was the point.
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | yorbrick | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 16:18 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 65 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, zorbanj writes:
| | In Catalog, yorbrick writes:
| | | | removing accurate listings (how can I include rubber bands with a set, when said rubber bands are 23 years old and dust?)
|
Like any other sets with broken parts, you leave them out and list the set as
incomplete saying no rubber bands.
|
I'm sure he knows that, and I don't think that was the point.
|
Bionicle is nothing special here. There are plenty of rubberised parts that break
or crack with age or other fragile parts that break. As soon as there is a disclaimer
that a set can still be complete if an original part is broken, then the complete/incomplete
flag is useless.
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| | | | | Author: | randyf | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 14:30 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 122 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | I've contacted BrickLink support multiple times via the Help Desk link, and
been ignored every single time. The current system of silver classification is
laughably bad. There are 9 official Lego silvers/chromes/gunmetals, and you only
recognise 4.5, at best.
I have repeatedly offered you the information you need to fix this issue, and
have not once received even a reply for my efforts. Instead, BrickLink is more
interested in maintaining their poorly-categorised colours, removing accurate
listings (how can I include rubber bands with a set, when said rubber bands are
23 years old and dust?), and ignoring the fella trying to literally hand you
the answer to this issue, and also ruining your database by no longer tracking
part variants. You do realise some of those 'insignificant' changes actually
matter, right?
... Right?
|
Unfortunately for you, you have definitely been going about things the wrong
way, and I am sorry for that. Issues that deal with the BrickLink catalog are
not governed by the BrickLink help desk but are rather handled by a team of catalog
administrators. The easiest way to get in touch with us is either through the
forums (as you just did), or by emailing us directly at the catalog@bricklink.com
address. The help desk should be forwarding things to the proper channels when
contacted, but the catalog administrators have no control of that.
Now, onto what you came here for. 
The silver colors have a long history on BrickLink. Without knowing the full
history, it is hard to understand the way things are, but a lot of it stems from
two main things.
The first is the fact that the LEGO group did not release information about all
of the colors being used back when BrickLink was founded and further added to
over the following decade (2000-2010). Well, guess which theme was around during
that time period? 
The second is that not many people really cared about Bionicle in the AFOL community
back then, and it was not taken seriously by the adults who were creating this
site and adding to it. Meanwhile, the kids of the day were having a blast with
the theme. Fast forward to the present and all of those kids are now adults clamoring
for the Bionicle history on BrickLink to catch up with what is known, but the
work required for a lot of this is no small task.
However, we have made great strides in the last few years to get the silver colors
sorted properly. One was by adding many unique Bionicle colors to the database,
and the second was a huge project completed in 2022. Some of the history of the
silvers can be read on the following help page:
https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=1096
The good news is that we have plans to do more, such as formally recognizing
the color Cool Silver and getting it into the correct inventories, fixing the
enormous problem in the Zamor sphere area, looking into a better solution for
managing Kraata, etc. We also have a lot of the information that is needed to
accomplish these goals, so that is not the issue.
The issue is time. The catalog administrators have to keep up with the constant
barrage of stuff being released by the LEGO group and then try to find small
amounts of time to fix things from the past. I will tell you right now that fixing
things from the past is not the priority, so a lot of patience is required when
you want to see things like this happen.
If you have any other questions, feel free to post them here or hit the team
up at the email address I listed above.
Cheers,
Randy
P.S. There is no current plan to separate BrickLink Pearl Dark Gray into its
two unique colors, but it is something that may be considered in the future.
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| | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 15:04 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 88 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| Thanks for your response, Randy. I really appreciate it.
To clarify, my first attempts at communication were via the email you've
just provided. They were ignored. Twice. Can't really say I'm going about
it the wrong way if the 'proper' channel was a dead end. I'm not
the only one that's been ignored, another user attempted communication via
that same email and was also ignored more than once. Telling me that I've
been doing it wrong, when I actually didn't, is rude.
There seems to be a miscommunication here. I'm well aware of the issues inherent
with cataloguing and categorisation, because I solved them all without your
help. I was a seasoned seller before I made the leap to BrickLink. I'm
trying to communicate that I have solved the majority of these issues myself,
and am offering you the information you need to bring the catalogue up to speed.
I am not complaining about something without offering a solution, I have the
9 silvers/chromes/gunmetals more or less sorted, timelined, and accurately categorised.
Only 150 Light Grey Metallic still has problems, and BrickLink's catalogue
doesn't even recognise it as being used in Bionicle. It definitely is, both
repeatedly and often interchangeably with 131 and 296, which themselves were
used interchangeably with each other in some cases. The link on the history of
silvers you have provided is not accurate, and my data conclusively proves that.
If you have the information you need, as you claim, then why have you skipped
150 entirely? Can you tell me what year(s) 150 made its way into the Bionicle
catalogue? The other unlisted parts it spilled over into? The sets containing
those parts? I can. I have it all spreadsheeted and freely available to anyone
who asks. Do you?
It is not an issue of time when someone has already done the work for you, and
you've just straight up ignored them over and over again. I never, ever play
this card, but apparently I'm out of options here: I was the biggest Bionicle
seller in the Southern Hemisphere before I even considered joining BrickLink,
and I am telling you: your customer service is inadequate, as is your catalogue.
Blaming AFOLs for not caring, or saying that 'fixing things from the past
is not a priority' when the majority of Lego is in fact, from the past,
is a very very strange stance.
Right now, the recurring joke among Oceania-based Bionicle fans is that I do
a better job at Being BrickLink than BrickLink. I didn't realise how true
that was until this conversation. I have no further plans to try and contact
your team, as they will probably just continue to ignore me as they have in the
past, regardless of which channel of communication I use, 'right' or
otherwise. You disappoint me.
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | Nubs_Select | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 15:09 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 76 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| | | or saying that 'fixing things from the past
is not a priority' when the majority of Lego is in fact, from the past,
is a very very strange stance.
|
it is a very very small catalogue team, lego is releasing more and more sets
every year. what brings in the most profit for bricklink is getting new inventories
and parts added so new items can be listed and sets parted out. so with the very
small team and an ever-growing workload, they simply cannot prioritize much else.
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | vaderman212 | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 15:42 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 59 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, Nubs_Select writes:
| | | | or saying that 'fixing things from the past
is not a priority' when the majority of Lego is in fact, from the past,
is a very very strange stance.
|
it is a very very small catalogue team, lego is releasing more and more sets
every year. what brings in the most profit for bricklink is getting new inventories
and parts added so new items can be listed and sets parted out. so with the very
small team and an ever-growing workload, they simply cannot prioritize much else.
|
Are you suggesting that The Lego Group with a valuation of $12.2 billion isn't
capable of hiring a couple more catalogers or even implementing the information
offered here for free? I'm just curious here since surely they could afford
a handful more employees to get on top of things.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | SylvainLS | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 15:48 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 59 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, vaderman212 writes:
| | […]
Are you suggesting that The Lego Group with a valuation of $12.2 billion isn't
capable of hiring a couple more catalogers or even implementing the information
offered here for free? I'm just curious here since surely they could afford
a handful more employees to get on top of things.
|
‘Experts’¹ aren’t employees: https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=974
¹ That’s how the catalogue and us, mods, and translators… are called.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | jennnifer | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 15:54 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 63 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, vaderman212 writes:
| | In Catalog, Nubs_Select writes:
| | | | or saying that 'fixing things from the past
is not a priority' when the majority of Lego is in fact, from the past,
is a very very strange stance.
|
it is a very very small catalogue team, lego is releasing more and more sets
every year. what brings in the most profit for bricklink is getting new inventories
and parts added so new items can be listed and sets parted out. so with the very
small team and an ever-growing workload, they simply cannot prioritize much else.
|
Are you suggesting that The Lego Group with a valuation of $12.2 billion isn't
capable of hiring a couple more catalogers or even implementing the information
offered here for free? I'm just curious here since surely they could afford
a handful more employees to get on top of things.
|
These kind of changes and cataloging require people with expertise in both BrickLink
and LEGO. I would guess there's not a handful of people just hanging around
waiting to be hired. Just a hunch...
Personally, I would hope any handful of employees they hire would be to improve
the data base, seller, and catalog tools.
~Jen
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | 1001bricks | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 15:58 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 61 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| | | | | Are you suggesting that The Lego Group with a valuation of $12.2 billion isn't
capable of hiring a couple more catalogers or even implementing the information
offered here for free? I'm just curious here since surely they could afford
a handful more employees to get on top of things.
|
These kind of changes and cataloging require people with expertise in both BrickLink
and LEGO. I would guess there's not a handful of people just hanging around
waiting to be hired.
|
Plus find those with a deep knowledge of Bionicle!
I know only one - but it's OP who's complaining in Forum 
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | jennnifer | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 16:05 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 54 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, 1001bricks writes:
| | | | | | Are you suggesting that The Lego Group with a valuation of $12.2 billion isn't
capable of hiring a couple more catalogers or even implementing the information
offered here for free? I'm just curious here since surely they could afford
a handful more employees to get on top of things.
|
These kind of changes and cataloging require people with expertise in both BrickLink
and LEGO. I would guess there's not a handful of people just hanging around
waiting to be hired.
|
Plus find those with a deep knowledge of Bionicle!
I know only one - but it's OP who's complaining in Forum
|
Well, I am a big fan of Bionicle... but working with the LEGO data from this
time and with the dearth of new sets to open is less than fun for me. Plus there
are only 596 Bionicle parts in the Catalog. I would consider that to be a niche
if ever I saw one.
~Jen
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 17:06 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 83 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| It's definitely niche hahaha, but it's the one I fell ass-backwards into.
The not-so-wee-anymore Bionicle community was plagued by misinformation, and
catalogue inaccuracies. My physical health failed on me a few years before Covid
went on its world tour, so I've had a lot of time on my hands, and a passion
for dumb mysteries. That being said, Bionicle's limited catalogue of parts
does make it easier to study in-depth. Even in its current state of, well,
death lol, it's still a significant part of Lego's history. It's
commonly known that Bionicle is one of the themes that helped pull Lego out of
near-bankruptcy, along with Star Wars. Just because it's an out of production
theme, or doesn't have a bajillion parts, it doesn't make categorising
it accurately any less important.
As for someone with the knowledge and willingness to actually do the work - I
offered to, for free. 3 times before today, if I recall? I just wanted to fix
this mess. We're only at this heated point of discussion today because I
was ignored repeatedly, despite using the proper channels. Even worse, the response
I finally did receive today was rude, dismissive, and genuinely horrifying
to me.
As per Randyf's official response: old themes don't matter. Catalogue
accuracy doesn't matter if it's not a current set. BrickLink's interest
is no longer in correctly categorising Lego information. If you take those
away, what makes BrickLink any better than any other selling platform without
ties to Lego? If the set inventories your listings are uploaded by are wrong,
then... What's the point of BrickLink? Randyf makes this painfully clear
in his last comment about Pearl Dark Grey. They know it's wrong, but they
don't care. It's an old theme, from the past. It's not a priority.
It doesn't matter. I fixed Pearl Dark Grey in an afternoon, because I was
bored. What does that say about their experts?
If accuracy isn't important anymore, then what is? Revenue generation. Money.
Honestly, it breaks my heart. This was such a fantastic tool for Lego fans, without
even considering the buying/selling aspect. The first time I discovered BrickLink,
I was amazed at the wealth of information at my fingertips. Knowing what I do
now though, it's just... Sad. It's a facade. Maybe it was that once,
but it definitely isn't anymore. The upcoming alterations to mould variants
is just further proof of this, and that's coming from someone who initially
agreed with a lot of those specific changes. It's a shame to see how far
it's fallen. I'd rescind my offers of free labour/exchange of information,
but given that they were never appreciated, let alone noticed in the first place...
Oof.
I won't be checking this thread anymore. I have my answer. BrickLink doesn't
care about the past. My beloved Bionicle, which again, helped to save Lego
from bankruptcy, is irrelevant. It doesn't generate enough money, and
therefore doesn't need accurate categorisation.
I have the answers to the majority of these cataloguing issues either in my head,
in the Guide I wrote for the Bionicle community, or in my Google Drive. I offered
everything I've learned over the past 4 years, literally hundreds of hours
of work. The exact work cited as being too difficult, or too time-intensive,
was handed to you on a platter. BrickLink didn't even lift the lid to have
a looksie.
I leave you with this image: 3 Guurahk staff heads (Part #44817). Each of these
is a legitimate, official Lego colour. BrickLink believes these are all the same
silver. If you don't see that as an issue, just wait until they futz with
a theme you do care about. I'm sure it'll matter then.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | jennnifer | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 17:26 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 69 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| Your point might come across better if your tone was not so mean and antagonistic.
I know that's probably not what you want to hear at this point, but there
it is.
We get it, you know Bionicle. Changes are needed. They are not being made at
your pace. It's annoying.
But, there are real people here you are shouting at and it's not a perfect
system. So, please consider calming down and being patient.
Thanks,
~Jen
In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | It's definitely niche hahaha, but it's the one I fell ass-backwards into.
The not-so-wee-anymore Bionicle community was plagued by misinformation, and
catalogue inaccuracies. My physical health failed on me a few years before Covid
went on its world tour, so I've had a lot of time on my hands, and a passion
for dumb mysteries. That being said, Bionicle's limited catalogue of parts
does make it easier to study in-depth. Even in its current state of, well,
death lol, it's still a significant part of Lego's history. It's
commonly known that Bionicle is one of the themes that helped pull Lego out of
near-bankruptcy, along with Star Wars. Just because it's an out of production
theme, or doesn't have a bajillion parts, it doesn't make categorising
it accurately any less important.
As for someone with the knowledge and willingness to actually do the work - I
offered to, for free. 3 times before today, if I recall? I just wanted to fix
this mess. We're only at this heated point of discussion today because I
was ignored repeatedly, despite using the proper channels. Even worse, the response
I finally did receive today was rude, dismissive, and genuinely horrifying
to me.
As per Randyf's official response: old themes don't matter. Catalogue
accuracy doesn't matter if it's not a current set. BrickLink's interest
is no longer in correctly categorising Lego information. If you take those
away, what makes BrickLink any better than any other selling platform without
ties to Lego? If the set inventories your listings are uploaded by are wrong,
then... What's the point of BrickLink? Randyf makes this painfully clear
in his last comment about Pearl Dark Grey. They know it's wrong, but they
don't care. It's an old theme, from the past. It's not a priority.
It doesn't matter. I fixed Pearl Dark Grey in an afternoon, because I was
bored. What does that say about their experts?
If accuracy isn't important anymore, then what is? Revenue generation. Money.
Honestly, it breaks my heart. This was such a fantastic tool for Lego fans, without
even considering the buying/selling aspect. The first time I discovered BrickLink,
I was amazed at the wealth of information at my fingertips. Knowing what I do
now though, it's just... Sad. It's a facade. Maybe it was that once,
but it definitely isn't anymore. The upcoming alterations to mould variants
is just further proof of this, and that's coming from someone who initially
agreed with a lot of those specific changes. It's a shame to see how far
it's fallen. I'd rescind my offers of free labour/exchange of information,
but given that they were never appreciated, let alone noticed in the first place...
Oof.
I won't be checking this thread anymore. I have my answer. BrickLink doesn't
care about the past. My beloved Bionicle, which again, helped to save Lego
from bankruptcy, is irrelevant. It doesn't generate enough money, and
therefore doesn't need accurate categorisation.
I have the answers to the majority of these cataloguing issues either in my head,
in the Guide I wrote for the Bionicle community, or in my Google Drive. I offered
everything I've learned over the past 4 years, literally hundreds of hours
of work. The exact work cited as being too difficult, or too time-intensive,
was handed to you on a platter. BrickLink didn't even lift the lid to have
a looksie.
I leave you with this image: 3 Guurahk staff heads (Part #44817). Each of these
is a legitimate, official Lego colour. BrickLink believes these are all the same
silver. If you don't see that as an issue, just wait until they futz with
a theme you do care about. I'm sure it'll matter then.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Brickman4you | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 17:47 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 72 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, jennnifer writes:
| | Your point might come across better if your tone was not so mean and antagonistic.
I know that's probably not what you want to hear at this point, but there
it is.
We get it, you know Bionicle. Changes are needed. They are not being made at
your pace. It's annoying.
But, there are real people here you are shouting at and it's not a perfect
system. So, please consider calming down and being patient.
Thanks,
~Jen
|
+ ONE
Dam, 16 feedback (8 as seller and 8 as buyer) and you want to run Bricklink.
Bionicle has been put to bed, so thanks to all those old timers that contributed
to the bricklink database. It's time to move on and look forward to the
changes to come.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | yorbrick | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 17:58 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 61 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| | | What does that say about their experts?
If accuracy isn't important anymore, then what is?
|
From your store terms:
Minor Mould Changes
Lego likes to alter moulds like, a lot. A lot a lot. I think I have like 4 different
variants of the black 2l pin or something? Little changes like this are not
my responsibility.
Which seems strange for someone so into details, more than the catalogue crew.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Tracyd | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 18:01 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 61 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, yorbrick writes:
| | | | What does that say about their experts?
If accuracy isn't important anymore, then what is?
|
From your store terms:
Minor Mould Changes
Lego likes to alter moulds like, a lot. A lot a lot. I think I have like 4 different
variants of the black 2l pin or something? Little changes like this are not
my responsibility.
Which seems strange for someone so into details, more than the catalogue crew.
|
Pins are Technic not Bionicle. Everyone has their focus, but the catalog team
has to focus on all Bricklink and keep up with the things the vast majority are
interested in.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Yo_Yo_Flamingo | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 18:33 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 62 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, 1001bricks writes:
| | | | | | Are you suggesting that The Lego Group with a valuation of $12.2 billion isn't
capable of hiring a couple more catalogers or even implementing the information
offered here for free? I'm just curious here since surely they could afford
a handful more employees to get on top of things.
|
These kind of changes and cataloging require people with expertise in both BrickLink
and LEGO. I would guess there's not a handful of people just hanging around
waiting to be hired.
|
Plus find those with a deep knowledge of Bionicle!
I know only one - but it's OP who's complaining in Forum
|
There's a few of us here
The name might not imply it, but Bionicle is my mainstay
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Nubs_Select | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 16:07 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 44 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, vaderman212 writes:
| | In Catalog, Nubs_Select writes:
| | | | or saying that 'fixing things from the past
is not a priority' when the majority of Lego is in fact, from the past,
is a very very strange stance.
|
it is a very very small catalogue team, lego is releasing more and more sets
every year. what brings in the most profit for bricklink is getting new inventories
and parts added so new items can be listed and sets parted out. so with the very
small team and an ever-growing workload, they simply cannot prioritize much else.
|
Are you suggesting that The Lego Group with a valuation of $12.2 billion isn't
capable of hiring a couple more catalogers or even implementing the information
offered here for free? I'm just curious here since surely they could afford
a handful more employees to get on top of things.
|
just because they "can" do something doesn't mean by any means they
"will" do something. considering we still haven't gotten basic seller
tools to help us monitor sales its highly unlikely they are going to hire additional
people to help update the catalogue
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | 1001bricks | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 15:33 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 62 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| | | Right now, the recurring joke among Oceania-based Bionicle fans is that I do
a better job at Being BrickLink than BrickLink.
|
While this, it's the month of Love.
Please read my few lines here to help you put things in perpective?
https://www.bricklink.com/message.asp?ID=1451981
HTH.
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 21:10 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 115 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Thanks for your response, Randy. I really appreciate it.
Only 150 Light Grey Metallic still has problems, and BrickLink's catalogue
doesn't even recognise it as being used in Bionicle. It definitely is, both
repeatedly and often interchangeably with 131 and 296, which themselves were
used interchangeably with each other in some cases. The link on the history of
silvers you have provided is not accurate, and my data conclusively proves that.
If you have the information you need, as you claim, then why have you skipped
150 entirely? Can you tell me what year(s) 150 made its way into the Bionicle
catalogue?
|
I believe the problem you're having is misidentifying 131, 150, and 296.
150 Light Grey Metallic is recognized on Bricklink, called "Pearl Very Light
Gray". In BIONICLE, it was ONLY used during 2003 for Kraata & Krana-Kal.
There are no other 150 parts in BIONICLE.
296 is a color that was used very briefly during 2006, introduced along side
"Warm Gold"/"Pearl Gold", but was quickly retired in favor of
the older 131 Silver - effectively all the 2006 sets use 296 in early batches,
131 in later batches. While 296 was used in 2007, this was only in Exo-Force,
for the marbled torsos, and even then, those were soon phased out for solid 131
ones, that's why the 2007 Exo-Force sets have alternate Minifigures.
What a lot of BIONICLE fans don't seem to grasp is that the silver used for
the Kal sockets, the silver used for the Nuva armor, and the silver used for
the 2007-2009 weapon parts, are all 131 Silver, despite how different they look.
This primarily stems from two different things:
- That 131 itself was adjusted several times during its lifespan (as were 148
Dark Grey Metallic, and 297 Warm Gold)
- That LEGO's materials and colors were all adjusted around 2005-2006 as
they moved to mixing colors in-house (at least, that's what I've come
to understand). This would be the source of not only 131 being different, but
also why the Kanohi Rau in the Toa Nokama set differs from that in the Dalu set.
The result of these adjustments is that 131 become more consistent. Before 2006,
polypropylene parts molded in 131 looked noticably different from ABS parts (a
problem not just with 131 but also with other "metallic" colors like
145, 147, and 149). After 2006, the color had a consistently lighter hue, matching
how it had always looked in ABS plastic.
We know when these colors were used - Throughout the LEGO community we have quite
a lot of data to go on gathered from LEGO, palette tiles to compare physical
parts with, etc.
On top of this, all LEGO colors have some degree of variation, both from adjustments
made over time and from poor quality control. This makes for *color variation*,
something not recognized on Bricklink (besides Rust :v) not separate colors.
A somewhat common misconception I've come across in the BIONICLE community
is that 150 is the lighter silver you find in the early 2006 sets, but this not
correct. That color is 296. This likely stems from a second misconception, that
the lighter parts used from 2006 onwards are 296, which as I've detailed
above is also not correct.
Yes, there have been some glaring issues in the BIONICLE part of the catalogue
- All of the ones Randy mentioned I am really happy are being addressed (as someone
who has researched Zamor Spheres, I'll be keeping an as careful eye as I
can at how that develops). There's some others as well, like incorrect listings
of the Kanohi/Krana packs which I've brought up in a past topic.
However, the case of silver is one that at this point stems from many BIONICLE
fans (and I say this being a BIONICLE fan) not knowing the subject as well as
they think they do, either jumping to conclusions or getting all their information
from Bricklink (people still think in terms of Pearl Light Gray and Flat Silver).
The latter is also the primary reason why I want Tahu's eyestalk color recognized,
as BIONICLE fans are just not familiar with Trans-Dark Pink and thus do not realize
it's not the same color at all.
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Yo_Yo_Flamingo | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 23:30 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 42 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, WOLKsite writes:
| | In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Thanks for your response, Randy. I really appreciate it.
Only 150 Light Grey Metallic still has problems, and BrickLink's catalogue
doesn't even recognise it as being used in Bionicle. It definitely is, both
repeatedly and often interchangeably with 131 and 296, which themselves were
used interchangeably with each other in some cases. The link on the history of
silvers you have provided is not accurate, and my data conclusively proves that.
If you have the information you need, as you claim, then why have you skipped
150 entirely? Can you tell me what year(s) 150 made its way into the Bionicle
catalogue?
|
I believe the problem you're having is misidentifying 131, 150, and 296.
150 Light Grey Metallic is recognized on Bricklink, called "Pearl Very Light
Gray". In BIONICLE, it was ONLY used during 2003 for Kraata & Krana-Kal.
There are no other 150 parts in BIONICLE.
296 is a color that was used very briefly during 2006, introduced along side
"Warm Gold"/"Pearl Gold", but was quickly retired in favor of
the older 131 Silver - effectively all the 2006 sets use 296 in early batches,
131 in later batches. While 296 was used in 2007, this was only in Exo-Force,
for the marbled torsos, and even then, those were soon phased out for solid 131
ones, that's why the 2007 Exo-Force sets have alternate Minifigures.
What a lot of BIONICLE fans don't seem to grasp is that the silver used for
the Kal sockets, the silver used for the Nuva armor, and the silver used for
the 2007-2009 weapon parts, are all 131 Silver, despite how different they look.
This primarily stems from two different things:
- That 131 itself was adjusted several times during its lifespan (as were 148
Dark Grey Metallic, and 297 Warm Gold)
- That LEGO's materials and colors were all adjusted around 2005-2006 as
they moved to mixing colors in-house (at least, that's what I've come
to understand). This would be the source of not only 131 being different, but
also why the Kanohi Rau in the Toa Nokama set differs from that in the Dalu set.
The result of these adjustments is that 131 become more consistent. Before 2006,
polypropylene parts molded in 131 looked noticably different from ABS parts (a
problem not just with 131 but also with other "metallic" colors like
145, 147, and 149). After 2006, the color had a consistently lighter hue, matching
how it had always looked in ABS plastic.
We know when these colors were used - Throughout the LEGO community we have quite
a lot of data to go on gathered from LEGO, palette tiles to compare physical
parts with, etc.
On top of this, all LEGO colors have some degree of variation, both from adjustments
made over time and from poor quality control. This makes for *color variation*,
something not recognized on Bricklink (besides Rust :v) not separate colors.
A somewhat common misconception I've come across in the BIONICLE community
is that 150 is the lighter silver you find in the early 2006 sets, but this not
correct. That color is 296. This likely stems from a second misconception, that
the lighter parts used from 2006 onwards are 296, which as I've detailed
above is also not correct.
Yes, there have been some glaring issues in the BIONICLE part of the catalogue
- All of the ones Randy mentioned I am really happy are being addressed (as someone
who has researched Zamor Spheres, I'll be keeping an as careful eye as I
can at how that develops). There's some others as well, like incorrect listings
of the Kanohi/Krana packs which I've brought up in a past topic.
However, the case of silver is one that at this point stems from many BIONICLE
fans (and I say this being a BIONICLE fan) not knowing the subject as well as
they think they do, either jumping to conclusions or getting all their information
from Bricklink (people still think in terms of Pearl Light Gray and Flat Silver).
The latter is also the primary reason why I want Tahu's eyestalk color recognized,
as BIONICLE fans are just not familiar with Trans-Dark Pink and thus do not realize
it's not the same color at all.
|
On top of this, requesting regular sellers to differentiate between variants
of silver is... well, I can already tell you I know that wouldn't go very
well, unfortunately.
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | randyf | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 00:04 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 66 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, WOLKsite writes:
| | Yes, there have been some glaring issues in the BIONICLE part of the catalogue
- All of the ones Randy mentioned I am really happy are being addressed (as someone
who has researched Zamor Spheres, I'll be keeping an as careful eye as I
can at how that develops). There's some others as well, like incorrect listings
of the Kanohi/Krana packs which I've brought up in a past topic.
|
Just don't hold me to any timelines or promises!
| | The latter is also the primary reason why I want Tahu's eyestalk color recognized,
as BIONICLE fans are just not familiar with Trans-Dark Pink and thus do not realize
it's not the same color at all.
|
I will do what I can to get 158 officially recognized here. There are a couple
of other minor colors that I will be pushing for next before trying to tackle
the silvers more, so I might as well add this one in there.
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Nubs_Select | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 00:41 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 53 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, randyf writes:
| | In Catalog, WOLKsite writes:
| | Yes, there have been some glaring issues in the BIONICLE part of the catalogue
- All of the ones Randy mentioned I am really happy are being addressed (as someone
who has researched Zamor Spheres, I'll be keeping an as careful eye as I
can at how that develops). There's some others as well, like incorrect listings
of the Kanohi/Krana packs which I've brought up in a past topic.
|
Just don't hold me to any timelines or promises!
| | The latter is also the primary reason why I want Tahu's eyestalk color recognized,
as BIONICLE fans are just not familiar with Trans-Dark Pink and thus do not realize
it's not the same color at all.
|
I will do what I can to get 158 officially recognized here. There are a couple
of other minor colors that I will be pushing for next before trying to tackle
the silvers more, so I might as well add this one in there.
|
Sounds like an amazing plan!
(image of randyf below)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 03:42 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 40 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, randyf writes:
| | In Catalog, WOLKsite writes:
| | Yes, there have been some glaring issues in the BIONICLE part of the catalogue
- All of the ones Randy mentioned I am really happy are being addressed (as someone
who has researched Zamor Spheres, I'll be keeping an as careful eye as I
can at how that develops). There's some others as well, like incorrect listings
of the Kanohi/Krana packs which I've brought up in a past topic.
|
Just don't hold me to any timelines or promises!
|
Of course! You're doing your best
| | | | The latter is also the primary reason why I want Tahu's eyestalk color recognized,
as BIONICLE fans are just not familiar with Trans-Dark Pink and thus do not realize
it's not the same color at all.
|
I will do what I can to get 158 officially recognized here. There are a couple
of other minor colors that I will be pushing for next before trying to tackle
the silvers more, so I might as well add this one in there.
|
Yay!
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 09:26 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 53 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| You really just laid it all out here, and I was too stubborn to even take it
in. How foolish of me. This is literally the clearest explanation of this whole
debacle on the internet. I was an arrogant prick, and I cannot apologise enough.
This information is priceless. Thank you for persisting in your attempts to correct
me. This means everything to me.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 09:35 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 50 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | You really just laid it all out here, and I was too stubborn to even take it
in. How foolish of me. This is literally the clearest explanation of this whole
debacle on the internet. I was an arrogant prick, and I cannot apologise enough.
This information is priceless. Thank you for persisting in your attempts to correct
me. This means everything to me.
|
No worries! I was actually worried I was coming off too harshly.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 09:49 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 48 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| Even if you were (which you weren't lol), you were justified in doing so.
Now if you'll excuse me, I have to un[REDACTED] this cluster[REDACTED] that
I helped create... Goddammit.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 10:10 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 51 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Even if you were (which you weren't lol), you were justified in doing so.
Now if you'll excuse me, I have to un[REDACTED] this cluster[REDACTED] that
I helped create... Goddammit.
|
For what it's worth, I find listing Cool Silver parts as "Pearl Very
Light Gray" is beneficial until the time when the color is properly recognized
on the site. Makes them far easier to find and buy
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | randyf | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 15:48 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 36 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, WOLKsite writes:
| | In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Even if you were (which you weren't lol), you were justified in doing so.
Now if you'll excuse me, I have to un[REDACTED] this cluster[REDACTED] that
I helped create... Goddammit.
|
For what it's worth, I find listing Cool Silver parts as "Pearl Very
Light Gray" is beneficial until the time when the color is properly recognized
on the site. Makes them far easier to find and buy
|
I don't want to get anyone's hopes up, so I will simply state for the
record here that adding Cool Silver to the site is going to be a very hard sell
for a number of reasons that I won't get into right now. I think the Pearl
Dark Grays have a better chance at getting sorted out than getting Cool Silver
recognized, so that should tell you something.
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 16:04 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 31 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| Sorry again mate, self-righteousness blinded me to how big an ass I was being.
Frustration does not look good on me, and that's entirely my fault. Even
worse, I was wrong! Mainly just have to swap some names around, but I do have
a bunch of part/colour versions that are missing
Big shame that 296 wont be getting an official colour listing any time soon,
but c'est la vie. Any chance of getting some distinction between the older
and newer 131 formulations?
I sent a couple of emails btw, mind letting me know if they actually arrived?
Their info was mostly obsolete, and I've killed the link I included while
I fix the content, but there are a couple of things that definitely aren't
recognised and (total guess on my part) would be pretty easy to add to the catalogue
without any major issues.
First off, 131 'v2' leaked into the early Hero Factory stuff before the
big switcheroo to 315. Here's a Surge weapon in both colours, which I'm
guessing could just be added as an alternate part?
Secondly, and slightly more important, is the missing Kraahkan: the Pearl Black
4-Hole. This mould is 2 years older than BrickLink's catalogue recognises,
and originates in 2003 with Makuta Teridax. On its right is the noticeably darker
Black 4-Hole, from Makuta Icarax in 2008. You thought silvers were bad? Now we
have to deal with different blacks.
The catalogue does recognise the different blacks (see Bomonga vs Vorahk
heads), but this instance has been missed somehow. See, I'm not entirely
full of shit lmao
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | randyf | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 16:29 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 45 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Sorry again mate, self-righteousness blinded me to how big an ass I was being.
Frustration does not look good on me, and that's entirely my fault. Even
worse, I was wrong! Mainly just have to swap some names around, but I do have
a bunch of part/colour versions that are missing
Big shame that 296 wont be getting an official colour listing any time soon,
but c'est la vie. Any chance of getting some distinction between the older
and newer 131 formulations?
|
Nope. That is a complete non-starter, unfortunately. BrickLink does not recognize
variations of colors or reformulations.
| | I sent a couple of emails btw, mind letting me know if they actually arrived?
Their info was mostly obsolete, and I've killed the link I included while
I fix the content, but there are a couple of things that definitely aren't
recognised and (total guess on my part) would be pretty easy to add to the catalogue
without any major issues.
|
I got one today. 👍
| | First off, 131 'v2' leaked into the early Hero Factory stuff before the
big switcheroo to 315. Here's a Surge weapon in both colours, which I'm
guessing could just be added as an alternate part?
|
Yes, that is an easy thing to solve. We usually just need proof that both colors
were used for a part to make that happen, unless it is a part that was used across
multiple sets. Then we need proof that the color actually appeared in a given
set and not just speculation. This is usually accomplished by looking for sources
online showing original sets being opened or buying and looking into a new set.
Used sources are almost completely disregarded these days unless there is no
other way.
| | Secondly, and slightly more important, is the missing Kraahkan: the Pearl Black
4-Hole. This mould is 2 years older than BrickLink's catalogue recognises,
and originates in 2003 with Makuta Teridax. On its right is the noticeably darker
Black 4-Hole, from Makuta Icarax in 2008. You thought silvers were bad? Now we
have to deal with different blacks.
|
I will be looking into this one shortly.
| | The catalogue does recognise the different blacks (see Bomonga vs Vorahk
heads), but this instance has been missed somehow. See, I'm not entirely
full of shit lmao
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | here4bricks614 | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 16:49 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 42 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| | | | | Big shame that 296 wont be getting an official colour listing any time soon,
but c'est la vie. Any chance of getting some distinction between the older
and newer 131 formulations?
|
Nope. That is a complete non-starter, unfortunately. BrickLink does not recognize
variations of colors or reformulations.
|
Are these grandfathered in? We have enough data to confirm that these are just
a crappy red.
Does 296 have as much of a chance of being added as 22? The clock is ticking
with that color, as LEGO will only continue to release more parts in 221. They
recently started using 3062s.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | randyf | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 18:29 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 46 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, here4bricks614 writes:
| | | | | | Big shame that 296 wont be getting an official colour listing any time soon,
but c'est la vie. Any chance of getting some distinction between the older
and newer 131 formulations?
|
Nope. That is a complete non-starter, unfortunately. BrickLink does not recognize
variations of colors or reformulations.
|
Are these grandfathered in? We have enough data to confirm that these are just
a crappy red.
|
A decision was never reached on those, but my guess at this point would be that
they would be grandfathered in. I really don't know, though, until it is
discussed at some point again.
| | Does 296 have as much of a chance of being added as 22? The clock is ticking
with that color, as LEGO will only continue to release more parts in 221. They
recently started using 3062s.
|
I would say it has a better chance than 22 which will almost surely never be
added. I just know that 296 is going to be a very hard sell with the direction
the site is moving in.
The next one we are going to get moving on is Rose. I just need to find some
time to contact you all and discuss some things that I would then bring back
to the team for further discussion. In this case, the addition has already been
agreed to, but I need to have a plan of action in place along with all of the
required data and images ready to go.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | 1001bricks | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 18:47 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 47 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, randyf writes:
| | In Catalog, here4bricks614 writes:
| | | | | | Big shame that 296 wont be getting an official colour listing any time soon,
but c'est la vie. Any chance of getting some distinction between the older
and newer 131 formulations?
|
Nope. That is a complete non-starter, unfortunately. BrickLink does not recognize
variations of colors or reformulations.
|
Are these grandfathered in? We have enough data to confirm that these are just
a crappy red.
|
|
Wow - I hear discussions about rust color since I registered on BrickLink!
Unbelievable.
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 19:00 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 42 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, 1001bricks writes:
| | In Catalog, randyf writes:
| | In Catalog, here4bricks614 writes:
| | | | | | Big shame that 296 wont be getting an official colour listing any time soon,
but c'est la vie. Any chance of getting some distinction between the older
and newer 131 formulations?
|
Nope. That is a complete non-starter, unfortunately. BrickLink does not recognize
variations of colors or reformulations.
|
Are these grandfathered in? We have enough data to confirm that these are just
a crappy red.
|
|
Wow - I hear discussions about rust color since I registered on BrickLink!
Unbelievable.
|
This is not about ALL Rust colored parts.
BrickLink Rust is a group that currently contains:
LEGO 13 Red Orange / Fabuland Red
https://www.flickr.com/photos/126975831@N07/14960664342/
LEGO 216 Rust
https://www.flickr.com/photos/126975831@N07/15139390746/
"Crappy red" (LEGO 21 Bright Red, but softer material with poor color
matching. These parts are a color variation.)
https://www.flickr.com/photos/126975831@N07/15077477860/
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | 1001bricks | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 19:02 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 36 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, WoutR writes:
| | In Catalog, 1001bricks writes:
| | In Catalog, randyf writes:
| | In Catalog, here4bricks614 writes:
| | | | | | Big shame that 296 wont be getting an official colour listing any time soon,
but c'est la vie. Any chance of getting some distinction between the older
and newer 131 formulations?
|
Nope. That is a complete non-starter, unfortunately. BrickLink does not recognize
variations of colors or reformulations.
|
Are these grandfathered in? We have enough data to confirm that these are just
a crappy red.
|
|
Wow - I hear discussions about rust color since I registered on BrickLink!
Unbelievable.
|
This is not about ALL Rust colored parts.
BrickLink Rust is a group that currently contains:
LEGO 13 Red Orange / Fabuland Red
https://www.flickr.com/photos/126975831@N07/14960664342/
LEGO 216 Rust
https://www.flickr.com/photos/126975831@N07/15139390746/
|
Ah sorry, thanks to let me/us know!
So, it's Red, so there's no problem?
I guess you've already seen Yellow Technic almost orange?
Again, sorry if I read too fast the whole.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 19:20 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 34 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, 1001bricks writes:
| |
So, it's Red, so there's no problem?
I guess you've already seen Yellow Technic almost orange?
Again, sorry if I read too fast the whole.
|
It is a similar situation, with a different cause.
Some Light Gray parts also have this problem
https://www.flickr.com/photos/126975831@N07/15210696207/
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 19:16 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 34 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, randyf writes:
| |
I would say it has a better chance than 22 which will almost surely never be
added. I just know that 296 is going to be a very hard sell with the direction
the site is moving in.
|
I think that the difference between 22 and 221 will be extremely difficult for
most sellers. Especially for the parts that were made during the transition period
that appear in both versions.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/126975831@N07/14777415117/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/126975831@N07/14988645798/
296 will be a challenge, but considering the amount of questions on the forum
and the increasing interest in Bionicle, I think that BrickLink should separate
them. I think it will increase catalog accuracy and reduce confusion. It might
take a lot of comparison photos though...
| | The next one we are going to get moving on is Rose. I just need to find some
time to contact you all and discuss some things that I would then bring back
to the team for further discussion. In this case, the addition has already been
agreed to, but I need to have a plan of action in place along with all of the
required data and images ready to go.
|
Good to hear! This is one of the remaining color groupings that is bugging me
most.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/126975831@N07/14931522786/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/126975831@N07/14776964407/
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | here4bricks614 | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 19:28 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 35 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, WoutR writes:
Those are actually the easiest. The fact that 221 has been reformulated so many
times is what makes this difficult. Any part in 22 looks identical to modern
221, but almost nothing like original 221. The best time to address this was
2004.
It's disappointing to hear that its odds are low, especially given the fact
that it is very much doable and is backed up by extensive research. The concerns
behind its addition are understandable, however.
Still hoping for 225.
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 19:40 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 45 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, here4bricks614 writes:
| | In Catalog, WoutR writes:
Those are actually the easiest. The fact that 221 has been reformulated so many
times is what makes this difficult. Any part in 22 looks identical to modern
221, but almost nothing like original 221. The best time to address this was
2004.
|
I think we can probably separate them in the inventories. But if a seller finds
some parts in a lot of used bricks, can he identify them correctly?
I'd love to get the history correct and have all the accurate information
in the catalog, but I think that there are to many challenges to make this work
in Bricklink stores.
| | It's disappointing to hear that its odds are low, especially given the fact
that it is very much doable and is backed up by extensive research. The concerns
behind its addition are understandable, however.
Still hoping for 225.
|
It is a rare color, but one that should be in the catalog.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | randyf | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 13:19 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 57 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, WoutR writes:
| | In Catalog, here4bricks614 writes:
| | In Catalog, WoutR writes:
Those are actually the easiest. The fact that 221 has been reformulated so many
times is what makes this difficult. Any part in 22 looks identical to modern
221, but almost nothing like original 221. The best time to address this was
2004.
|
I think we can probably separate them in the inventories. But if a seller finds
some parts in a lot of used bricks, can he identify them correctly?
I'd love to get the history correct and have all the accurate information
in the catalog, but I think that there are to many challenges to make this work
in Bricklink stores.
|
Yep. This is the balance that we have to consider with each new color added to
the site and why we have long discussions about each of the new additions. So
far, we have heard no complaints from the numerous colors added over the last
few years, and I would say that is due to the fact that so many of them are obscure
and rare colors that most sellers will never have in their posession or need
to even think about. However, when we start talking about dark pinks and silvers,
the calculus changes dramatically.
| | | | It's disappointing to hear that its odds are low, especially given the fact
that it is very much doable and is backed up by extensive research. The concerns
behind its addition are understandable, however.
Still hoping for 225.
|
It is a rare color, but one that should be in the catalog.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 16:52 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 35 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| And with our powers combined, we just ruined 99% of 'complete' mask displays
in the world... Love it. Wait til I bust out the unrecognised 296 masks...
I'll finish my reworks, incorporate the list of known 296 parts, and get
back to you with like, actual useful data that's right this time.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 19:56 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 44 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | And with our powers combined, we just ruined 99% of 'complete' mask displays
in the world... Love it. Wait til I bust out the unrecognised 296 masks...
I'll finish my reworks, incorporate the list of known 296 parts, and get
back to you with like, actual useful data that's right this time.
|
The amount of times I've wanted to point out that there's two Rode lmao
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 01:21 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 40 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| There's 3! Both versions of 131, and 296. I just woke up, lemme put my brain
on and I'll grab some pics for ya. Least I can do after the mess I made yesterday...
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 03:00 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 40 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| | 131 v1, 131 v2, and our buddy 296. |
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 03:20 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 32 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | 131 v1, 131 v2, and our buddy 296.
|
Oh wow!  Yeah, then there was definitely a production period between retiring
296 and reformulating 131.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 03:41 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 39 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| A friend of mine just shot me some new info. He's got a 296 Rode that he's
had from childhood. It came from 8892 Piraka Outpost, so we have one source confirmed
at least! Jury's still out on the other sets.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 04:21 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 35 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | A friend of mine just shot me some new info. He's got a 296 Rode that he's
had from childhood. It came from 8892 Piraka Outpost, so we have one source confirmed
at least! Jury's still out on the other sets.
|
If it helps, release dates (that I know of) for the 2006 BIONICLE sets are as
follows:
December 2005: Matoran of Voya Nui (8721 thru 8726)
January 2006: Piraka (8900 thru 8905) & Zamor Spheres (8719)
March 2006: Irnakk (8626), Axonn & Brutaka (8733, 8734)
July 2006: Race for the Mask of Life (8624), Umbra (8625)
August 2006: Toa Inika (8727 thru 8732), Vezon & Fenrakk (8764), Playsets
(8892 thru 8894), Vezon & Kardas (10204)
August, week 33: 6934 Good Guy
August, week 34: 6935 Bad Guy
December 2006: QUICK promotions (6934 again, 7717 thru 7719)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 05:02 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 34 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| God, that just raises further questions. Excluding playsets, everything except
the Good Guy, Bad Guy, and QUICK promos are confirmed bearers of 296,
in at least one part. Concerning.
Also concerning is this 131 v1 Mahri shoulder my mate just turned up, that absolutely
shouldn't exist according to the catalogue. There must have been a little
bit of 131 v1 left that got used for 2007 sets? The plot thickens.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 05:17 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 37 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| | Oh god no, why? |
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 07:05 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 36 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
Or perhaps they failed to fix the inconsistency issues/made it worse... Hmm
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 07:32 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 41 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| Mahri shoulder piece is 131 v2. Hydruka armour piece is 315. Couple
of mates had them lying around, tested 'em against confirmed iterations of
those colours. Neither fit the timeline at all. Just when I thought I had things
ironed out...
I did at least finish rewriting the silver overview thing I work on for my Parts
Guide:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1we0sW-jnigQxDkBpY3hUn2n3IEGLX6ZyM08-3sXsfZI/edit?usp=sharing
I doubt there's anything new to you there, it's just nice having an overview
put together.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 08:18 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 27 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Mahri shoulder piece is 131 v2. Hydruka armour piece is 315. Couple
of mates had them lying around, tested 'em against confirmed iterations of
those colours. Neither fit the timeline at all. Just when I thought I had things
ironed out...
I did at least finish rewriting the silver overview thing I work on for my Parts
Guide:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1we0sW-jnigQxDkBpY3hUn2n3IEGLX6ZyM08-3sXsfZI/edit?usp=sharing
I doubt there's anything new to you there, it's just nice having an overview
put together.
|
Maybe the Hydruka armor is from a 2011 batch of ?
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 08:22 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 35 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| That's our best option. Still no idea where that Mahri shoulder came in...
It'll keep. I habe this pile of 296 parts to pore over now that I've
cleaned my mess up.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 08:36 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 39 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Mahri shoulder piece is 131 v2. Hydruka armour piece is 315. Couple
of mates had them lying around, tested 'em against confirmed iterations of
those colours. Neither fit the timeline at all. Just when I thought I had things
ironed out...
I did at least finish rewriting the silver overview thing I work on for my Parts
Guide:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1we0sW-jnigQxDkBpY3hUn2n3IEGLX6ZyM08-3sXsfZI/edit?usp=sharing
I doubt there's anything new to you there, it's just nice having an overview
put together.
|
309 is probably not technically correct for the 2001 Hau. That color number was
introduced later. At that time, the chrome silver was seen as a surface decoration
pattern that did not get its own (ink) color number.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 09:32 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 32 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, WoutR writes:
| | In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Mahri shoulder piece is 131 v2. Hydruka armour piece is 315. Couple
of mates had them lying around, tested 'em against confirmed iterations of
those colours. Neither fit the timeline at all. Just when I thought I had things
ironed out...
I did at least finish rewriting the silver overview thing I work on for my Parts
Guide:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1we0sW-jnigQxDkBpY3hUn2n3IEGLX6ZyM08-3sXsfZI/edit?usp=sharing
I doubt there's anything new to you there, it's just nice having an overview
put together.
|
309 is probably not technically correct for the 2001 Hau. That color number was
introduced later. At that time, the chrome silver was seen as a surface decoration
pattern that did not get its own (ink) color number.
|
Interesting. Does it still apply to the same colour, and process of creation?
If it's identical to the later 309 parts, I'll probably leave it. It
shows up in most databases as 309, and if I start splitting hairs there people
might get a bit confused.
As an aside, there's an unlisted Light Grey Hau under the chrome! I'll
have a dud one in hand this week to strip and provide evidence of, it's the
last Mata mask I need (aside from prototypes).
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 10:17 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 33 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | In Catalog, WoutR writes:
| | In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Mahri shoulder piece is 131 v2. Hydruka armour piece is 315. Couple
of mates had them lying around, tested 'em against confirmed iterations of
those colours. Neither fit the timeline at all. Just when I thought I had things
ironed out...
I did at least finish rewriting the silver overview thing I work on for my Parts
Guide:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1we0sW-jnigQxDkBpY3hUn2n3IEGLX6ZyM08-3sXsfZI/edit?usp=sharing
I doubt there's anything new to you there, it's just nice having an overview
put together.
|
309 is probably not technically correct for the 2001 Hau. That color number was
introduced later. At that time, the chrome silver was seen as a surface decoration
pattern that did not get its own (ink) color number.
|
Interesting. Does it still apply to the same colour, and process of creation?
If it's identical to the later 309 parts, I'll probably leave it. It
shows up in most databases as 309, and if I start splitting hairs there people
might get a bit confused.
As an aside, there's an unlisted Light Grey Hau under the chrome! I'll
have a dud one in hand this week to strip and provide evidence of, it's the
last Mata mask I need (aside from prototypes).
|
It's functionally the same thing. Same with 298. 309 was introduced around
'07-10, 298 was introduced in 2005. Since around 2014, LEGO uses 336 Silver
Ink instead. I'm not sure if there's any actual difference, however it
and the other four ink colors (334 Copper Ink, 335 Gold Ink, 337 Titanium Ink)
seem to cover both chrome and metallic coatings, as well as printing (with 334
and 337 only having been used for printing).
And yes - that grey Hau is element/PCC 4161805, the chrome one directly following
as 4161806. From what I've heard, the so-called "Vacuum Metal Krana-Kal"
are also just regular chrome? I've never had one in hand.
148 is used in for 2002 and possibly for printing on the infected
Hau? Not entirely sure but it seems like a match.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 10:19 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 27 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, WOLKsite writes:
| | It's functionally the same thing. Same with 298. 309 was introduced around
'07-10, 298 was introduced in 2005. Since around 2014, LEGO uses 336 Silver
Ink instead. I'm not sure if there's any actual difference, however it
and the other four ink colors (334 Copper Ink, 335 Gold Ink, 337 Titanium Ink)
seem to cover both chrome and metallic coatings, as well as printing (with 334
and 337 only having been used for printing).
|
Perhaps also worth noting that the speckle/diffuse colors seem to have been retired
coinciding with the introduction of the new ink IDs. I'd guess they would
also be under that umbrella if they were still in use.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 10:20 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 31 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Interesting. Does it still apply to the same colour, and process of creation?
If it's identical to the later 309 parts, I'll probably leave it. It
shows up in most databases as 309, and if I start splitting hairs there people
might get a bit confused.
As an aside, there's an unlisted Light Grey Hau under the chrome! I'll
have a dud one in hand this week to strip and provide evidence of, it's the
last Mata mask I need (aside from prototypes).
|
For all practical purposes, it is identical.
You might want to include a note that it originally was seen as a decoration
on that Light Gray base, not a separate color in itself. Just in case someone
builds a color timeline based on your notes and this one does not fit in or distorts
everything.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 10:32 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 28 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, WoutR writes:
| | In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Interesting. Does it still apply to the same colour, and process of creation?
If it's identical to the later 309 parts, I'll probably leave it. It
shows up in most databases as 309, and if I start splitting hairs there people
might get a bit confused.
As an aside, there's an unlisted Light Grey Hau under the chrome! I'll
have a dud one in hand this week to strip and provide evidence of, it's the
last Mata mask I need (aside from prototypes).
|
For all practical purposes, it is identical.
You might want to include a note that it originally was seen as a decoration
on that Light Gray base, not a separate color in itself. Just in case someone
builds a color timeline based on your notes and this one does not fit in or distorts
everything.
|
Well, LEGO's data calls it 0 (undefined), so it's not quite like a decal
either. Need to look into this a little bit more when it comes to different eras,
but LEGO's data is very inconsistent - Some chrome/lacquered gold/silver
parts are listed as 127/297 or 131/296 respectively, others as 0, of course some
are 297-299 and 335-336. There doesn't seem to actually be any parts that
are actually listed as 309/310 because at that point, they were listing the parts
based on the plastic color beneath the coating.
And then there's hoses that are for some reason listed using the drum lacq
colors, which makes no sense.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 16:52 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 45 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Sorry again mate, self-righteousness blinded me to how big an ass I was being.
Frustration does not look good on me, and that's entirely my fault. Even
worse, I was wrong! Mainly just have to swap some names around, but I do have
a bunch of part/colour versions that are missing
|
These colors are complicated, especially because of the reformulations, different
materials and that fact that we did not have ANY official information before
2010.
I hope you gained some understanding about the catalog history here. People did
their best, with the knowledge they had. In addition, the catalog has to keep
a delicate balance between for example the available information, historical
accuracy, the needs of sellers, buyers and several different types of collectors
and specialists and the time available for the volunteers.
Look at how much the catalog colors changed since 2022:
https://www.bricklink.com/catalogColors.asp?sortBy=N
The amount of catalog changes made, all requiring manual work and verification
https://www.bricklink.com/catalogLogs.asp
Or simply the amount of items that are added daily:
https://www.bricklink.com/catalogList.asp
The workload is huge, so the volunteers have to prioritize. Our personal priorities
might be different sometimes, but we owe them much grattitude and appreciation
for their time and effort.
| | Big shame that 296 wont be getting an official colour listing any time soon,
but c'est la vie.
|
Best we can do for now is:
- collect reliable information and make that available
- take photos comparing the different versions. We could try to get them into
the catalog as alternate images (if the catalog admins agree).
- Add catalog notes to the parts (if the catalog admins agree).
- try to make https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=1096 as helpful as possible
| | Any chance of getting some distinction between the older
and newer 131 formulations?
|
If a seller only has a few parts, how is (s)he going to identify which one it
is?
I think this will not be possible for an average seller.
| | I sent a couple of emails btw, mind letting me know if they actually arrived?
Their info was mostly obsolete, and I've killed the link I included while
I fix the content, but there are a couple of things that definitely aren't
recognised and (total guess on my part) would be pretty easy to add to the catalogue
without any major issues.
First off, 131 'v2' leaked into the early Hero Factory stuff before the
big switcheroo to 315. Here's a Surge weapon in both colours, which I'm
guessing could just be added as an alternate part?
|
Have you seen
https://www.bricklink.com/catalogAdd.asp
You can add catalog items, photos of new colors or request inventory changes.
If you are certain, you can submit a catalog or inventory change request. Volunteers
will look at this, so it can take some time before they get to it. Depending
on their workload it can take weeks, but they will get to it. Note that requests
can be denied if there is insufficient proof, keeping the catalog reliable is
a huge challenge so the admins can be very strict about proposed changes. They
catch a lot or errors and mistakes this way.
Note that there are different teams of volunteers for the Catalog items and the
Inventories.
Please read the help files, to meet the catalog requirements and to make things
easier for the volunteers.
https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?topicID=21
https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?topicID=38
| | Secondly, and slightly more important, is the missing Kraahkan: the Pearl Black
4-Hole. This mould is 2 years older than BrickLink's catalogue recognises,
and originates in 2003 with Makuta Teridax. On its right is the noticeably darker
Black 4-Hole, from Makuta Icarax in 2008. You thought silvers were bad? Now we
have to deal with different blacks.
The catalogue does recognise the different blacks (see Bomonga vs Vorahk
heads), but this instance has been missed somehow. See, I'm not entirely
full of shit lmao
|
The color is in the catalog since 2022, thanks to randyf
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 17:20 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 50 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| This was as humbling as it was enlightening, and I wish I hadn't come in
like a dickhead to begin with tbh. I look forward to adding my knowledge to the
hivemind
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | randyf | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 15:40 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 37 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | You really just laid it all out here, and I was too stubborn to even take it
in. How foolish of me. This is literally the clearest explanation of this whole
debacle on the internet. I was an arrogant prick, and I cannot apologise enough.
This information is priceless. Thank you for persisting in your attempts to correct
me. This means everything to me.
|
I am really glad that everything turned out good for all involved, even if I
did have to take a few punches for the team!
|
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | randyf | | Posted: | Feb 2, 2024 23:31 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 79 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Thanks for your response, Randy. I really appreciate it.
|
Oh boy, there is a lot to unpack in this message! But that's okay, because
I will do my best to hopefully make you actually appreciate my response instead
of just thinking of it as some corporate line to be toed.
First, I am a volunteer who is not employed by the LEGO Group or BrickLink, so
everything that I write comes from my own point of view having been a heavy contributor
to the site over the last 15 years and then accepting a volunteer post as a catalog
admin when I was offered it. I can only speak for the things that I know about,
and those things are almost completely related to the BrickLink catalog. Therefore,
please do not assume that everything I write speaks for the LEGO Group or BrickLink
as they have the final say on the site. The other catalog admins and I do have
a say in the direction that many things go, but that is not always the case (the
current variant situation being one of them).
| | To clarify, my first attempts at communication were via the email you've
just provided. They were ignored. Twice. Can't really say I'm going about
it the wrong way if the 'proper' channel was a dead end. I'm not
the only one that's been ignored, another user attempted communication via
that same email and was also ignored more than once. Telling me that I've
been doing it wrong, when I actually didn't, is rude.
|
I am sorry, but I did not know that you had originally communicated through the
catalog admin email address. Your original post said that you had tried multiple
times through the help desk, and I know that things from there do not usually
make it to us. I just wanted to make sure that you knew how to contact us directly
in the future if you needed it.
I also know that some emails sent to the catalog admin email address get sent
to my personal spam folder from time to time on my end, so I do miss some things
that are sent to it, whereas others on the team might not. I try to make sure
that I check my spam folder every once in a while, but I do forget for a couple
months at a time occasionally.
Having said all that, I did want to make sure that I had not overlooked something.
When I went to scan through all of my catalog admin emails from the past year,
I did find one message that you had sent dated June 1, 2023. I couldn't find
any others, so I unfortunately can't attest to your statement about contacting
the address multiple times. I don't know the specifics on why I did not get
a chance to respond to you at that time, but I obviously meant to get back to
it at some point since it was flagged. Although I am not the only one who can
respond to you from the catalog admin team, the rest of them do usually leave
the Bionicle stuff to me. So, if I didn't get back to you, then I am not
surprised that no one else did either. And I do sincerely apologize for that.
Your message was not the first and will not be the last to get buried in my enormous
to-do list for this pastime of ours!
| | There seems to be a miscommunication here. I'm well aware of the issues inherent
with cataloguing and categorisation, because I solved them all without your
help.
|
Yes, there does seem to have been a miscommunication. In your original post,
there was no way for me to know that you actually had a well-tuned knowledge
of the Bionicle issues on BrickLink, but I am glad that you do know about them.
Why? Because I want to see them fixed. You see, I am also a Bionicle fan, and
I might be the only one on the catalog admin team that wants to see the Bionicle
issues fixed. I definitely was the only one on the team who wanted to see all
of the Clikits stuff fixed a few years ago! [h/t axaday for your tireless efforts
back then to help me] That alone should be enough to let anyone know that I really
want any part of the catalog that needs fixing to get fixed, no matter how niche.
I don't want to sound too much like I am tooting my own horn here, but I
am actually the one responsible for almost all of the advances and corrections
to the catalog that have been made in the Bionicle area in the last few years
here. I am the one who championed for and eventually got permission to add all
of the unique Bionicle colors to the site that were not recognized and have since
been added and migrated into inventories. I am the one who pushed for and did
all of the work to start sorting out the silver mess on BrickLink when it came
to Pearl Light Gray and Flat Silver. (I want to get to Cool Silver, but I have
yet to convince the site on that one.) One of the other admins and I are the
ones who have greatly enhanced a lot of the Bionicle inventories to account for
the random nature of certain parts from certain sets so that fans know what parts
were available in what sets through the catalog entries. This helped to un-orphan
a lot of catalog entries that otherwise were linked to nothing. I have also purchased
quite a few new Bionicle sets over the last few years at my own expense to solve
some issues in the inventories. The reason that I say all this is to show you
that I am in your camp and that I am probably your best chance at getting any
additional things fixed on BrickLink when it comes to the Bionicle theme. I think
I mentioned some of the things I have in mind in my last message.
| | I was a seasoned seller before I made the leap to BrickLink. I'm
trying to communicate that I have solved the majority of these issues myself,
and am offering you the information you need to bring the catalogue up to speed.
|
I would really love to see that information and compare it to what I already
have. Not only is it another set of eyes looking at the larger picture, but it
could definitely help to speed up the timeline on getting some of those things
I mentioned accomplished.
| | I am not complaining about something without offering a solution, I have the
9 silvers/chromes/gunmetals more or less sorted, timelined, and accurately categorised.
|
If you really do, then I want to see it.
| | Only 150 Light Grey Metallic still has problems, and BrickLink's catalogue
doesn't even recognise it as being used in Bionicle. It definitely is, both
repeatedly and often interchangeably with 131 and 296, which themselves were
used interchangeably with each other in some cases.
|
I would definitely have to see a lot more evidence for what you claim here, including
a lot of images. My knowledge base shows that 150 was used very little, and I
have not seen many things that would classify as 150. As for 131 and 296 being
used interchangeably, that is well known at this point, but 296 does have a timeline
and was not used for everything that 131 was used for. There are also many different
plastics involved that showed a lot of color inconsistency, so things that look
like they were made in different colors are actually not. All you have to do
is look to Warm Gold to see the issue repeated in the modern era.
| | The link on the history of
silvers you have provided is not accurate, and my data conclusively proves that.
If you have the information you need, as you claim, then why have you skipped
150 entirely? Can you tell me what year(s) 150 made its way into the Bionicle
catalogue? The other unlisted parts it spilled over into? The sets containing
those parts? I can. I have it all spreadsheeted and freely available to anyone
who asks. Do you?
|
See above.
| | It is not an issue of time when someone has already done the work for you, and
you've just straight up ignored them over and over again. I never, ever play
this card, but apparently I'm out of options here: I was the biggest Bionicle
seller in the Southern Hemisphere before I even considered joining BrickLink,
and I am telling you: your customer service is inadequate, as is your catalogue.
|
The catalog admin team are not an official customer service team, and we are
not the ones who created the catalog. We are a group of individuals who are volunteers
that spend a part of our lives keeping this site running, and the catalog was
created by thousands of individuals over the last 24 years. We do our best with
the limited time and resources we have to do what we can. It is mostly a thankless
job, but we all do it because we love this hobby and we love this site.
| | Blaming AFOLs for not caring, or saying that 'fixing things from the past
is not a priority' when the majority of Lego is in fact, from the past,
is a very very strange stance.
|
And that is why I brought up time being an issue. I am not employed here, and
neither are the other catalog admins. We are a small team of five people that
only recently increased from four. We have jobs, families, personal issues, and
everything else that comes with life outside of BrickLink.
What little time we do have these days to dedicate to our roles is almost solely
taken up by the new stuff being constantly released by the LEGO Group. It didn't
used to be this way, but the LEGO Group has significantly increased the amount
of product they release and the amount of license agreements they enter into
in the last decade. The growth in catalog submissions has been nothing short
of enormous as we hit a record last year of 10,417 items added to the catalog.
That is about double the number of items that were being added to the catalog
per year a decade ago, and the catalog admin team is the same size as it was
then. We are really proud of that.
But the consequence of that is it leaves little time for fixing stuff from the
past that needs fixing. We have so many things that we want to fix, but we just
literally do not have the time for it. Also, the number of requests for things
has increased dramatically as the BrickLink membership grows, so we get spread
thinner and thinner. Therefore, please understand that it is not that we don't
want to fix things. Nothing could be further from the truth. All of us are AFOLs
and wouldn't be here if we weren't. When we get a chance, the whole catalog
admin team works on little projects to help correct the back catalog, but those
chances have become less and less frequent.
| | Right now, the recurring joke among Oceania-based Bionicle fans is that I do
a better job at Being BrickLink than BrickLink. I didn't realise how true
that was until this conversation. I have no further plans to try and contact
your team, as they will probably just continue to ignore me as they have in the
past, regardless of which channel of communication I use, 'right' or
otherwise. You disappoint me.
|
I am truly sorry you feel that way. There are not that many people that have
contributed more to this site than I have, so pardon me if I take some offense
to a lot of what you wrote above. Having given so much of my life to this site,
it really hurts. For a while, I didn't want to respond to this post, but
I am glad that I did. Everyone needs to see that we are humans with emotions
and external lives. We are not robots that tend to the BrickLink database 24/7/365.
Anyways, if you do ever want to get in touch about the Bionicle stuff, I would
be more than happy to see your findings. The mothership wants us focused on current
products first and foremost, so the only thing that I cannot promise is a timeline
for when anything would get done.
Sincerely,
Randy
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 05:20 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 70 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| Thank you again for responding. I know it didn't seem like it, but I genuinely
did/do appreciate actually getting a response, regardless of its content.
Firstly, and you might not expect this, but I'd like to apologise for coming
in so hot. I definitely could've handled this better, that's 100% on
me. My frustration and anger were borne of a lack of communication, feelings
that I'd wasted hundreds of hours of my time, and my perception of your original
message as being an inadequate response. I'm not excusing my conduct, just
explaining why I was so livid. My feelings were justified, but my actions were
not. I'm sorry.
I appreciate your apology for missing my email. That's pretty much all I
wanted to begin with. Weird that the other one isn't there, I do occasionally
have issues with one of my email addresses not behaving, and this might be a
symptom of that. If so, that's also on me.
You don't sound like you're tooting your own horn at all. Or if you are,
I'm guilty of the same thing! You're proud of the work you've done,
and I understand and respect that. I'm the same, hence my frustration when
said work was ignored/perceived as brushed off. I'm passionate about Bionicle
(and Lego in general), and fixing ol' Bonk's wonky catalogue has been
a pet project of mine for a long time now. I grew up with it, and rediscovered
it during a pretty rough time in my life after being housebound for a few years.
As I said in another reply, not long before Covid I lost my livelihood and physical
health, and I was in a very dark place for a couple of years. I was a wanky theatre
kid before I became a wanky Bionicle seller, and losing that career path (which
I'd been training for for the majority of my life) destroyed me. It was my
main creative outlet too, and the double whammy wombo combo of losing my career
path AND creative outlet led me into a deep, dark depression. I spent every day
stuck at home, killing time, and waiting to die. My life wasn't exactly pleasant
up to that point either, although admittedly a lot of that was my own stunts.
The joys of a misspent youth...
Bionicle found me again not long before The Big C went viral, after a friend
encouraged me to join a Facebook group with cool memes and MoCs. That seemingly
inconsequential suggestion saved my life. With no exaggeration: I would be dead
right now if I hadn't found my way back to Bionicle. Please don't interpret
this as a guilt trip, or a 'woe is me' sorta thing, I'm just trying
to provide context to, well, me. I'm far too busy to be depressed nowadays,
honestly. It's hard to be sad sorting Lego, it's so damn satisfying!
Rendering order from chaos presses my happy buttons something fierce. The mysteries
and rabbit holes that crop up are fascinating too, I never thought I'd be
pulling 'lost' colours/moulds out of nowhere... Oops?
I won't go into the nitty gritty here about my findings, but they've
been meticulously checked and cross-referenced against big, respected Bionicle
sellers' inventories. I'm not just using my own collection as a basis
for this, that'd be far too small a pool to draw from. I wouldn't be
making any claims about lost colours/moulds if I wasn't 100% sure. I'm
painfully aware of the variation within official colours, 131 and 296 in particular
are incredibly dodgy. That variation is a big part of why 150 has snuck under
the radar this whole time. That being said, under the correct lighting conditions,
and with enough practice, you can tell them apart, at least in Polypropylene
parts. ABS is a little different, as you've noted, but I've still managed
to sort most of them too. The PP parts tend to have distinct undertones which
they show, even with less pigment/different plastic. Example: the lightest version
of 131 is almost identical to 150, but still carries a blue undertone that 150
lacks. With this in mind, I've managed to at least triple the BrickLink catalogue's
number of 150 parts, as well as track down where most of them came from. 150
definitely infiltrated Bionicle in 2006, and at least 2 pieces from 2007 (Axonn's
Rode mask, and the Jaller Mahri blades used in Lesovikk). There are partial and
whole set variants that exist in 150 from 2006 (Vezok, Thok, and all the Voya
Nui Matoran can contain 150 parts). As an aside, 150 also bled over into Knights
Kingdom a little too, but I don't have a huge amount of data on that beyond
a few weapon/armour parts.
I genuinely had no idea the BrickLink catalogue team was so small, and was purely
on a volunteer basis. Your comments about time make a lot more sense now. It
sure as hell wasn't easy figuring all this out my end. My line about hundreds
of hours of work is not even close to being an exaggeration. I'm still working
on it too, as new parts keep turning up in 150. The most recent discovery was
made by another major BrickLink seller late last year! Honestly, the rabbit hole
just keeps getting deeper. We had 150 more or less nicely tucked away in 2006
(the 'bad year' for silvers) until it leaked into 2007. I had lots of
help from friends to collate all this info, and if you and the team were managing
the entire Lego catalogue with 4-5 people? You should absolutely be proud of
the work you've done. Not trying to blow smoke up your butt here, I just
want you to know that I do appreciate the work you've done. The silver history
breakdown link you sent was something of a Rosetta Stone that let me start clearing
up the timelines of usage. Granted, it's not entirely accurate, but there
was enough information there to get the ball rolling. Maybe toot that trumpet
of yours juuust a little bit
As for being hurt, and human? I was hurt too, and I'm also human. At least
until I successfully graft Bionicle parts to my crippled flesh prison. Seriously,
I am very sick. You could almost say I'm 'Pretty Sick.' I named my
store after my poor health, and because the PSPS acronym was funny. Brevity aside,
being ignored and feeling brushed off from your initial response really got to
me. Communication is important to me, and after being ignored, having some listings
deleted, and hearing nothing back when I tried to establish a line of communication?
It hurt. I don't want to run BrickLink as some commenters have said. Hell,
I didn't even want to be on the team or anything. You have at least 1 of
my original emails, and you can see that its tone was vastly different to my
forum post. I think the only thing I asked about/for was API access for potential
inventory management tools? I offered my information freely, because I just wanted
to help. And you know what? I still do.
Let's take this from the top, shall we? I'm sorry again for being an
ass about this initially. Being stonewalled, then being told that the problem
you've brought up is too difficult isn't a great time, especially when
you solved the problem yourself, y'know? I hate complaining about things
without offering anything constructive, and I wouldn't have brought this
up if I had doubts about my work. I offer a picture of PSPS' manager as a
peace offering (wearing a very expensive hat).
I'm sorry again for how I approached this today. Yeah, my feelings were justfied
(for the most part), but I didn't need to be a condescending dick about it.
I really do appreciate you replying, even if the first response was a bit squiffy.
Any response is significantly less frustrating than being stonewalled, yknow?
I'll send an email through with links to my Google Drive data to get the
ball rolling, and will happily provide any and all information/proof/whatever
to support my findings.
Thanks Randy, and sorry again. We're on the same team, and I lost sight of
that in my frustration.
James @ PSPS
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 05:49 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 58 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
That variation is a big part of why 150 has snuck under
| | the radar this whole time. That being said, under the correct lighting conditions,
and with enough practice, you can tell them apart, at least in Polypropylene
parts. ABS is a little different, as you've noted, but I've still managed
to sort most of them too. The PP parts tend to have distinct undertones which
they show, even with less pigment/different plastic. Example: the lightest version
of 131 is almost identical to 150, but still carries a blue undertone that 150
lacks. With this in mind, I've managed to at least triple the BrickLink catalogue's
number of 150 parts, as well as track down where most of them came from. 150
definitely infiltrated Bionicle in 2006, and at least 2 pieces from 2007 (Axonn's
Rode mask, and the Jaller Mahri blades used in Lesovikk). There are partial and
whole set variants that exist in 150 from 2006 (Vezok, Thok, and all the Voya
Nui Matoran can contain 150 parts). As an aside, 150 also bled over into Knights
Kingdom a little too, but I don't have a huge amount of data on that beyond
a few weapon/armour parts.
|
Those parts are not 150, they're most likely 296, in the case of the 2006
sets you mentioned -- early batches of those sets used 296 rather than 131
-- or bad 131 in the case of the 2007 sets. 296 Cool Silver is (contrary
to the name) a warmer, lighter color than 131 Silver.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 06:23 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 46 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| | Maybe this helps (I don't have the best set up for taking pictures :c) |
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 06:28 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 39 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, WOLKsite writes:
| | Maybe this helps (I don't have the best set up for taking pictures :c)
|
Can you upload a higher quality version of this image?
(Rotate 90 degrees if rescaling of the image by BrickLink causes the low resolution,
rotated text is less of a problem than low resolution)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 06:43 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 35 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, WoutR writes:
| | In Catalog, WOLKsite writes:
| | Maybe this helps (I don't have the best set up for taking pictures :c)
|
Can you upload a higher quality version of this image?
(Rotate 90 degrees if rescaling of the image by BrickLink causes the low resolution,
rotated text is less of a problem than low resolution)
|
Sure, I just uploaded it in full resolution to Flickr:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/168347127@N06/53506310595/
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 06:44 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 29 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, WOLKsite writes:
| | In Catalog, WoutR writes:
| | In Catalog, WOLKsite writes:
| | Maybe this helps (I don't have the best set up for taking pictures :c)
|
Can you upload a higher quality version of this image?
(Rotate 90 degrees if rescaling of the image by BrickLink causes the low resolution,
rotated text is less of a problem than low resolution)
|
Sure, I just uploaded it in full resolution to Flickr:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/168347127@N06/53506310595/
|
Thanks
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 07:04 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 36 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, WOLKsite writes:
| | In Catalog, WoutR writes:
| | In Catalog, WOLKsite writes:
| | Maybe this helps (I don't have the best set up for taking pictures :c)
|
Can you upload a higher quality version of this image?
(Rotate 90 degrees if rescaling of the image by BrickLink causes the low resolution,
rotated text is less of a problem than low resolution)
|
Sure, I just uploaded it in full resolution to Flickr:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/168347127@N06/53506310595/
|
Also useful:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/126975831@N07/17768155498/
where we could add these notes (9 years later):
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 07:11 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 43 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| That image was a godsend! It's how I first learned their true names.
I come bearing a shitty-captured example. Left to right:
- 131
- 296
- 'Bad' 131
- 150
Note that dodgy 131 and 150 are different when side by side. This is the lightest/worst
131 staff blade I have too.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 07:18 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 42 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| Bonus image of the unrecorded 296 Surge weapons vs the recognised 315 version.
See, I'm not crazy, there are definitely unrecorded silvers being used in
the catalogue, 150 is just one of many silver issues...
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 07:26 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 33 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| Bonus bonus image of the unrecognised Pearl Black 4-Hole (centre of the cross)
vs the Black 4-Hole (on its right).
I'm not misclassifying an existing colour, or colours. 150 snuck into Bionicle
in 2006, and has been getting by as a variant of 131 for far too long. It's
far too consistent in its appearance, its comparisons to known 150 parts, and
the sets that bear it. There's a loooooot of unrecognised official colour
stuff in Bionicle, and I've spent an unhealthy amount of time trying to figure
it all out.
Everything I've found points me to the same conclusion: 150 is in Bionicle,
and not just in Krana-Kal. There are ABS and Polypropylene parts in 150, used
mainly in 2006, and with a teensy leak into 2007. 131 and 296 pigment variations
just don't match under the right lighting. This conclusion has been backed,
and accepted, by some of the biggest Bionicle stores on BrickLink.
150/Milky Joe is real. He's contaminated my beloved Bionicle, and I've
had an ass of a time trying to track the sneaky git down. But I bloody well did
it.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 07:27 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 35 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Bonus image of the unrecorded 296 Surge weapons vs the recognised 315 version.
See, I'm not crazy, there are definitely unrecorded silvers being used in
the catalogue, 150 is just one of many silver issues...
|
Yeah, there's a lot of sets from 2010 that need to have it recognized that
they used both 131 and 315. A few do, a few only have 315 recorded, a few only
have 131. Should apply to pretty much all of the 2010 HF sets, though not the
BIONICLE Stars.
The thing you are calling 150 looks to be 296. The thing you are calling 296
is another variation of either 131 or 296. 296 was only used in early 2006 with
few exceptions.
In the Guurahk staff image, from left to right I see 315, "old" 131,
"new" 131, and 296.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 07:30 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 37 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| 131 was entirely phased out after 2010, at least in PP parts. The silver history
link Randyf provided confirms that. Your assessment is incorrect.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 07:33 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 35 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| Sorry, I misspoke. That part of the link is actually wrong, at least in regards
to Bionicle. 296 was the (almost) exclusive silver used from 2007-2010 in the
Bionicle catalogue. This isn't even hard to confirm, just hold up any Mistika/Phantoka
exclusive mould next to an old Nuva chest. They don't match. They're
different official colours.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 07:50 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 31 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Sorry, I misspoke. That part of the link is actually wrong, at least in regards
to Bionicle. 296 was the (almost) exclusive silver used from 2007-2010 in the
Bionicle catalogue. This isn't even hard to confirm, just hold up any Mistika/Phantoka
exclusive mould next to an old Nuva chest. They don't match. They're
different official colours.
|
And this is what I've been saying all along -- you've misunderstood
what 296 is.
Yes, the silver parts from 2007-2010 look different, HOWEVER, they are still
variations of 131. The color was reformulated, but remained under the same ID.
The peachy silver color from 2006 is 296.
Here's an official statement from LEGO Design Lab from 2009, talking about
how 131 is being replaced by 315 going into 2011: https://www.eurobricks.com/forum/index.php?/forums/topic/35009-changes-in-colours/
Here's a 2010 color palette, officially released by LEGO Design Lab:
https://www.eurobricks.com/forum/index.php?/forums/topic/38096-the-internal-lego-color-scheme/
Bricks & Pieces also separates "Cool Silver" from "Silver". Those
elements used in 2007-2010 sets, of those which match those listed in the instructions
manuals are labelled as *Silver* on Bricks & Pieces, just as the older parts
2002-2005. Meanwhile, those 2006 parts with IDs matching the instructions are
labelled *Cool Silver*.
(The reason I bring up the IDs matching is that Bricks & Pieces often substitutes
parts due to being a replacement parts service, sometimes even with parts that
were never released, such as the elements in the Stars sets using color 315.)
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 07:51 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 36 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | 131 was entirely phased out after 2010, at least in PP parts. The silver history
link Randyf provided confirms that. Your assessment is incorrect.
|
I never made any claims 131 was used post-2010?
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 07:54 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 35 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| I meant 2007, but that's moot. You're right, goddamn you. This changes
everything.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 07:56 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 50 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | I meant 2007, but that's moot. You're right, goddamn you. This changes
everything.
|
It changes the names/color numbers. Probably not the groupings you made.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 08:08 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 51 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| Pfft don't softball it, you just nuked my carefully crafted theory from orbit
I've never been more happy to be wrong in my entire life.
131 was reformulated. That's what I was missing. I never found anything to
suggest they changed it so significantly, but never gave it a new classification.
It's like the Dark Red change, but even more extreme. I knew there was precedent
for major reformulation within official designations, but I didn't know it
got this wild!
WOLKsite and WoutR, I cannot thank you two enough. YThis has been a thorn in
my side for years, and I can finally pull it out! I now have a pile of listing
to reclassify as 131 Original and/or 131 Reformulation, a guide to rework, and
a pile of silver misinformation I've published that needs retconning.
I owe you both massively. Thank you so, so much.
I never thought I'd be sitting here crying with joy from a message in this
thread when I posted my initial angry rant earlier today. God DAMN I love this
job.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | randyf | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 15:22 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 46 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Pfft don't softball it, you just nuked my carefully crafted theory from orbit
I've never been more happy to be wrong in my entire life.
131 was reformulated. That's what I was missing. I never found anything to
suggest they changed it so significantly, but never gave it a new classification.
It's like the Dark Red change, but even more extreme. I knew there was precedent
for major reformulation within official designations, but I didn't know it
got this wild!
WOLKsite and WoutR, I cannot thank you two enough. YThis has been a thorn in
my side for years, and I can finally pull it out! I now have a pile of listing
to reclassify as 131 Original and/or 131 Reformulation, a guide to rework, and
a pile of silver misinformation I've published that needs retconning.
I owe you both massively. Thank you so, so much.
I never thought I'd be sitting here crying with joy from a message in this
thread when I posted my initial angry rant earlier today. God DAMN I love this
job.
|
You have now been hit by two of the people that have become major resources for
me over the course of my role here. Along with a couple of other amazing AFOLs
(h/t Rylie and Dan), their work on colors and getting this information compiled
occurred over much more than the four years you put in and has been corroborated
by a lot of official data straight from the mothership. I am happy to know their
work still stands the test, but I am also happy to know that you are happy.
And this is why I said that I was going to have to ask you for a lot of proof
of your findings in my last message. People here that have been in the hobby
for a long time know things that the general LEGO fan community doesn't.
We know when colors were used, what parts were manufactured when, when colors
were reformulated, what materials are used for most parts, etc., etc., because
a lot of detailed work has been done and confirmed by official LEGO data sources
and is not just speculation. Once again, the problem we have is getting a chance
to get all of this information into BrickLink. But if you ask any of the people
communicating with you here, they will hopefully agree that we have made some
significant progress on things over the last 3-4 years and I will do all that
I can to continue that work.
Stick around. There is a lot to learn about this toy that we all are passionate
about!
Cheers,
Randy
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 15:35 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 40 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, randyf writes:
| |
You have now been hit by two of the people that have become major resources for
me over the course of my role here. Along with a couple of other amazing AFOLs
(h/t Rylie and Dan), their work on colors and getting this information compiled
occurred over much more than the four years you put in and has been corroborated
by a lot of official data straight from the mothership. I am happy to know their
work still stands the test, but I am also happy to know that you are happy.
|
We probably all started like NoGravitasHere. Noticing a problem and trying to
figure it out.
I have no doubt that NoGravitasHere wil be a better expert on Cool Silver than
I am soon. Once everything is identified properly, he has a much better set of
data than I have.
I hope NoGravitasHere and here4bricks614 can compare notes. That could help to
sort out things here, when the time comes to start that project.
| | And this is why I said that I was going to have to ask you for a lot of proof
of your findings in my last message. People here that have been in the hobby
for a long time know things that the general LEGO fan community doesn't.
We know when colors were used, what parts were manufactured when, when colors
were reformulated, what materials are used for most parts, etc., etc., because
a lot of detailed work has been done and confirmed by official LEGO data sources
and is not just speculation. Once again, the problem we have is getting a chance
to get all of this information into BrickLink. But if you ask any of the people
communicating with you here, they will hopefully agree that we have made some
significant progress on things over the last 3-4 years and I will do all that
I can to continue that work.
|
Absolutely! A HUGE amount of progress has been made.
| | Stick around. There is a lot to learn about this toy that we all are passionate
about!
Cheers,
Randy
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | SylvainLS | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 15:48 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 30 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, WoutR writes:
| | […]
NoGravitasHere
here4bricks614
|
I suggest you change your username to WoutHere
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 07:41 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 39 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
|
| In Catalog, WOLKsite writes:
| | The thing you are calling 150 looks to be 296. The thing you are calling 296
is another variation of either 131 or 296. 296 was only used in early 2006 with
few exceptions.
|
I agree. I think you are confusing 150 and 296.
Confirmed 296, in rubbery material (polypropylene ?) because of the LEGO part
name "Wing W. Holes Ø 4,84 296/191"
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 07:46 | | Subject: | (Cancelled) | | Viewed: | 19 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| | (Cancelled) |
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 07:46 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 33 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| The 150 parts NoGravitasHere identified and the 144 here4bricks614 identified
could be a pretty good match also. I suspect both are 296 Cool Silver.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 07:46 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 34 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| Oooooh that's good data, where'd you get the official name from?
If that's accurate, then I've absolutely got some names mixed up. However,
that doesn't change the fact the the silvers from 2001 and 2007 do not match,
and to a degree that isn't just colour variation. That would mean we're
looking at either a significant, and unrecorded, reformulation of 131 into its
2006-2010 version, or still a whole a new silver. The problem remains.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 07:47 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 33 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Oooooh that's good data, where'd you get the official name from?
If that's accurate, then I've absolutely got some names mixed up. However,
that doesn't change the fact the the silvers from 2001 and 2007 do not match,
and to a degree that isn't just colour variation. That would mean we're
looking at either a significant, and unrecorded, reformulation of 131 into its
2006-2010 version, or still a whole a new silver. The problem remains.
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Directly from LEGO customer service.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | leopard37 | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 12:38 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 46 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | That image was a godsend! It's how I first learned their true names.
I come bearing a shitty-captured example. Left to right:
- 131
- 296
- 'Bad' 131
- 150
Note that dodgy 131 and 150 are different when side by side. This is the lightest/worst
131 staff blade I have too.
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I'm not trying to throw another wrench in the works, but how can you tell
with parts this old none of the variations are sun damage? My store started with
only Bionicle parts selling on BL and have grown from there so this discussion
is very interesting because I just list my silvers based on recognized BL colors
for the parts.
Looking forward to your response.
Tyson.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 13:08 | | Subject: | ... Okay, maybe not as poorly as I thought... | | Viewed: | 58 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| Ooooh, a very good question. Sun damage doesn't tend to be uniform, for starters.
A lot of the pieces I throw in the sad bin will only have one facet/angle/whatever
that's damaged by UV. That damage will often be in a bit of a gradient too,
with the area that caught the most sun showing the most damage. I used to have
a Kopaka Nuva shield that was a perfect gradient from white to tan, wish I knew
where it was. UV damage also tends to have a yellow/brown tinge, or green if
it's on Flat Dark Gold (that's a whole other can of worms).
Failing that, I make a lot of use of 'comparison' pieces. Parts that
I know are definitely not damaged that I can use as a control group. That being
said, I haven't seen a huge amount of UV damage on the metallics (except
FDG), they seem to tolerate exposure better than a lot of other colours. I did
once get a brown Kanoka launcher off of a Krekka though, so they're definitely
not immune...
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 06:46 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 41 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| This is a great image! I'm writing a big ass response to your original message
rn, please hold
Do you have any Thok or Vezok weapons on hand? They're probably the easiest
examples of 150 to find.
ps I also suffer from crap photo conditions, but, here's the unedited version
of the Guurahk pic I posted earlier, with the inclusion of 315. You can kind
of see how pale it is, and how aggressively white it is. I'll try and get
a comparison pic of a 'bad' 131 part next to a 150 part for everyone
once I'm done typing.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 06:49 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 32 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| Oh goddammit, I closed the wrong tab and wiped it. I'll try get some 'bad'
131 vs 150 pics now.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Stellar | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 05:57 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 34 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | Oh goddammit, I closed the wrong tab and wiped it. I'll try get some 'bad'
131 vs 150 pics now.
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CTRL+Shift+T restores the last tab closed, sometimes with the content written
too.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 06:04 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 30 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| | Alas, it did not lmao. It's fine now, I was wrong anyway! |
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| | | | | | | Author: | WoutR | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 08:19 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 50 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, randyf writes:
| | P.S. There is no current plan to separate BrickLink Pearl Dark Gray into its
two unique colors, but it is something that may be considered in the future.
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I hope so, because some parts were made in both colors. For example:
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | tonnic | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 09:13 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 44 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| I can only say this forumposts makes it a lot easier for me in identifying these
colors.
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | Stellar | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 06:03 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 28 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, WoutR writes:
| | In Catalog, randyf writes:
| | P.S. There is no current plan to separate BrickLink Pearl Dark Gray into its
two unique colors, but it is something that may be considered in the future.
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I hope so, because some parts were made in both colors. For example:
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+1
Indeed one can see the green tint on the older color as seen in that item alternate
photo.
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| | | | | Author: | here4bricks614 | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 02:38 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 50 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | I've contacted BrickLink support multiple times via the Help Desk link, and
been ignored every single time. The current system of silver classification is
laughably bad. There are 9 official Lego silvers/chromes/gunmetals, and you only
recognise 4.5, at best.
I have repeatedly offered you the information you need to fix this issue, and
have not once received even a reply for my efforts. Instead, BrickLink is more
interested in maintaining their poorly-categorised colours, removing accurate
listings (how can I include rubber bands with a set, when said rubber bands are
23 years old and dust?), and ignoring the fella trying to literally hand you
the answer to this issue, and also ruining your database by no longer tracking
part variants. You do realise some of those 'insignificant' changes actually
matter, right?
... Right?
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Wolksite perfectly explains the issue at hand in this post: https://www.bricklink.com/message.asp?ID=1452373
Please message me if you would like to see a full list of every part that appears
in 296 Cool Silver. I have compiled an excel spreadsheet of every Cool Silver
part, along with some other info.
150 Metallic Light Grey/PVLG was introduced in 2000 as a watch link color. It
was retired at the end of 2004. No set contains both 150 and 296.
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| | | | | | | Author: | WOLKsite | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 03:41 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 37 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, here4bricks614 writes:
| | Please message me if you would like to see a full list of every part that appears
in 296 Cool Silver. I have compiled an excel spreadsheet of every Cool Silver
part, along with some other info.
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I would like that list personally
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | here4bricks614 | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 03:47 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 54 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, WOLKsite writes:
| | In Catalog, here4bricks614 writes:
| | Please message me if you would like to see a full list of every part that appears
in 296 Cool Silver. I have compiled an excel spreadsheet of every Cool Silver
part, along with some other info.
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I would like that list personally
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I’ll send it in the morning after I make a few more edits. I’m counting 144 parts;
six of which were never used.”
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 3, 2024 16:07 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 39 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| I would love to see this list, it'll help me isolate the 'contaminated'
sets in Bonk's catalogue! I've got most pinned down to 2006, with one
weird leak into 2007 via Jaller Mahri's sword (a pair of them came with Lesovikk
in 296).
Thanks
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | here4bricks614 | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 11:06 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 30 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | I would love to see this list, it'll help me isolate the 'contaminated'
sets in Bonk's catalogue! I've got most pinned down to 2006, with one
weird leak into 2007 via Jaller Mahri's sword (a pair of them came with Lesovikk
in 296).
Thanks
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I should add that this piece (57572) does not come in 296. By 2007, LEGO was
no longer introducing new parts in 296.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 11:55 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 37 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| It shouldn't, but to my eternal dismay... It does. I wrote it off as a misclassification
at first, my mate in Hungary sent me some pics and I was very suspicious. Paranoia
got the better of me, and then I pulled 2 out of set stock. And then ANOTHER
2 from a Lesovikk...
Behold: the impossible blade!
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | here4bricks614 | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 12:08 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 31 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | It shouldn't, but to my eternal dismay... It does. I wrote it off as a misclassification
at first, my mate in Hungary sent me some pics and I was very suspicious. Paranoia
got the better of me, and then I pulled 2 out of set stock. And then ANOTHER
2 from a Lesovikk...
Behold: the impossible blade!
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The difference between 131 and 296 is much wider than people think.
https://flickr.com/photos/193303644@N05/52020985325/in/dateposted/
https://flickr.com/photos/193303644@N05/53133229378/in/dateposted/
The bottom two slopes are 296. The 2x4 brick and the other slope are 131.
The lighter whip is 296.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | here4bricks614 | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 12:11 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 31 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| In Catalog, NoGravitasHere writes:
| | It shouldn't, but to my eternal dismay... It does. I wrote it off as a misclassification
at first, my mate in Hungary sent me some pics and I was very suspicious. Paranoia
got the better of me, and then I pulled 2 out of set stock. And then ANOTHER
2 from a Lesovikk...
Behold: the impossible blade!
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For this to exist in 296, the part must be much, much lighter than the pieces
in the photo.
What we see here is the reason that 131 is no longer used. It was too inconsistent.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | NoGravitasHere | | Posted: | Feb 4, 2024 12:18 | | Subject: | Re: Bionicle is handled incredibly poorly | | Viewed: | 36 times | | Topic: | Catalog | |
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| Intriguing. Even the later formulation managed to be this inconsistent? I was
under the impression that 131 v2 was mostly stable after 2006. I'll definitely
need to recheck the 'Confirmed' parts from the list I just fired back
then.
That *does* explain a lot though, and also explains the lack of internal consistency
between some of my 'bad' 131 parts. If v2 could throw out massive pigment
loss like this, then that wraps up that little mystery. If only it explained
the Mahri Shoulder and Hydruka plate...
Thanks
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New Zealand, Canterbury
France, Provence-Alpes-Côte d'Azur
USA, Tennessee
United Kingdom, England
Canada, Ontario
Sweden, Örebro
)
)
Netherlands, Zuid-Holland
Spain, Comunidad Valenciana
)
)