Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
My thought exactly, although they lean a little more towards the dark side of
things, such as world domination, but I don’t want to get banned again so I will
keep my peace on this matter.
In Administrative, PlanetEarthToys writes:
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
Dear members,
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
I'll break my silence once for this post
this should be interesting ....
considering how the EU views Hate-Speech & Digital Online Bullying & Online Digital
Content, i wonder how this will pertain to this very Forum........
if you Break an EU Law by harassing someone or commenting the wrong thing that
offends someone in the Forum, will the EU issue an arrest warrant, whether you
sell to the EU or not?
or do you just get permanently banned from BL ?
dangerous territory feller's.... maybe someone can explain what part of Lego
selling would be considered "Illegal Online Content"... outside of the
scope of .. bricks
uh-oh.. wait. this means
the Redcoats are coming...
you know who we need???
yes!!!
YEs!!!!!!!!!
YESSSSSSS!!!!
where.. is Mr. Yankee Doodle...??? !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
My thought exactly, although they lean a little more towards the dark side of
things, such as world domination, but I don’t want to get banned again so I will
keep my peace on this matter.
Again...?
were you previously Banned ?
slippage of tongue , hope did not happen Saito...
My thought exactly, although they lean a little more towards the dark side of
things, such as world domination, but I don’t want to get banned again so I will
keep my peace on this matter.
In Administrative, PlanetEarthToys writes:
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
Dear members,
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
Again? Are you the Bricklink mafia?
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
I'll break my silence once for this post
this should be interesting ....
considering how the EU views Hate-Speech & Digital Online Bullying & Online Digital
Content, i wonder how this will pertain to this very Forum........
if you Break an EU Law by harassing someone or commenting the wrong thing that
offends someone in the Forum, will the EU issue an arrest warrant, whether you
sell to the EU or not?
or do you just get permanently banned from BL ?
dangerous territory feller's.... maybe someone can explain what part of Lego
selling would be considered "Illegal Online Content"... outside of the
scope of .. bricks
uh-oh.. wait. this means
the Redcoats are coming...
you know who we need???
yes!!!
YEs!!!!!!!!!
YESSSSSSS!!!!
where.. is Mr. Yankee Doodle...??? !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
My thought exactly, although they lean a little more towards the dark side of
things, such as world domination, but I don’t want to get banned again so I will
keep my peace on this matter.
In Administrative, PlanetEarthToys writes:
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
Dear members,
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
Again? Are you the Bricklink mafia?
Are you interested in joining?
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
I'll break my silence once for this post
this should be interesting ....
considering how the EU views Hate-Speech & Digital Online Bullying & Online Digital
Content, i wonder how this will pertain to this very Forum........
if you Break an EU Law by harassing someone or commenting the wrong thing that
offends someone in the Forum, will the EU issue an arrest warrant, whether you
sell to the EU or not?
or do you just get permanently banned from BL ?
dangerous territory feller's.... maybe someone can explain what part of Lego
selling would be considered "Illegal Online Content"... outside of the
scope of .. bricks
uh-oh.. wait. this means
the Redcoats are coming...
you know who we need???
yes!!!
YEs!!!!!!!!!
YESSSSSSS!!!!
where.. is Mr. Yankee Doodle...??? !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
this should be interesting ....
considering how the EU views Hate-Speech & Digital Online Bullying & Online Digital
Content, i wonder how this will pertain to this very Forum........
What you say on the forum is not a product or a service for sale.
this should be interesting ....
considering how the EU views Hate-Speech & Digital Online Bullying & Online Digital
Content, i wonder how this will pertain to this very Forum........
What you say on the forum is not a product or a service for sale.
read it all
"DSA focuses on illegal and harmful online content."
this should be interesting ....
considering how the EU views Hate-Speech & Digital Online Bullying & Online Digital
Content, i wonder how this will pertain to this very Forum........
What you say on the forum is not a product or a service for sale.
read it all
"DSA focuses on illegal and harmful online content."
Censorship has set sail for North America
Censorship has been alive and well here for my entire life. Do you live in a
different North America?
this should be interesting ....
considering how the EU views Hate-Speech & Digital Online Bullying & Online Digital
Content, i wonder how this will pertain to this very Forum........
What you say on the forum is not a product or a service for sale.
read it all
"DSA focuses on illegal and harmful online content."
Censorship has set sail for North America
Censorship has been alive and well here for my entire life. Do you live in a
different North America?
Most in the US are trying to move away from censorship and dissolve ourself from
the EU, Globalization and the UN, WHO, Etc. Some other smart European sovereign
nations are trying to do the same as US.
Really now? You either believe in completely free speech or you don't. And
the vast majority of people anywhere on the planet don't because most societies
have cultural limits in which things are deemed acceptable or not. For example,
many things are deemed unacceptable in society to protect children. I think most
people around the globe probably support that, but it _is_ a limit on free speech.
Basically, unless you live on your own island in the middle of the ocean without
any jurisdiction, you are not completely free and never have been.
In Administrative, randyf writes:
In Administrative, Saitobricks.ca writes:
In Administrative, PlanetEarthToys writes:
In Administrative, axaday writes:
In Administrative, PlanetEarthToys writes:
I'll break my silence once for this post
this should be interesting ....
considering how the EU views Hate-Speech & Digital Online Bullying & Online Digital
Content, i wonder how this will pertain to this very Forum........
What you say on the forum is not a product or a service for sale.
read it all
"DSA focuses on illegal and harmful online content."
Censorship has set sail for North America
Censorship has been alive and well here for my entire life. Do you live in a
different North America?
this should be interesting ....
considering how the EU views Hate-Speech & Digital Online Bullying & Online Digital
Content, i wonder how this will pertain to this very Forum........
What you say on the forum is not a product or a service for sale.
read it all
"DSA focuses on illegal and harmful online content."
Censorship has set sail for North America
let's drop a Nuke then..
what if... let's say, the Eu backlog's the BL forum back to it's
beginning & applies this new standard to .. EVERYTHING ever written
in the Forum...
did anyone display 'Harmful Online Content" from ... 2007ish-forward..???
since everything in the forum is still publicly accessible.............
It's called we need to break free from the motherland, you with a revolt
and us with paper
this should be interesting ....
considering how the EU views Hate-Speech & Digital Online Bullying & Online Digital
Content, i wonder how this will pertain to this very Forum........
What you say on the forum is not a product or a service for sale.
read it all
"DSA focuses on illegal and harmful online content."
The only step they are announcing is that we'll have to certify that we are
not selling goods or services that are illegal in Europe.
this should be interesting ....
considering how the EU views Hate-Speech & Digital Online Bullying & Online Digital
Content, i wonder how this will pertain to this very Forum........
What you say on the forum is not a product or a service for sale.
read it all
"DSA focuses on illegal and harmful online content."
The only step they are announcing is that we'll have to certify that we are
not selling goods or services that are illegal in Europe.
Which, if I am following this correctly, would almost put The LEGO Group out
of business if we were.
Problem area No 1 ... Even if someone does not intentionally (or explicitly)
sell to the EU, we all know how freight forwarders operate. We also know how
certain payment services allow almost any address to put in the shipping fields.
Even if I do not ship outside the USA, it's possible that it might happen
against my wishes (see No 2).
Problem area No 2 ... I am aware, that a few US sellers on BL, are operating
as intermediaries for buyers elsewhere, and very likely listing some items they
do not have inventory of. One such seller placed a small number of orders with
me, every time going to a different address in a different state. I do not know
if those orders originated on BL or elsewhere on the internet. One of those addresses
appeared to be a freight forwarder in Florida. It is possible that something
out of my inventory ended up outside the USA. This happened, despite the fact
that I do not accept cross border payments. So it is entirely possible that it
ended up in the EU. I no longer accept orders from that BL seller.
My primary concern, and likely others here feel similarly, is what exposure does
this have to me with the European Union government ? Up until now they did not
know that I existed. This rule is likely going to affect every online seller,
planet wide, unless their only shipping method is local pickup.
[…]
My primary concern, and likely others here feel similarly, is what exposure does
this have to me with the European Union government ?
None, even if you replace “EU gouvernment” with “EU gouvernments” (which
are the ones with borders and customs & tax agencies that could be interested
in you if you exported to them).
Up until now they did not
know that I existed. This rule is likely going to affect every online seller,
planet wide, unless their only shipping method is local pickup.
My primary concern, and likely others here feel similarly, is what exposure does
this have to me with the European Union government ? Up until now they did not
know that I existed. This rule is likely going to affect every online seller,
planet wide, unless their only shipping method is local pickup.
My impression is that they will stay unaware of you. If Bricklink has to reveal
you at all, it would only be when you sold something to Europe. I think it is
just an official record-keeping that allows Bricklink to say, "Yes, all of
our sellers have self-certified". This might prevent them from having to
reveal any specifics about ANYONE.
Yes, but what about the issue like I had this year. A buyer who said they were
from U.S. bought a bunch of sealed minifigures packs.
Later, I got a message from a foreign country in eastern EU.
The guy was upset someone from the post office there had opened 1 of the minifigures...
My guess his customs for his country. I've never seen in 30 years my country
do that within our nation open a sealed package... not the back of the package
was clear so no need to open any of them.
Thankfully I take pictures before I send out any product of everything in the
order. (I recommend this to all sellers. It helps me know for sure if I made
the mistake or if I'm being scammed. Not to mention proof to a postal inspector
if it is a scam.)
Basically, the guy had a fake U.S. address that just forwards to another country.
This is a way to cheat the system since I had that country locked out of buying
and it should be stopped.
Would this new set of rules now apply to that sale that wasn't to the EU?
but by trickery was actually to someone from EU?
Basically, the guy had a fake U.S. address that just forwards to another country.
This is a way to cheat the system since I had that country locked out of buying
and it should be stopped.
shipping forwarding addresses are very commonplace. I have one and have shipped
dozens of packages from stores that dont ship to Canada to it and have had no
issues. Ive also had many orders placed in my store get sent to said places without
issue. 99/100 times they work just as well as normal addresses
Yes, but what about the issue like I had this year. A buyer who said they were
from U.S. bought a bunch of sealed minifigures packs.
Later, I got a message from a foreign country in eastern EU.
The guy was upset someone from the post office there had opened 1 of the minifigures...
My guess his customs for his country. I've never seen in 30 years my country
do that within our nation open a sealed package... not the back of the package
was clear so no need to open any of them.
Thankfully I take pictures before I send out any product of everything in the
order. (I recommend this to all sellers. It helps me know for sure if I made
the mistake or if I'm being scammed. Not to mention proof to a postal inspector
if it is a scam.)
Basically, the guy had a fake U.S. address that just forwards to another country.
This is a way to cheat the system since I had that country locked out of buying
and it should be stopped.
Would this new set of rules now apply to that sale that wasn't to the EU?
but by trickery was actually to someone from EU?
You send it to the US address provided to you, once it is delivered there what
happens after is no longer your responsibility.
US custom does open packages that are suspicious, like you said the buyer used
a fake address so who knows what happened with your package after it got delivered
to that fake address.
Sad truth is people will always find ways to circumvent the rules.
Yes, but what about the issue like I had this year. A buyer who said they were
from U.S. bought a bunch of sealed minifigures packs.
Later, I got a message from a foreign country in eastern EU.
The guy was upset someone from the post office there had opened 1 of the minifigures...
My guess his customs for his country. I've never seen in 30 years my country
do that within our nation open a sealed package... not the back of the package
was clear so no need to open any of them.
Thankfully I take pictures before I send out any product of everything in the
order. (I recommend this to all sellers. It helps me know for sure if I made
the mistake or if I'm being scammed. Not to mention proof to a postal inspector
if it is a scam.)
Basically, the guy had a fake U.S. address that just forwards to another country.
This is a way to cheat the system since I had that country locked out of buying
and it should be stopped.
Part of how you suppress that is to configure your PayPal/Stripe accounts to
block all cross-border payments.
This isn't true, we had a Bricklink order seized by US Customs. They requested
safety testing data, LEGO® and Bricklink refused to provide it and refused to
even say the parts where authentic. Parts went into and incinerator.
This isn't true, we had a Bricklink order seized by US Customs. They requested
safety testing data, LEGO® and Bricklink refused to provide it and refused to
even say the parts where authentic. Parts went into and incinerator.
I'm having the same problem with an order I bought from UK, it's been
3 months of emails and calls, I provided all documentation available online except
Toy Test reports that LEGO said only share directly with customs when they import
products themselves.
This isn't true, we had a Bricklink order seized by US Customs. They requested
safety testing data, LEGO® and Bricklink refused to provide it and refused to
even say the parts where authentic. Parts went into and incinerator.
I'm having the same problem with an order I bought from UK, it's been
3 months of emails and calls, I provided all documentation available online except
Toy Test reports that LEGO said only share directly with customs when they import
products themselves.
I wonder whether this new deal will smooth issues like this out. If Bricklink
can attest straight across the board that all of its sellers are selling things
covered by LEGO's own documentation, they might be able to get all Bricklink
orders greenlit.
When LEGO acquired BrickLink, many of us hoped it would mean joining the LEGO
family—accepting the trade-off of compliance, taxes, and stricter rules, like
the banning of custom and chrome parts. The reality is, their corporate structure
and legal team will always keep us at arm's length.
How could anyone certify that he is complying with EU law unless he knows EU
laws. Am I going to have to hire a lawyer from France?
If you are only selling LEGO Products, LEGO has already made you safe.
In theory you are correct, the devil in the details is provenance. Unless you
irrefutably prove and document provenance you may not be safe. In the case of
upstream chain of provenance, several of my older sources (e.g. K-Mart and TRU)
have ceased doing business. The chain of provenance ends with me in those situations.
I hate to say this, and yes, I feel very sorry for EU buyers but the most likely
outcome of this especially once people are taxed by EU is that MOST non-EU sellers
will lock their stores to EU buyers.
This will protect them from taxes that EU could and plan to impose on sellers
with 30 sales or more with total of $2k U.S. or more in sale.
Note they will also get all your privacy data that can be at risk if not handled
well. Or just a being hacked by bad actors.
I hate to say this, and yes, I feel very sorry for EU buyers but the most likely
outcome of this especially once people are taxed by EU is that MOST non-EU sellers
will lock their stores to EU buyers.
This will protect them from taxes that EU could and plan to impose on sellers
with 30 sales or more with total of $2k U.S. or more in sale.
Note they will also get all your privacy data that can be at risk if not handled
well. Or just a being hacked by bad actors.
Once again, a pile of junk. Stop spreading FUD and falsehoods and really watch
and listen to the videos you point to if you can’t understand their descriptions.
Once again, a pile of junk. Stop spreading FUD and falsehoods and really watch
and listen to the videos you point to if you can’t understand their descriptions.
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
How can the EU force laws on people that do not live nor sell to the EU? And
how will they actually monitor or enforce it?
As a Canadian resident I do not need to follow any European laws if I do not
sell to the EU or am I wrong?
What's next? The whole world needs to follow the European Dac7 rules?
How can the EU force laws on people that do not live nor sell to the EU? And
how will they actually monitor or enforce it?
As a Canadian resident I do not need to follow any European laws if I do not
sell to the EU or am I wrong?
What's next? The whole world needs to follow the European Dac7 rules?
I may be incorrect (in which case someone will probably correct me soon) but
I dont think they are saying we are "legally bound" by it if we are outside
the EU. rather, those laws (at least in the eyes of bricklink, tho I have not
read them so I cannot say if they are "good" or "bad" ) are something
that a normal person should have no reason to say no to. but if they did then
bricklink would probably see that as a red flag and wouldn't want to do business
with them.
That's probably confusing so I'll try this example to help explain how
I understand it. for example, let's say 1001bricks in France becomes president.
then let's say he passes a law which says you can only sell Lego bricks if
they have never been in contact with mustard. Then Bricklink which has to make
sure sellers in France abide by those laws thinks, that's reasonable, rather
than touching the spaghetti code to target just France let's make sure everyone
agrees to this and if they dont then we would rather not have them as a seller
in which case we will not allow them to sell on the platform.
(as mentioned this is just a fictional example and any names, locations, or roles
are purely coincidental )
I know I'm probably missing something but this is how i understood it when
I first read it.
How can the EU force laws on people that do not live nor sell to the EU? And
how will they actually monitor or enforce it?
As a Canadian resident I do not need to follow any European laws if I do not
sell to the EU or am I wrong?
What's next? The whole world needs to follow the European Dac7 rules?
I may be incorrect (in which case someone will probably correct me soon) but
I dont think they are saying we are "legally bound" by it if we are outside
the EU. rather, those laws (at least in the eyes of bricklink, tho I have not
read them so I cannot say if they are "good" or "bad" ) are something
that a normal person should have no reason to say no to. but if they did then
bricklink would probably see that as a red flag and wouldn't want to do business
with them.
That's probably confusing so I'll try this example to help explain how
I understand it. for example, let's say 1001bricks in France becomes president.
then let's say he passes a law which says you can only sell Lego bricks if
they have never been in contact with mustard. Then Bricklink which has to make
sure sellers in France abide by those laws thinks, that's reasonable, rather
than touching the spaghetti code to target just France let's make sure everyone
agrees to this and if they dont then we would rather not have them as a seller
in which case we will not allow them to sell on the platform.
(as mentioned this is just a fictional example and any names, locations, or roles
are purely coincidental )
I know I'm probably missing something but this is how i understood it when
I first read it.
I'm also having a hard time understanding this, but if BL did something like
eBay with seprate website for each country then they wouldn't have to comply.
I think.
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
How can the EU force laws on people that do not live nor sell to the EU? And
how will they actually monitor or enforce it?
As a Canadian resident I do not need to follow any European laws if I do not
sell to the EU or am I wrong?
What's next? The whole world needs to follow the European Dac7 rules?
The law doesn't apply to you. It applies to Bricklink, who does business
in the EU. In order for THEM to be in compliance, they are requiring all their
sellers to certify. It will be a checkbox and the rules that you can only sell
LEGO products is going to have you covered.
Bricklink could probably have set a smaller policy, but it is probably simplest
for them to connect it to selling. I mainly only sell to USA and Canada, but
I have shipping methods for international shipping that I sometimes open up for
a customer. That's how easy it is for someone who doesn't sell to the
EU to suddenly sell to the EU. Instead of coding up something to watch or bar
that, they are taking care of all registered sellers at once and making it a
part of becoming a seller going forward.
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
One question I don't see answered anywhere is... How do I determine if the
products and services I am selling are in compliance with European Union law
by February 16, 2025? I can't find this information at any of the links prodvided
in the email or in this post.
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
One question I don't see answered anywhere is... How do I determine if the
products and services I am selling are in compliance with European Union law
by February 16, 2025? I can't find this information at any of the links prodvided
in the email or in this post.
LEGO sells their stuff in the EU. If you are selling only LEGO products, LEGO
is making sure for you.
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
Ok so if the EU is focusing on offensive or harmful content..... I promise to
never display a photo of my face and I should be good moving forward.
Does this mean invoices are no longer obligated to purchase. As EU law doesn't
require obligation until actual cost is shown to the customer
No. This doesn't imply that you've switched over to EU law. This is
one isolated policy.
It states products and services in compliance to EU law. It doesn't sound
like one policy.
It is one Bricklink policy that all users will have to check a box saying that
they will not sell anything to the EU that is illegal in the EU. The EU has
not gained jurisdiction over you. The EU already had jurisdiction over Bricklink
and made a new law that Bricklink has to comply with to continue business in
the EU. You may recall that recently China made a new law and Bricklink decided
complying would be too difficult so they shut down business in China. But this
one they've decided they can comply with and his is how they will do it.
Does this mean invoices are no longer obligated to purchase. As EU law doesn't
require obligation until actual cost is shown to the customer
No. This doesn't imply that you've switched over to EU law. This is
one isolated policy.
It states products and services in compliance to EU law. It doesn't sound
like one policy.
It is one Bricklink policy that all users will have to check a box saying that
they will not sell anything to the EU that is illegal in the EU. The EU has
not gained jurisdiction over you. The EU already had jurisdiction over Bricklink
and made a new law that Bricklink has to comply with to continue business in
the EU. You may recall that recently China made a new law and Bricklink decided
complying would be too difficult so they shut down business in China. But this
one they've decided they can comply with and his is how they will do it.
It doesn't imply that any EU law applies to you.
What is the relevance of the Regulation of intermediaries at global level?
The DSA is an important step in defending European values in the online space.
It respects international human rights norms, and helps better protect democracy,
equality and the rule of law.
The DSA sets high standards for effective intervention, for due process and the
protection of fundamental rights online; it preserves a balanced approach to
the liability of intermediaries, and establishes effective measures for tackling
illegal content and societal risks online. In doing so, the DSA aims at setting
a benchmark for a regulatory approach to online intermediaries also at the global
level.
Do these rules apply to companies outside of the EU?
They apply in the EU single market, without discrimination, including to those
online intermediaries established outside of the European Union that offer their
services in the single market. When not established in the EU, they have to appoint
a legal representative, as many companies already do as part of their obligations
in other legal instruments. At the same time, online intermediaries also benefit
from the legal clarity of the liability exemptions and from a single set of rules
when providing their services in the EU.
"What is the Digital Services Act (DSA)?
EU Digital Services Act is a law aimed at creating a safe online environment
across online platforms, such as BrickLink. More specifically, DSA focuses on
illegal and harmful online content. A required step we are taking is enabling
self-certification for BrickLink sellers. The DSA requires that all sellers must
certify that they are providing products and services that are in compliance
with European Union law by February 16, 2025.
What does the self-certification procedure look like?
Sellers must select the checkbox that confirms that they commit to only offer
products and/or services that comply with the applicable rules of European Union
law. No further action is required after that.
If I am not selling to the EU, can I opt out of the DSA self-certification requirement?
No. DSA seller self-certification is required for all sellers. Even though many
of our transactions fall out of the regional scope for DSA, we are committed
to keeping our community safe on a global scale.
This means that all sellers must self-certify if they wish to continue selling
on BrickLink.
I’m a buyer, not a seller. How does DSA affect my account or BrickLink user privileges?
As a buyer you do not need to complete any type of self-certification. However,
if you decide to upgrade to a seller account, you will have to self-certify then.
We will explain this in more detail in our coming updates.
What happens if I have not self-certified my store by February 16, 2025?
If you do not self-certify by February 16, 2025, your store will be suspended.
You will be able to re-open your store if you choose to self-certify at any point
after that. The self-certification requirement applies to all sellers who wish
to continue selling on BrickLink.
When will this change be introduced?
The change is coming into effect shortly. We will notify all members as soon
as it happens."
"What is the Digital Services Act (DSA)?
EU Digital Services Act is a law aimed at creating a safe online environment
across online platforms, such as BrickLink. More specifically, DSA focuses on
illegal and harmful online content. A required step we are taking is enabling
self-certification for BrickLink sellers. The DSA requires that all sellers must
certify that they are providing products and services that are in compliance
with European Union law by February 16, 2025.
What does the self-certification procedure look like?
Sellers must select the checkbox that confirms that they commit to only offer
products and/or services that comply with the applicable rules of European Union
law. No further action is required after that.
If I am not selling to the EU, can I opt out of the DSA self-certification requirement?
No. DSA seller self-certification is required for all sellers. Even though many
of our transactions fall out of the regional scope for DSA, we are committed
to keeping our community safe on a global scale.
This means that all sellers must self-certify if they wish to continue selling
on BrickLink.
I’m a buyer, not a seller. How does DSA affect my account or BrickLink user privileges?
As a buyer you do not need to complete any type of self-certification. However,
if you decide to upgrade to a seller account, you will have to self-certify then.
We will explain this in more detail in our coming updates.
What happens if I have not self-certified my store by February 16, 2025?
If you do not self-certify by February 16, 2025, your store will be suspended.
You will be able to re-open your store if you choose to self-certify at any point
after that. The self-certification requirement applies to all sellers who wish
to continue selling on BrickLink.
When will this change be introduced?
The change is coming into effect shortly. We will notify all members as soon
as it happens."
It says the same exact thing, it says services, this implies laws. The EU has
very strong protections for consumers. Do you represent bricklink legal services
or a lawyer for bricklink?
It says the same exact thing, it says services, this implies laws. The EU has
very strong protections for consumers. Do you represent bricklink legal services
or a lawyer for bricklink?
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
That a US seller only selling goods and services to US buyers would have to comply
with the EU Digital Services Act is absurd.
A much better way would be to allow US sellers to opt out if they are not engaged
in international sales.
The DSA covers a whole can of worms, including issues like hate speech, which
contradict fundamental rights that US citizens have such as freedom of speech.
The DSA covers a whole can of worms, including issues like hate speech, which
contradict fundamental rights that US citizens have such as freedom of speech.
They are only announcing one thing they will require of all their sellers in
order for Bricklink itself to comply with EU law. That one thing does not involve
hate speech or worms, except kraata.
The DSA covers a whole can of worms, including issues like hate speech, which
contradict fundamental rights that US citizens have such as freedom of speech.
They are only announcing one thing they will require of all their sellers in
order for Bricklink itself to comply with EU law. That one thing does not involve
hate speech or worms, except kraata.
That's not true. The "one thing" sellers have to do is «certify that
they are providing products and services that are in compliance with European
Union law». It's not in Bricklink's power to say "the seller checked
the box, so they're good"; it is in Bricklink's power
to say "the seller checked the box, so if you have a problem, don't talk
to us, talk to the seller".
I don't have a problem with this on principle, and I suspect I don't
have a problem with the details of the law. But heck if I can find them in a
human-readable format. I'm not about to make a potentially-legally-binding
agreement to follow a law that is sufficiently complex that I haven't even
been able to find a succinct summary of what areas it covers, let alone what
it mandates, without having some idea what I'm agreeing to.
And, again, it's probably innocuous, with few or no provisions that
even apply to folks selling second-hand Lego on someone else's platform (from
what little I've gleaned).
But Bricklink really should be providing a summary or gloss before asking people
to click.
Something like "by checking the box and confirming, you agree to only offer
products and/or services that comply with the applicable rules of European Union
law. This means that you are agreeing to {do thing1}, {do thing2}, and {not do
thing3}." In the same way that when you're shipping something you don't
agree that what you're shipping "isn't dangerous"; they have
you check a box saying that what you're shipping "isn't {long list
of specific dangerous substances/categories}".
After shortly researching this.... that is NOT TRUE.
While my sales are so low and not to EU I might be protected at present legislation
from taxes, OTHER U.S. and Canadian as well as other NON-EU sellers will be affected.
For U.S. this is equivalent to a 1099 tax form for income.
The goal of DAC-7 is to gather tax information from sellers GLOBALLY that sell
to EU. This will allow them to see if you should be taxed.
In my country we already had similar when states began taxing us for items not
even sold in their state, but sold to someone who lives in their state. Often
both states taxing us.
Now the EU wants their cut also. I recommend any larger U.S. sellers and sellers
not in EU do more research before signing. This could end up affecting seller
fees to us as buyers.
This could even cause larger sellers to exclude EU buyers if they don't live
there and don't wish to risk being unfairly taxed.
The biggest concern after researching for me is that my privacy data could be
collected including sensitive data like Social Security Number be given to EU.
This could lead to risk to my data, and again to people not responsible to me
in any way.
That all said, like many of you I feel forced into this not to lose my tiny store.
I truly wish Bricklink (LEGO) had not tried to lump in people who do not sell
to the EU.
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
That a US seller only selling goods and services to US buyers would have to comply
with the EU Digital Services Act is absurd.
A much better way would be to allow US sellers to opt out if they are not engaged
in international sales.
The DSA covers a whole can of worms, including issues like hate speech, which
contradict fundamental rights that US citizens have such as freedom of speech.
freedom of speech and hate speech are 2 very different things...
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
That a US seller only selling goods and services to US buyers would have to comply
with the EU Digital Services Act is absurd.
A much better way would be to allow US sellers to opt out if they are not engaged
in international sales.
The DSA covers a whole can of worms, including issues like hate speech, which
contradict fundamental rights that US citizens have such as freedom of speech.
freedom of speech and hate speech are 2 very different things...
True, but some people like to label truth as hate....
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
That a US seller only selling goods and services to US buyers would have to comply
with the EU Digital Services Act is absurd.
A much better way would be to allow US sellers to opt out if they are not engaged
in international sales.
The DSA covers a whole can of worms, including issues like hate speech, which
contradict fundamental rights that US citizens have such as freedom of speech.
That's not true. Various platforms have a ToS, that may be facebook, snap,
instagram, we all know that list is endless. They all refuse to allow hate speech
and so forth, those freedoms you refer to are confined to the USA. I have a similar
Bill of Rights.
The reasons all these platforms have to comply this way is a basis set in international
law called "treatment". Never forget there is no obligation for you to
remain on Bricklink, did you pay annuals fees? Nope I didn't either. So you
have made the conscious choice to be a part of Bricklink and therefore should
comply with the privileges Bricklink has provided you.
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
That a US seller only selling goods and services to US buyers would have to comply
with the EU Digital Services Act is absurd.
A much better way would be to allow US sellers to opt out if they are not engaged
in international sales.
The DSA covers a whole can of worms, including issues like hate speech, which
contradict fundamental rights that US citizens have such as freedom of speech.
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
The EU tramples on peoples rights and freedom of speech regularly so how can
they be taken seriously? Glad I live in North America. To think that BL can force
this on ALL sellers whether they ship to the EU or not is a violation of peoples
fundamental rights granted by their individual countries. This is a serious mistake
on the part of BL to force on all. I get that LEGO is HQ'd in an EU country
but shame on them for forcing it on all.
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
The EU tramples on peoples rights and freedom of speech regularly so how can
they be taken seriously? Glad I live in North America. To think that BL can force
this on ALL sellers whether they ship to the EU or not is a violation of peoples
fundamental rights granted by their individual countries. This is a serious mistake
on the part of BL to force on all. I get that LEGO is HQ'd in an EU country
but shame on them for forcing it on all.
Yes but no! Being a part of Bricklink is a privilege not a right. So nothing
is getting "trampled" on is it.
The fact we pays fees is irrelevant, because we are compensating BL retrospectively
to a sale, you dont pay as a buyer and there are not "annual fees" etc.
Fundamental rights are based on a legal premise of "treatment". BL does
not force you to be in the group, so the treatment element is not engaged.
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
The EU tramples on peoples rights and freedom of speech regularly so how can
they be taken seriously? Glad I live in North America. To think that BL can force
this on ALL sellers whether they ship to the EU or not is a violation of peoples
fundamental rights granted by their individual countries. This is a serious mistake
on the part of BL to force on all. I get that LEGO is HQ'd in an EU country
but shame on them for forcing it on all.
Yes but no! Being a part of Bricklink is a privilege not a right. So nothing
is getting "trampled" on is it.
The fact we pays fees is irrelevant, because we are compensating BL retrospectively
to a sale, you dont pay as a buyer and there are not "annual fees" etc.
Fundamental rights are based on a legal premise of "treatment". BL does
not force you to be in the group, so the treatment element is not engaged.
I think you miss the point. It doesn't matter that I'm a buyer. It's
a fact that BL forces EU requirements on the whole of the BL users. I respect
your views but I disagree with the premise that the EU can enforce their view/laws
on those outside of the EU. BL is not a privilege it's a business I never
considered it as a right.
I never said I agreed with it either. but there are 2 pertinent questions here
(1) who is Bricklink, it is an operating subsidiary of TLG (2)Where is the TLG
located. Nothing more needs to be said.
Owning a business is a right I agree. Using a platform to promote that business
like Bricklink is a privilege not a right. You chose the marketing platform it
did not choose you.
I am sure that Bricklink and Anatasia did not take these views lightly and we
must not consider the administrator you know as Anatasia as some desk monkey.
She has over a decades experience in several countries in regards sales/markets/digital
creation/licensing and negotiations.
But the fact remains if we don't sign it then we can't operate. Nothing
more needs to be said and it will have nil effect on us anyways. I am just going
to ban shipping to the entirety of europe from my store.
But the fact remains if we don't sign it then we can't operate. Nothing
more needs to be said and it will have nil effect on us anyways. I am just going
to ban shipping to the entirety of europe from my store.
Why would you ban the whole of Europe over an EU matter? That is like banning
the whole of North America over something due to the United States of Amerca.
But the fact remains if we don't sign it then we can't operate. Nothing
more needs to be said and it will have nil effect on us anyways. I am just going
to ban shipping to the entirety of europe from my store.
Why would you ban the whole of Europe over an EU matter? That is like banning
the whole of North America over something due to the United States of Amerca.
And that doesn’t change anything on BL: you’ll still need to tick the box….
But the fact remains if we don't sign it then we can't operate. Nothing
more needs to be said and it will have nil effect on us anyways. I am just going
to ban shipping to the entirety of europe from my store.
Why would you ban the whole of Europe over an EU matter? That is like banning
the whole of North America over something due to the United States of Amerca.
And that doesn’t change anything on BL: you’ll still need to tick the box….
Indeed. But maybe this could have been handled better. The BL policy could have
been that you have to tick a box saying you only sell genuine LEGO items. With
a second sentence that, if applicable to the seller, by ticking this box this
complies with EU blah blah blah that few people bother to read. Of course that
might mean self designed instructions cannot be sold as they are not genuine
LEGO.
[…]
Indeed. But maybe this could have been handled better. The BL policy could have
been that you have to tick a box saying you only sell genuine LEGO items. With
a second sentence that, if applicable to the seller, by ticking this box this
complies with EU blah blah blah that few people bother to read. Of course that
might mean self designed instructions cannot be sold as they are not genuine
LEGO.
Well, we don’t know yet what the checkbox will say. But, sure, BL chose to say
“EU blah blah,” and that always trigger some epidermic reactions 🤷♂️
OTOH, if they didn’t say “DSA” somewhere, some would have dug it out and whined
even more….
[…]
Indeed. But maybe this could have been handled better. The BL policy could have
been that you have to tick a box saying you only sell genuine LEGO items. With
a second sentence that, if applicable to the seller, by ticking this box this
complies with EU blah blah blah that few people bother to read. Of course that
might mean self designed instructions cannot be sold as they are not genuine
LEGO.
Well, we don’t know yet what the checkbox will say. But, sure, BL chose to say
“EU blah blah,” and that always trigger some epidermic reactions
I happen to be highly allergic to EU blather, makes me angry
But the fact remains if we don't sign it then we can't operate. Nothing
more needs to be said and it will have nil effect on us anyways. I am just going
to ban shipping to the entirety of europe from my store.
Why would you ban the whole of Europe over an EU matter? That is like banning
the whole of North America over something due to the United States of Amerca.
And that doesn’t change anything on BL: you’ll still need to tick the box….
But the fact remains if we don't sign it then we can't operate. Nothing
more needs to be said and it will have nil effect on us anyways. I am just going
to ban shipping to the entirety of europe from my store.
Why would you ban the whole of Europe over an EU matter? That is like banning
the whole of North America over something due to the United States of Amerca.
And that doesn’t change anything on BL: you’ll still need to tick the box….
But where is the box I have to tick?
Read the message.
When will this change be introduced?
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
our emails, the BrickLink Forum...
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
The EU tramples on peoples rights and freedom of speech regularly so how can
they be taken seriously? Glad I live in North America. To think that BL can force
this on ALL sellers whether they ship to the EU or not is a violation of peoples
fundamental rights granted by their individual countries. This is a serious mistake
on the part of BL to force on all. I get that LEGO is HQ'd in an EU country
but shame on them for forcing it on all.
Yes but no! Being a part of Bricklink is a privilege not a right. So nothing
is getting "trampled" on is it.
The fact we pays fees is irrelevant, because we are compensating BL retrospectively
to a sale, you dont pay as a buyer and there are not "annual fees" etc.
Fundamental rights are based on a legal premise of "treatment". BL does
not force you to be in the group, so the treatment element is not engaged.
It is a fundamental right not to be subject to the laws of another country if
you have nothing to do with that country.
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
The EU tramples on peoples rights and freedom of speech regularly so how can
they be taken seriously? Glad I live in North America. To think that BL can force
this on ALL sellers whether they ship to the EU or not is a violation of peoples
fundamental rights granted by their individual countries. This is a serious mistake
on the part of BL to force on all. I get that LEGO is HQ'd in an EU country
but shame on them for forcing it on all.
Yes but no! Being a part of Bricklink is a privilege not a right. So nothing
is getting "trampled" on is it.
The fact we pays fees is irrelevant, because we are compensating BL retrospectively
to a sale, you dont pay as a buyer and there are not "annual fees" etc.
Fundamental rights are based on a legal premise of "treatment". BL does
not force you to be in the group, so the treatment element is not engaged.
It is a fundamental right not to be subject to the laws of another country if
you have nothing to do with that country.
"The DSA requires that all sellers must certify that they are providing
products and services that are in compliance with European Union law"
Does anyone have this quote from the DSA? Does the DSA in fact require that
a platform such as Bricklink require each individual seller to certify? Or, is
the individual certification something Bricklink is introducing in order to meet
their obligations under the DSA?
If Lego, and Lego products are acceptable under the DSA, then why isn't the
Bricklink TOS, that requires that sellers only sell genuine Lego and Lego products
enough?
I am happy to comply with Bricklink TOS, however, I am not happy that people
in Europe have decided to create such a useless bureaucratic leviathan, that
not content to oppress its own people, now tries to extend its tentacles to other
parts of the world that are still free.
"The DSA requires that all sellers must certify that they are providing
products and services that are in compliance with European Union law"
Does anyone have this quote from the DSA? Does the DSA in fact require that
a platform such as Bricklink require each individual seller to certify? Or, is
the individual certification something Bricklink is introducing in order to meet
their obligations under the DSA?
If Lego, and Lego products are acceptable under the DSA, then why isn't the
Bricklink TOS, that requires that sellers only sell genuine Lego and Lego products
enough?
I am happy to comply with Bricklink TOS, however, I am not happy that people
in Europe have decided to create such a useless bureaucratic leviathan, that
not content to oppress its own people, now tries to extend its tentacles to other
parts of the world that are still free.
You do follow your countries laws, no? I am guessing that you probably do, since
most people that I have met in the LEGO world seem like good people who follow
laws. I don't like the idea of this stuff either, but Canada isn't an
anarchy. You may be _freer_ in your little niche of the planet than some other
parts, but you aren't "free" in the true definition of the word.
I would guess that a vast majority of the people on the planet are under the
control of some institution or another, so talking in absolutes is not helpful
in arguments.
Having said all of that, there are definitely other ways that this could have
been handled. I wonder how much feedback was collected around this and how it
would change the demographics of the userbase here. We already lost the Chinese
LEGO community, so how much of the community will be lost because of this?
"The DSA requires that all sellers must certify that they are providing
products and services that are in compliance with European Union law"
Does anyone have this quote from the DSA? Does the DSA in fact require that
a platform such as Bricklink require each individual seller to certify? Or, is
the individual certification something Bricklink is introducing in order to meet
their obligations under the DSA?
If Lego, and Lego products are acceptable under the DSA, then why isn't the
Bricklink TOS, that requires that sellers only sell genuine Lego and Lego products
enough?
I am happy to comply with Bricklink TOS, however, I am not happy that people
in Europe have decided to create such a useless bureaucratic leviathan, that
not content to oppress its own people, now tries to extend its tentacles to other
parts of the world that are still free.
You do follow your countries laws, no? I am guessing that you probably do, since
most people that I have met in the LEGO world seem like good people who follow
laws. I don't like the idea of this stuff either, but Canada isn't an
anarchy. You may be _freer_ in your little niche of the planet than some other
parts, but you aren't "free" in the true definition of the word.
I would guess that a vast majority of the people on the planet are under the
control of some institution or another, so talking in absolutes is not helpful
in arguments.
I'm sorry, I can't hear you over my free health care, tax free reservations
with free housing, sale tax rebates, and free money.
Having said all of that, there are definitely other ways that this could have
been handled. I wonder how much feedback was collected around this and how it
would change the demographics of the userbase here. We already lost the Chinese
LEGO community, so how much of the community will be lost because of this?
Cheers,
Randy
Sadly I fear, this will be a source of division, even tho all we are doing is
clicking a box that says IF we do sell to the EU we will obay their rules, and
it effects us in NO way.
Sadly I fear, this will be a source of division, even tho all we are doing is
clicking a box that says IF we do sell to the EU we will obay their rules, and
it effects us in NO way.
we recently had an order going to this USA Address:
FPO
AE 09627
USA
(a US Navy Base somewhere)
it just departed Rome Italy, enroute to the address, according to tracking.
so regardless of if your shipment is addressed USA (or your own home country),
this is an example of how you can get tangled up in 'foreign affairs'.
we do not ship to Europe nor anywhere International period, yet apparently, our
package is going through the EU systems via USPS.
it just departed Rome Italy, enroute to the address, according to tracking.
so regardless of if your shipment is addressed USA (or your own home country),
this is an example of how you can get tangled up in 'foreign affairs'.
we do not ship to Europe nor anywhere International period, yet apparently, our
package is going through the EU systems via USPS.
If I’m not mistaken:
1. The mail is handled by USPS and the military postal service, never by foreign
postal services.
2. You’re filling a customs declaration when you’re sending goods that cross
borders. You’re then aware that you’re exporting something and should then respect
the laws of the country you’re exporting to.
And even then, as it’s a military address and you don’t know which country you’re
exporting to, that must mean that the package may leave the USA (hence why it
needs a custom declaration) but only to go in international zones and go back
in the USA (the military base or vessel or the US ambassy). So you’re not exporting
anything, it’s the military personel who receives it who may be importing it
in the country they are based in if they move the contents out of base.
There are a small number of USPS Zip Codes (in Virginia, IIRC) which have fake
street names, and actually are for mail being sent to US Diplomatic missions
overseas (embassies, consulates, etc).
I've only encountered it once or twice, and it has been so long ago that
I don't recall if there was a customs form involved. Why I even noticed them
was some oddity in how the postage was generated. There may be a list of them
buried somewhere in the USPS DMM.
The elderly lady (Ann, may she rest in peace) at the local post office counter
was well aware of them and helped me understand what was happening there.
(Oops, ambassador but embassy. Is Nubs writing the dictionary
now? )
There are a small number of USPS Zip Codes (in Virginia, IIRC) which have fake
street names, and actually are for mail being sent to US Diplomatic missions
overseas (embassies, consulates, etc).
I’ve no idea if there’s a similar “trick” in France.
If I search for the address of an embassy, I get the physical address: obviously,
the main reason for such a search is to go there 😅
I've only encountered it once or twice, and it has been so long ago that
I don't recall if there was a customs form involved. Why I even noticed them
was some oddity in how the postage was generated. There may be a list of them
buried somewhere in the USPS DMM.
The elderly lady (Ann, may she rest in peace) at the local post office counter
was well aware of them and helped me understand what was happening there.
It shouldn’t but it doesn’t fail to surprise me all the knowledge there’s in
some places/jobs.
Fascinating.
It is a fundamental right not to be subject to the laws of another country if
you have nothing to do with that country.
This is why it shouldn't be framed in this way. Just make it that all sellers
must tick a box agreeing only to sell genuine LEGO parts or whatever wording
they want. That is then a site regulation. A regulation that allows some users
to comply with EU regulations where necessary.
Similarly, they could ban all sellers from adding on fees for PayPal. Even if
local laws allow it, they could make it a site regulation that you cannot do
it, standardised for all.
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
Hi BrickLink team,
You engage in legal overreach as I have no intention to sell anything overseas
other than NZ. Consequently can you please close my store permanently as I have
no intention as a company to comply with laws and regulations, where my company
is not subject to.
As it currently stands I sell more anyway through other channels.
You engage in legal overreach as I have no intention to sell anything overseas
other than NZ. Consequently can you please close my store permanently as I have
no intention as a company to comply with laws and regulations, where my company
is not subject to.
As it currently stands I sell more anyway through other channels.
Thank you.
Your store is currently closed. If YOU don't open it, it will remain closed.
If you want it permanently closed you can request this here ...
You engage in legal overreach as I have no intention to sell anything overseas
other than NZ. Consequently can you please close my store permanently as I have
no intention as a company to comply with laws and regulations, where my company
is not subject to.
As it currently stands I sell more anyway through other channels.
Thank you.
Your store is currently closed. If YOU don't open it, it will remain closed.
If you want it permanently closed you can request this here ...
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
Dear members,
This requirement applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European Union or not.
Sigh...
I am sorry BrickLink, but if you are going to ask a bunch of non-EU people who
don't sell to EU countries to promise to comply with an EU law, then you
are going to have to explain yourself better than this.
Of course it is not reasonable to ask a non-citizen or stakeholder to agree to
an EU law.
If you are turning this on for all sellers globally because you aren't prepared
to build the infrastructure to do so at an individual store level, then please,
just say so. It's understandable as long as you are transparent about it.
Clear communication will help things along.
"We can't check if you change or update your shipping settings in the
future, so we need you to do this now."
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
Dear members,
This requirement applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European Union or not.
Sigh...
I am sorry BrickLink, but if you are going to ask a bunch of non-EU people who
don't sell to EU countries to promise to comply with an EU law, then you
are going to have to explain yourself better than this.
Of course it is not reasonable to ask a non-citizen or stakeholder to agree to
an EU law.
If you are turning this on for all sellers globally because you aren't prepared
to build the infrastructure to do so at an individual store level, then please,
just say so. It's understandable as long as you are transparent about it.
Clear communication will help things along.
"We can't check if you change or update your shipping settings in the
future, so we need you to do this now."
Thank you,
~Jen
May I suggest you contact the FBI and voice your displeasure about a single country
enforcing their laws on the entire world.
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
Dear members,
This requirement applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European Union or not.
Sigh...
I am sorry BrickLink, but if you are going to ask a bunch of non-EU people who
don't sell to EU countries to promise to comply with an EU law, then you
are going to have to explain yourself better than this.
Of course it is not reasonable to ask a non-citizen or stakeholder to agree to
an EU law.
If you are turning this on for all sellers globally because you aren't prepared
to build the infrastructure to do so at an individual store level, then please,
just say so. It's understandable as long as you are transparent about it.
Clear communication will help things along.
"We can't check if you change or update your shipping settings in the
future, so we need you to do this now."
Thank you,
~Jen
May I suggest you contact the FBI and voice your displeasure about a single country
enforcing their laws on the entire world.
Yeah, no thanks. For one thing, I don't care that much. It's a check
box. And for another, the EU is not a single country. They just have a heavy-handed
approach to fixing things.
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
Dear members,
This requirement applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European Union or not.
Sigh...
I am sorry BrickLink, but if you are going to ask a bunch of non-EU people who
don't sell to EU countries to promise to comply with an EU law, then you
are going to have to explain yourself better than this.
Of course it is not reasonable to ask a non-citizen or stakeholder to agree to
an EU law.
If you are turning this on for all sellers globally because you aren't prepared
to build the infrastructure to do so at an individual store level, then please,
just say so. It's understandable as long as you are transparent about it.
Clear communication will help things along.
"We can't check if you change or update your shipping settings in the
future, so we need you to do this now."
Thank you,
~Jen
Wearing my devil's advocate avatar for a moment ... The fly in the ointment
is freight forwarders, that combined with BL having a large presence in the EU.
Freight forwarders will likely not have to complete this, as they are not selling
anything, only acting as common carriers. BL is indeed taking an approach which
their legal department is telling them has to be done this way. I also disagree
with this approach. Pls see my other comment (up-thread) concerning freight forwarders
and stealth selling/shipping of products.
Looking at my BL orders, I have shipped one order to an EU address in the last
6 months. I have one another with an EU flag on the order page, but that was
shipped to a US address.
It isn't even remotely worth my time and effort to even begin to read & comprehend
EU laws and then think about certifying my compliance with those laws.
1. Will BrickLink share the self-certification information with the EU or anyone
else?
2. It is technologically lazy to not offer an opt-out of EU self-certification.
This is what I want.
I see other platforms offering a more nuanced approach. e.g. "If you’re
a registered business seller who has listings available for purchase to buyers
in the European Union, your listings will reflect the rules established by the
Digital Services Act. "
When I get some time in the next few days, I'll disable shipping to EU countries.
It is a pain to have to review every shipping method, a country or region yes/no
override would help. If BL had an override that simply blocked a country (or
region) that would help.
As of now, I'll either form an LLC or stop selling.
I don't know the others, but I *hate* when BrickLink sends such "News"
to everyone a Friday night - when people at BrickLink admins / help desk is weekending.
Let me try to decode for the others...
"DSA focuses on illegal and harmful online content."
Illegal would be copyrighted materials (Licences...) or fabrication and resale
of patented parts or elements (like Minifigures afaik).
It's exactly what many here come and shout in forum about "fake legos"
(with the s, the more often).
Harmful would be items made with no internatioal or authorized certifications,
like a plastic that could contain some harmful chemicals.
Who wants to give their children toxic parts?
All in all, this is to say "We don't want BrickLink to be known as selling
servile copies and crappy items".
And sellers will have to clearly say "I don't (knowingly at least) sell
those".
I don't see this as a problem.
"The DSA requires that all sellers must certify that they are providing
products and services that are in compliance with European Union law"
That means that BrickLink, as a marketplace HAS - by law - to specify it passes
this.
And for ALL sellers, including those American rebels who say "What the heck
this EU rule!"
BrickLink have to respect this, while forcing people to agree - because they
don't have any other choice.
Or the other one being the whole BrickLink being closed.
I don't wish BrickLink to being closed.
And about US people complaining to follow EU regulations, come on...
You seriously think EU and other Countries don't already follow various rules/laws
enforced - one way or another - by USA? LOL
Apart this, I hate this new introduction / intrusion of regulations and laws.
More control, less freedom to exchange, reducing the worldwide market to simple
zones and countries fighthing or ignoring the others - and il all cases more
taxes to come (later on, of course).
BrickLink have to respect this, while forcing people to agree - because they
don't have any other choice.
Or the other one being the whole BrickLink being closed.
I don't wish BrickLink to being closed.
Isn't there the option of not operating in the EU, and banning EU residents
from accessing BL services? I'm not saying that us a good option but that
was the direction taken with China.
Took 10 mins skimming over the rants and misinterpretations until I found your
clear and concise overview
Thanks for the post!!
... just MyTwoPence
In Administrative, 1001bricks writes:
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
I don't know the others, but I *hate* when BrickLink sends such "News"
to everyone a Friday night - when people at BrickLink admins / help desk is weekending.
Let me try to decode for the others...
"DSA focuses on illegal and harmful online content."
Illegal would be copyrighted materials (Licences...) or fabrication and resale
of patented parts or elements (like Minifigures afaik).
It's exactly what many here come and shout in forum about "fake legos"
(with the s, the more often).
Harmful would be items made with no internatioal or authorized certifications,
like a plastic that could contain some harmful chemicals.
Who wants to give their children toxic parts?
All in all, this is to say "We don't want BrickLink to be known as selling
servile copies and crappy items".
And sellers will have to clearly say "I don't (knowingly at least) sell
those".
I don't see this as a problem.
"The DSA requires that all sellers must certify that they are providing
products and services that are in compliance with European Union law"
That means that BrickLink, as a marketplace HAS - by law - to specify it passes
this.
And for ALL sellers, including those American rebels who say "What the heck
this EU rule!"
BrickLink have to respect this, while forcing people to agree - because they
don't have any other choice.
Or the other one being the whole BrickLink being closed.
I don't wish BrickLink to being closed.
And about US people complaining to follow EU regulations, come on...
You seriously think EU and other Countries don't already follow various rules/laws
enforced - one way or another - by USA? LOL
Apart this, I hate this new introduction / intrusion of regulations and laws.
More control, less freedom to exchange, reducing the worldwide market to simple
zones and countries fighthing or ignoring the others - and il all cases more
taxes to come (later on, of course).
"DSA focuses on illegal and harmful online content."
Illegal would be copyrighted materials (Licences...) or fabrication and resale
of patented parts or elements (like Minifigures afaik).
It's exactly what many here come and shout in forum about "fake legos"
(with the s, the more often).
Harmful would be items made with no internatioal or authorized certifications,
like a plastic that could contain some harmful chemicals.
Who wants to give their children toxic parts?
All in all, this is to say "We don't want BrickLink to be known as selling
servile copies and crappy items".
And sellers will have to clearly say "I don't (knowingly at least) sell
those".
I don't see this as a problem.
"The DSA requires that all sellers must certify that they are providing
products and services that are in compliance with European Union law"
That means that BrickLink, as a marketplace HAS - by law - to specify it passes
this.
And for ALL sellers, including those American rebels who say "What the heck
this EU rule!"
Please add something like this explanation to the popup message asking us to
agree to comply. It really should be right there on the screen that is asking
you to legally attest to it.
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
So for a US based seller that only sells to the US, the newsletter says I have
to check a box.
“What does the self-certification procedure look like?
Sellers must select the checkbox that confirms that they commit to only offer
products and/or services that comply with the applicable rules of European Union
law. No further action is required after that.”
No further action is required after I check the box is how I read it. Doesn’t
say I have to actually read or understand the EU law, just follow it if I were
to ship to the EU at some point in the future. And since the only thing we sell
on here is LEGO, then that should guarantee compliance.
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
So for a US based seller that only sells to the US, the newsletter says I have
to check a box.
“What does the self-certification procedure look like?
Sellers must select the checkbox that confirms that they commit to only offer
products and/or services that comply with the applicable rules of European Union
law. No further action is required after that.”
No further action is required after I check the box is how I read it. Doesn’t
say I have to actually read or understand the EU law, just follow it if I were
to ship to the EU at some point in the future. And since the only thing we sell
on here is LEGO, then that should guarantee compliance.
The problem is the freight forwarders. They in no way are affected by this law,
but they do enable someone in the EU to buy from you, with delivery (via the
FF in USA) to the EU.
As to compliance, there is a presumption that everyone is only selling official
LEGO parts. I get that, and I agree with that, but there is the issue with used
parts that much of that (as acquired by sellers from whatever source) has no
provenance. If you buy a bag of used LEGO parts off eBay, to sort and list into
your store, you can pick out the obvious ones that are clone parts, but a few
parts (e.g. 3062) may be very hard to determine if authentic. Which is why this
law, and the path BL is choosing to take, leaves many of us in a precarious situation.
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
So for a US based seller that only sells to the US, the newsletter says I have
to check a box.
“What does the self-certification procedure look like?
Sellers must select the checkbox that confirms that they commit to only offer
products and/or services that comply with the applicable rules of European Union
law. No further action is required after that.”
No further action is required after I check the box is how I read it. Doesn’t
say I have to actually read or understand the EU law, just follow it if I were
to ship to the EU at some point in the future. And since the only thing we sell
on here is LEGO, then that should guarantee compliance.
The problem is the freight forwarders. They in no way are affected by this law,
but they do enable someone in the EU to buy from you, with delivery (via the
FF in USA) to the EU.
As to compliance, there is a presumption that everyone is only selling official
LEGO parts. I get that, and I agree with that, but there is the issue with used
parts that much of that (as acquired by sellers from whatever source) has no
provenance. If you buy a bag of used LEGO parts off eBay, to sort and list into
your store, you can pick out the obvious ones that are clone parts, but a few
parts (e.g. 3062) may be very hard to determine if authentic. Which is why this
law, and the path BL is choosing to take, leaves many of us in a precarious situation.
NR
When it comes to freight forwarders, I’m still only selling to the US address.
As far as this law goes, my obligation ends once it reaches the usually Portland
address.
I may certainly be wrong but if a store has been closed by Bricklink it usually
is a suspension which is indicated as such when you call up the store????
In Administrative, Brickman4you writes:
How about NO...
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
Dear members,
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
I may certainly be wrong but if a store has been closed by Bricklink it usually
is a suspension which is indicated as such when you call up the store????
It feels to me like they have closed their store voluntarily since as you point
out, when Bricklink does it, they post why on the store landing page. Also, they
have deleted their terms, shipping info, and removed all of their inventory.
It is ironic their feedback is 1984 considering the mood of this thread.
I wonder what they posted in the forum that the mods removed.
I may certainly be wrong but if a store has been closed by Bricklink it usually
is a suspension which is indicated as such when you call up the store????
It feels to me like they have closed their store voluntarily since as you point
out, when Bricklink does it, they post why on the store landing page. Also, they
have deleted their terms, shipping info, and removed all of their inventory.
It is ironic their feedback is 1984 considering the mood of this thread.
I wonder what they posted in the forum that the mods removed.
What a saw was a post that included a link to a youtube video, clarifying how
DSA applies or is being broadly enacted, and the obvious challenges therein.
Just how far it can be pushed
If you pm them, I'm sure they will send the link to you.
I may certainly be wrong but if a store has been closed by Bricklink it usually
is a suspension which is indicated as such when you call up the store????
It feels to me like they have closed their store voluntarily since as you point
out, when Bricklink does it, they post why on the store landing page. Also, they
have deleted their terms, shipping info, and removed all of their inventory.
It is ironic their feedback is 1984 considering the mood of this thread.
I wonder what they posted in the forum that the mods removed.
What a saw was a post that included a link to a youtube video, clarifying how
DSA applies or is being broadly enacted, and the obvious challenges therein.
Just how far it can be pushed
If you pm them, I'm sure they will send the link to you.
They had a similar link in their store closure message.
Isn't this a classic case of poorly chosen language leading to mass hysteria
in the populace? In her Forum post Anastasia wrote:-
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
Dear members,
The DSA requires that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European Union or not.
Queue the population of the non-EU world ranting about abuse of freedoms and
arrogant EU legal overreach. The DSA does not require all global sellers to only
provide EU compliant products to buyers anywhere in the world.
The Bricklink Newsletter email states it as:-
In Newsletter, Bricklink writes:
By February 16, 2025 our sellers would have to certify that products that they are
shipping to the EU are in compliance with European Union law.
Now IANAL, however I think it is entirely feasible that it is already prohibited
to send illegal in the EU items to the EU. Just I'm fairly sure I am not
allowed to ship items that are illegal in the US, or Canada, or Australia etc
etc to those countries. To check a box certifying that should you ship products
to the EU those products will comply with EU law would appear to be agreeing
to no change in the current position.
If you do not sell to the EU, you can happily check the box to say IF you do
you have to only sell items legal in the EU to the EU.
The newsletter also makes it clearer that the seller is certifying for goods
the seller is shipping to the EU. The seller is not certifying for goods the
seller shipped domestically for someone else to ship to the EU.
The Forum announcement could have been worded as per the Newsletter wording and
have avoided the outpouring of angst. Maybe. In this internet age of instant
offence maybe not.
Isn't this a classic case of poorly chosen language leading to mass hysteria
in the populace? In her Forum post Anastasia wrote:-
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
Dear members,
The DSA requires that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European Union or not.
Queue the population of the non-EU world ranting about abuse of freedoms and
arrogant EU legal overreach. The DSA does not require all global sellers to only
provide EU compliant products to buyers anywhere in the world.
The Bricklink Newsletter email states it as:-
In Newsletter, Bricklink writes:
By February 16, 2025 our sellers would have to certify that products that they are
shipping to the EU are in compliance with European Union law.
Now IANAL, however I think it is entirely feasible that it is already prohibited
to send illegal in the EU items to the EU. Just I'm fairly sure I am not
allowed to ship items that are illegal in the US, or Canada, or Australia etc
etc to those countries. To check a box certifying that should you ship products
to the EU those products will comply with EU law would appear to be agreeing
to no change in the current position.
If you do not sell to the EU, you can happily check the box to say IF you do
you have to only sell items legal in the EU to the EU.
The newsletter also makes it clearer that the seller is certifying for goods
the seller is shipping to the EU. The seller is not certifying for goods the
seller shipped domestically for someone else to ship to the EU.
The Forum announcement could have been worded as per the Newsletter wording and
have avoided the outpouring of angst. Maybe. In this internet age of instant
offence maybe not.
The newsletter also says this:
"If I am not selling to the EU, can I opt out of the DSA self-certification
requirement?
No. DSA seller self-certification is required for all sellers. Even though many
of our transactions fall out of the regional scope for DSA, we are committed
to keeping our community safe on a global scale. This means that all sellers
must self-certify if they wish to continue selling on BrickLink."
So, it would seem they are insisting the non-EU sellers shipping to non-EU countries
must follow EU laws. You know... for safety. Whatever that means. Why anyone
would think that is okay is beyond me but what can you do?
It is overreach plain and simple. There is no chance that I am going to become
educated enough about European law to honestly and fairly click that box. I am
going to click it anyway because, I simply don't care, and what system of
enforcement could they possibly have in place to check what items I ship to California?
I am shipping THEIR product after all. Now, who's going to take responsibility
for the brittle brown??
Again, poor choice of language by Bricklink to claim community safety on a global
scale. By checking the box what is it you are being asked to certify? Is it that
all products sold from anywhere to anywhere comply with EU law? That would be
a massive legal overreach if that is what the EU intends (which I do not believe
it is). Or, as was stated in the Newsletter, is it that goods shipped to the
EU from anywhere comply with EU law. Not overreach.
As always Bricklink have taken the path of least resistance and then dressed
it up in ill considered marketing talk to make it sound professional.
Has anyone spared a thought for the purveyors of Keto Stayhard Gummies? Where
does EU law stand on these???
In Administrative, jennnifer writes:
The newsletter also says this:
"If I am not selling to the EU, can I opt out of the DSA self-certification
requirement?
No. DSA seller self-certification is required for all sellers. Even though many
of our transactions fall out of the regional scope for DSA, we are committed
to keeping our community safe on a global scale. This means that all sellers
must self-certify if they wish to continue selling on BrickLink."
So, it would seem they are insisting the non-EU sellers shipping to non-EU countries
must follow EU laws. You know... for safety. Whatever that means. Why anyone
would think that is okay is beyond me but what can you do?
It is overreach plain and simple. There is no chance that I am going to become
educated enough about European law to honestly and fairly click that box. I am
going to click it anyway because, I simply don't care, and what system of
enforcement could they possibly have in place to check what items I ship to California?
I am shipping THEIR product after all. Now, who's going to take responsibility
for the brittle brown??
Again, poor choice of language by Bricklink to claim community safety on a global
scale. By checking the box what is it you are being asked to certify? Is it that
all products sold from anywhere to anywhere comply with EU law? That would be
a massive legal overreach if that is what the EU intends (which I do not believe
it is). Or, as was stated in the Newsletter, is it that goods shipped to the
EU from anywhere comply with EU law.
LEGO have acquired BrickLink.
LEGO (DK) have to comply with EU rules.
This marketplace has to confirm people are not selling illegal or harmful products.
See:
https://www.bricklink.com/message.asp?ID=1494558
Sellers certify themselves while checking a check box somewhere "I hereby
certify I won't sell 'crap'".
That's all.
But note that if (especially) you knowingly sell 'crap' you may get in
trouble as you certified you would not.
Again, I'm not sure what's the problem with checking this box.
It won't make people of the World "lose all their freedom"
As always Bricklink have taken the path of least resistance and then dressed
it up in ill considered marketing talk to make it sound professional.
Again, poor choice of language by Bricklink to claim community safety on a global
scale. By checking the box what is it you are being asked to certify? Is it that
all products sold from anywhere to anywhere comply with EU law? That would be
a massive legal overreach if that is what the EU intends (which I do not believe
it is). Or, as was stated in the Newsletter, is it that goods shipped to the
EU from anywhere comply with EU law.
LEGO have acquired BrickLink.
LEGO (DK) have to comply with EU rules.
This marketplace has to confirm people are not selling illegal or harmful products.
See:
https://www.bricklink.com/message.asp?ID=1494558
Sellers certify themselves while checking a check box somewhere "I hereby
certify I won't sell 'crap'".
That's all.
But note that if (especially) you knowingly sell 'crap' you may get in
trouble as you certified you would not.
Again, I'm not sure what's the problem with checking this box.
Many of us are trained not to pay taxes or agree to laws without representation.
It won't make people of the World "lose all their freedom"
Vigilance. If you don't speak up, you get what you get.
As always Bricklink have taken the path of least resistance and then dressed
it up in ill considered marketing talk to make it sound professional.
Sure - you'd do it better
Transparency would be better. "You'll do this (even though it's not
really applicable to you) or else.. Begone!" It's heavy handed and not
going to win them any more fans.
Again, poor choice of language by Bricklink to claim community safety on a global
scale. By checking the box what is it you are being asked to certify? Is it that
all products sold from anywhere to anywhere comply with EU law? That would be
a massive legal overreach if that is what the EU intends (which I do not believe
it is). Or, as was stated in the Newsletter, is it that goods shipped to the
EU from anywhere comply with EU law.
LEGO have acquired BrickLink.
LEGO (DK) have to comply with EU rules.
This marketplace has to confirm people are not selling illegal or harmful products.
See:
https://www.bricklink.com/message.asp?ID=1494558
Sellers certify themselves while checking a check box somewhere "I hereby
certify I won't sell 'crap'".
That's all.
But note that if (especially) you knowingly sell 'crap' you may get in
trouble as you certified you would not.
Again, I'm not sure what's the problem with checking this box.
Many of us are trained not to pay taxes or agree to laws without representation.
It's not a law you're agreeing to; it's a BrickLink Term you'll
have to, a private company rule if you wish.
Transparency would be better. "You'll do this (even though it's not
really applicable to you) or else.. Begone!"
Or if we don't BrickLink is gone, apparently.
And don't worry, it's already a problem for them to ask us this.
They'll lose a few sellers who won't accept - like with DAC7.
So all il all, they're not happy to impose this, they're just losing
money (+ some fans faith).
Again, poor choice of language by Bricklink to claim community safety on a global
scale. By checking the box what is it you are being asked to certify? Is it that
all products sold from anywhere to anywhere comply with EU law? That would be
a massive legal overreach if that is what the EU intends (which I do not believe
it is). Or, as was stated in the Newsletter, is it that goods shipped to the
EU from anywhere comply with EU law.
LEGO have acquired BrickLink.
LEGO (DK) have to comply with EU rules.
This marketplace has to confirm people are not selling illegal or harmful products.
See:
https://www.bricklink.com/message.asp?ID=1494558
Sellers certify themselves while checking a check box somewhere "I hereby
certify I won't sell 'crap'".
That's all.
But note that if (especially) you knowingly sell 'crap' you may get in
trouble as you certified you would not.
Again, I'm not sure what's the problem with checking this box.
Many of us are trained not to pay taxes or agree to laws without representation.
It's not a law you're agreeing to; it's a BrickLink Term you'll
have to, a private company rule if you wish.
Transparency would be better. "You'll do this (even though it's not
really applicable to you) or else.. Begone!"
Or if we don't BrickLink is gone, apparently.
And don't worry, it's already a problem for them to ask us this.
They'll lose a few sellers who won't accept - like with DAC7.
So all il all, they're not happy to impose this, they're just losing
money (+ some fans faith).
But it is a law bricklink has to comply to and via terms and conditions a user
has to comply with the law bricklink signed up for.
But it is a law bricklink has to comply to and via terms and conditions a user
has to comply with the law bricklink signed up for.
Sure. You wish they shouldn't comply with laws
That wasn't your point. Your point was as a seller we were not agreeing to
the law, but terms and conditions. The terms and conditions are the law, therefore
we are agreeing to the new EU laws.
But it is a law bricklink has to comply to and via terms and conditions a user
has to comply with the law bricklink signed up for.
Sure. You wish they shouldn't comply with laws
That wasn't your point. Your point was as a seller we were not agreeing to
the law, but terms and conditions. The terms and conditions are the law, therefore
we are agreeing to the new EU laws.
No, you're agreing with BrickLink that you won't sell whatever BrickLink
will tell you not to.
They could say it's for "DSA", "KMD" or "BLOP" or
just for funzies - you should still have to agree with them.
That wasn't your point. Your point was as a seller we were not agreeing to
the law, but terms and conditions. The terms and conditions are the law, therefore
we are agreeing to the new EU laws.
No, you're agreing with BrickLink that you won't sell whatever BrickLink
will tell you not to.
They could say it's for "DSA", "KMD" or "BLOP" or
just for funzies - you should still have to agree with them.
Indeed. They could have said that they now require all sellers to tick a box
declaring that they will only sell genuine LEGO parts or whatever wording they
want. I doubt any honest sellers would refuse to agree to that.
Then later said that there is a new directive that all sellers selling to the
EU must abide by but everyone, whether they are selling to the EU or not, is
already covered by default.
But it is a law bricklink has to comply to and via terms and conditions a user
has to comply with the law bricklink signed up for.
Sure. You wish they shouldn't comply with laws
That wasn't your point. Your point was as a seller we were not agreeing to
the law, but terms and conditions. The terms and conditions are the law, therefore
we are agreeing to the new EU laws.
No, you're agreing with BrickLink that you won't sell whatever BrickLink
will tell you not to.
They could say it's for "DSA", "KMD" or "BLOP" or
just for funzies - you should still have to agree with them.
You make it sound like legal obligations are a joke, sign me up it's all
cool! Poking fun at check boxes doesn't solve anything or add to the conversation,
it just diverts
Isn't this a classic case of poorly chosen language leading to mass hysteria
in the populace? In her Forum post Anastasia wrote:-
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
Dear members,
The DSA requires that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European Union or not.
Queue the population of the non-EU world ranting about abuse of freedoms and
arrogant EU legal overreach. The DSA does not require all global sellers to only
provide EU compliant products to buyers anywhere in the world.
The Bricklink Newsletter email states it as:-
In Newsletter, Bricklink writes:
By February 16, 2025 our sellers would have to certify that products that they are
shipping to the EU are in compliance with European Union law.
Now IANAL, however I think it is entirely feasible that it is already prohibited
to send illegal in the EU items to the EU. Just I'm fairly sure I am not
allowed to ship items that are illegal in the US, or Canada, or Australia etc
etc to those countries. To check a box certifying that should you ship products
to the EU those products will comply with EU law would appear to be agreeing
to no change in the current position.
If you do not sell to the EU, you can happily check the box to say IF you do
you have to only sell items legal in the EU to the EU.
The newsletter also makes it clearer that the seller is certifying for goods
the seller is shipping to the EU. The seller is not certifying for goods the
seller shipped domestically for someone else to ship to the EU.
The Forum announcement could have been worded as per the Newsletter wording and
have avoided the outpouring of angst. Maybe. In this internet age of instant
offence maybe not.
Part of what may be causing much of the kerfuffle, has to do with provenance.
If I open a new sealed set, and part it out, I have a rather good picture of
the provenance of those parts.
If I buy a bag/box of used parts at a yard/boot sale, there could be anything
mixed in there. Provenance in that case is non-existent. For everyday common
parts, that may be less of an issue, for minifigs the issue could be elevated
(and mostly because minifigs are where the money is, and more likely to be counterfeit).
Selling a counterfeit minifig (USA to USA) is still wrong, but the penalties
that might come from that are limited to having your arm bent behind your back
and being told to issue a refund (by the payment services most likely). The DSA
appears to be ratcheting up the penalty.
I'm still forming up my view about this, and I'll probably have more
to say after Christmas rolls past.
Isn't this a classic case of poorly chosen language leading to mass hysteria
in the populace? In her Forum post Anastasia wrote:-
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
Dear members,
The DSA requires that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European Union or not.
Queue the population of the non-EU world ranting about abuse of freedoms and
arrogant EU legal overreach. The DSA does not require all global sellers to only
provide EU compliant products to buyers anywhere in the world.
The Bricklink Newsletter email states it as:-
In Newsletter, Bricklink writes:
By February 16, 2025 our sellers would have to certify that products that they are
shipping to the EU are in compliance with European Union law.
Now IANAL, however I think it is entirely feasible that it is already prohibited
to send illegal in the EU items to the EU. Just I'm fairly sure I am not
allowed to ship items that are illegal in the US, or Canada, or Australia etc
etc to those countries. To check a box certifying that should you ship products
to the EU those products will comply with EU law would appear to be agreeing
to no change in the current position.
If you do not sell to the EU, you can happily check the box to say IF you do
you have to only sell items legal in the EU to the EU.
The newsletter also makes it clearer that the seller is certifying for goods
the seller is shipping to the EU. The seller is not certifying for goods the
seller shipped domestically for someone else to ship to the EU.
The Forum announcement could have been worded as per the Newsletter wording and
have avoided the outpouring of angst. Maybe. In this internet age of instant
offence maybe not.
You totally miss the legal point.
If you ship to the EU is not the issue. Neither is the issue if you ship illegal
stuff around the world. The issue is that BL makes it compulsory for all to agree
to something which remotely does not affect them and which they don't understand
legally.
It is even highly the question if such "ticking a box" can be legally
upheld if someone does not understand what they agree to. I would not encourage
or instruct others "to just tick the box" as a someone with a LLB and
working in the profession for 43 years.
If you ship to the EU is not the issue. Neither is the issue if you ship illegal
stuff around the world. The issue is that BL makes it compulsory for all to agree
to something which remotely does not affect them and which they don't understand
legally.
It is even highly the question if such "ticking a box" can be legally
upheld if someone does not understand what they agree to. I would not encourage
or instruct others "to just tick the box" as a someone with a LLB and
working in the profession for 43 years.
I believe the legal point here is on bricklink. It is a requirement for BL to
operate in the EU that BL must ensure all sellers on their platform certify that
any goods the seller provides to the EU are in compliance. If a seller ships
products to the EU, then they have to certify that the goods comply and they
tick the box. If the seller doesn't ship products to the EU, then BL still
needs to ensure that the seller has certified that they are in compliance, even
though they are by default as they don't ship goods to the EU. That is, BL
getting you to tick a box is a requirement on them and not on the seller. If
a seller then ships goods to the EU that don't comply, BL as a marketplace
is covered as they did what was required of them, to get their members to certify
that anything the ship to the EU is in compliance with EU law. If a member breaks
EU law, it is down to the member and not the marketplace. That is how I read
it.
It might even be that if they wanted to they would be allowed to let sellers
have a second option that they could click that they don't ship to the EU
and therefore are in compliance as anyone not supplying goods and services is
complying by default. But for BL to comply with their obligations, they would
have to ensure that anyone ticking that box cannot select shipping methods or
store availability in any EU country. If a seller could certify they don't
ship to the EU but the software still allowed them to advertise to and ship to
the EU, I imagine BL would not have complied with the directive. Implementing
such a restriction would no doubt require significantly more changes in the software
than getting sellers to certify that they are in compliance.
If you ship to the EU is not the issue. Neither is the issue if you ship illegal
stuff around the world. The issue is that BL makes it compulsory for all to agree
to something which remotely does not affect them and which they don't understand
legally.
It is even highly the question if such "ticking a box" can be legally
upheld if someone does not understand what they agree to. I would not encourage
or instruct others "to just tick the box" as a someone with a LLB and
working in the profession for 43 years.
I'm not sure I do miss the legal point. I suggested that Anastasia's
forum announcement and the Bricklink newsletter did not say the same thing. I
repeat again, the Newsletter stated "our sellers would have to certify that
products that they ARE SHIPPING TO THE EU are in compliance with European law".
If the Newsletter is correct then whether you ship to the EU is very much the
issue. And IF you do ship to the EU then you should understand the recipient's
laws. Just as if I shipped goods to the US or Australia I can't just assume
its legal to do so because those goods are legal where I am.
People are getting angry at being asked to confirm they are following rules that
they are, or should be, already following. It could have been presented so much
better.
You may well be correct that a mass box ticking doesn't really comply with
the requirements. Have to hope Bricklink took proper legal advice on that. Maybe
they just posted on the Legallink Forum instead?
If you ship to the EU is not the issue. Neither is the issue if you ship illegal
stuff around the world. The issue is that BL makes it compulsory for all to agree
to something which remotely does not affect them and which they don't understand
legally.
It is even highly the question if such "ticking a box" can be legally
upheld if someone does not understand what they agree to. I would not encourage
or instruct others "to just tick the box" as a someone with a LLB and
working in the profession for 43 years.
I'm not sure I do miss the legal point. I suggested that Anastasia's
forum announcement and the Bricklink newsletter did not say the same thing. I
repeat again, the Newsletter stated "our sellers would have to certify that
products that they ARE SHIPPING TO THE EU are in compliance with European law".
If the Newsletter is correct then whether you ship to the EU is very much the
issue. And IF you do ship to the EU then you should understand the recipient's
laws. Just as if I shipped goods to the US or Australia I can't just assume
its legal to do so because those goods are legal where I am.
People are getting angry at being asked to confirm they are following rules that
they are, or should be, already following. It could have been presented so much
better.
You may well be correct that a mass box ticking doesn't really comply with
the requirements. Have to hope Bricklink took proper legal advice on that. Maybe
they just posted on the Legallink Forum instead?
The way I read it (and many others) is that everybody needs to tick the box and
follow the EU laws even if they don't sell/ship to the EU.
The way I read it (and many others) is that everybody needs to tick the box and
follow the EU laws even if they don't sell/ship to the EU.
And if they don't sell / ship to the EU then they are not shipping anything
non-compliant, and so they are following with EU laws whether they know about
it or not, or care or not. But importantly, BL has ensured that all sellers are
following the EU directive.
The way I read it (and many others) is that everybody needs to tick the box and
follow the EU laws even if they don't sell/ship to the EU.
And if they don't sell / ship to the EU then they are not shipping anything
non-compliant, and so they are following with EU laws whether they know about
it or not, or care or not. But importantly, BL has ensured that all sellers are
following the EU directive.
No: BL has to follow the EU directive, but to do so every seller has to certify
to BrickLink they won't sell crap.
The way I read it (and many others) is that everybody needs to tick the box and
follow the EU laws even if they don't sell/ship to the EU.
And if they don't sell / ship to the EU then they are not shipping anything
non-compliant, and so they are following with EU laws whether they know about
it or not, or care or not. But importantly, BL has ensured that all sellers are
following the EU directive.
No: BL has to follow the EU directive, but to do so every seller has to certify
to BrickLink they won't sell crap.
Yes, so they can tick the box. And BL can show that the site has a method in
place to make sure that all sellers on the site have certified that they follow
the EU regulations.
The way I read it (and many others) is that everybody needs to tick the box and
follow the EU laws even if they don't sell/ship to the EU.
I understand, that's how Anastasia's forum announcement read. However,
it is not what the Newsletter said and that is the difference I have been trying
to highlight.
I believe the announcement was a terribly worded attempt to explain the policy
that was open to misunderstanding dressed up in the fluff of safety, "protecting
the global community". When it would appear in reality the requirement is
to confirm that if you voluntary choose to sell in to a market (in this case
the EU) you do it in compliance with the laws of that market (EU law).
-- are sellers in the EU required to pay any extra fees or are there any
additional costs involved with being a seller who sells things under EU laws
& are you required to file EU tax returns outside of your own country's taxes? […]
No.
And EU isn’t a country and doesn’t levy taxes.
hey LegoLDK.. you live in the UK (EU).. so, you would be fluent with these questions:
-- are sellers in the EU required to pay any extra fees or are there any
additional costs involved with being a seller who sells things under EU laws
& are you required to file EU tax returns outside of your own country's taxes?
if so, does this mean everyone on BL Worldwide will now be required to have those
costs added to invoices/deducted from their Sales Revenues & we will all be required
to file EU tax returns?
The UK is no longer part of the EU, almost 5 years ago now.
Isn't this a classic case of poorly chosen language leading to mass hysteria
in the populace? In her Forum post Anastasia wrote:-
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
Dear members,
The DSA requires that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European Union or not.
Queue the population of the non-EU world ranting about abuse of freedoms and
arrogant EU legal overreach. The DSA does not require all global sellers to only
provide EU compliant products to buyers anywhere in the world.
The Bricklink Newsletter email states it as:-
In Newsletter, Bricklink writes:
By February 16, 2025 our sellers would have to certify that products that they are
shipping to the EU are in compliance with European Union law.
Now IANAL, however I think it is entirely feasible that it is already prohibited
to send illegal in the EU items to the EU. Just I'm fairly sure I am not
allowed to ship items that are illegal in the US, or Canada, or Australia etc
etc to those countries. To check a box certifying that should you ship products
to the EU those products will comply with EU law would appear to be agreeing
to no change in the current position.
If you do not sell to the EU, you can happily check the box to say IF you do
you have to only sell items legal in the EU to the EU.
The newsletter also makes it clearer that the seller is certifying for goods
the seller is shipping to the EU. The seller is not certifying for goods the
seller shipped domestically for someone else to ship to the EU.
The Forum announcement could have been worded as per the Newsletter wording and
have avoided the outpouring of angst. Maybe. In this internet age of instant
offence maybe not.
Thank you for the reply.
We do not anticipate that the DSA Checkbox requirement is going to be an obstacle
for any BrickLink seller. All sellers have already agreed to this provision (at
least in spirit) in the Terms of Service, which has remained unchanged since
the site was purchased in 2019:
Compliance with Laws: You as a Seller agree to comply with all applicable
laws, rules and regulations, including without limitation all laws regarding
ecommerce, distance selling, consumer protection, commercial electronic messages,
privacy, disclosures that must be made to Buyers in advance of a sale (including
without limitation the terms and conditions applicable to each sale), affording
Buyers the right to review, accept and reject such disclosures, and providing
to Buyers copies of the terms and conditions of sale.
Furthermore, as some of you have mentioned, all LEGO products are fully compliant
with EU law, so there is no problem there. "Illegal" items may include
stolen goods, goods purchased with an unauthorized payment method (e.g. stolen
credit card or hacked PayPal account) and counterfeit items.
However, being unknowingly involved in selling such things is a risk every seller
has accepted the burden of as long as they have been selling here. And this is
why we try hard to root out such problems as soon as they are reported.
Some sellers have considered closing their stores on BrickLink because of this
DAS Checkbox requirement, and in our estimation, this is an unfortunate overreaction.
Please wait until you see the exact text of what we want you to sign off on before
making a major decision about your account.
Isn't this a classic case of poorly chosen language leading to mass hysteria
in the populace? In her Forum post Anastasia wrote:-
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
Dear members,
The DSA requires that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European Union or not.
Queue the population of the non-EU world ranting about abuse of freedoms and
arrogant EU legal overreach. The DSA does not require all global sellers to only
provide EU compliant products to buyers anywhere in the world.
The Bricklink Newsletter email states it as:-
In Newsletter, Bricklink writes:
By February 16, 2025 our sellers would have to certify that products that they are
shipping to the EU are in compliance with European Union law.
Now IANAL, however I think it is entirely feasible that it is already prohibited
to send illegal in the EU items to the EU. Just I'm fairly sure I am not
allowed to ship items that are illegal in the US, or Canada, or Australia etc
etc to those countries. To check a box certifying that should you ship products
to the EU those products will comply with EU law would appear to be agreeing
to no change in the current position.
If you do not sell to the EU, you can happily check the box to say IF you do
you have to only sell items legal in the EU to the EU.
The newsletter also makes it clearer that the seller is certifying for goods
the seller is shipping to the EU. The seller is not certifying for goods the
seller shipped domestically for someone else to ship to the EU.
The Forum announcement could have been worded as per the Newsletter wording and
have avoided the outpouring of angst. Maybe. In this internet age of instant
offence maybe not.
Thank you for the reply.
We do not anticipate that the DSA Checkbox requirement is going to be an obstacle
for any BrickLink seller. All sellers have already agreed to this provision (at
least in spirit) in the Terms of Service, which has remained unchanged since
the site was purchased in 2019:
Compliance with Laws: You as a Seller agree to comply with all applicable
laws, rules and regulations, including without limitation all laws regarding
ecommerce, distance selling, consumer protection, commercial electronic messages,
privacy, disclosures that must be made to Buyers in advance of a sale (including
without limitation the terms and conditions applicable to each sale), affording
Buyers the right to review, accept and reject such disclosures, and providing
to Buyers copies of the terms and conditions of sale.
Furthermore, as some of you have mentioned, all LEGO products are fully compliant
with EU law, so there is no problem there. "Illegal" items may include
stolen goods, goods purchased with an unauthorized payment method (e.g. stolen
credit card or hacked PayPal account) and counterfeit items.
However, being unknowingly involved in selling such things is a risk every seller
has accepted the burden of as long as they have been selling here. And this is
why we try hard to root out such problems as soon as they are reported.
Some sellers have considered closing their stores on BrickLink because of this
DAS Checkbox requirement, and in our estimation, this is an unfortunate overreaction.
Please wait until you see the exact text of what we want you to sign off on before
making a major decision about your account.
Please explain how EU laws apply to a US seller who only sells to the US, considering
that LEGO BrickLink, Inc.is a Delaware corporation.
Clearly, many sellers have concerns, because the DSA covers much more than simply
commercial law, including issues of free speech.
The EU is using the DSA to sue Telegram, Twitter, Facebook, and Google over user
posted content that goes against whatever some unelected bureaucrats in Brussels
determine to be objectionable.
If Bricklink wants to do this right, they will add an option for US sellers that
only sell within the US to opt out of this.
We do not anticipate that the DSA Checkbox requirement is going to be an obstacle
for any BrickLink seller. All sellers have already agreed to this provision (at
least in spirit) in the Terms of Service, which has remained unchanged since
the site was purchased in 2019:
Compliance with Laws: You as a Seller agree to comply with all applicable
laws, rules and regulations, including without limitation all laws regarding
ecommerce, distance selling, consumer protection, commercial electronic messages,
privacy, disclosures that must be made to Buyers in advance of a sale (including
without limitation the terms and conditions applicable to each sale), affording
Buyers the right to review, accept and reject such disclosures, and providing
to Buyers copies of the terms and conditions of sale.
Furthermore, as some of you have mentioned, all LEGO products are fully compliant
with EU law, so there is no problem there. "Illegal" items may include
stolen goods, goods purchased with an unauthorized payment method (e.g. stolen
credit card or hacked PayPal account) and counterfeit items.
However, being unknowingly involved in selling such things is a risk every seller
has accepted the burden of as long as they have been selling here. And this is
why we try hard to root out such problems as soon as they are reported.
Some sellers have considered closing their stores on BrickLink because of this
DAS Checkbox requirement, and in our estimation, this is an unfortunate overreaction.
Please wait until you see the exact text of what we want you to sign off on before
making a major decision about your account.
Please explain how EU laws apply to a US seller who only sells to the US, considering
that LEGO BrickLink, Inc.is a Delaware corporation.
Clearly, many sellers have concerns, because the DSA covers much more than simply
commercial law, including issues of free speech.
The EU is using the DSA to sue Telegram, Twitter, Facebook, and Google over user
posted content that goes against whatever some unelected bureaucrats in Brussels
determine to be objectionable.
If Bricklink wants to do this right, they will add an option for US sellers that
only sell within the US to opt out of this.
The checkbox does not include the major part of DSA, which as you say, involves
moderation of user content. That is a separate thing.
[…]
The EU is using the DSA to sue Telegram, Twitter, Facebook, and Google over user
posted content
Death threaths, terrorism, harassment, doxing….
Political ideas, disagreement with the leaders political ideas, addressing untrue
political statements, and statements regarding the competence of leadership to
add a few more things they like to censor that you left out
You’ve been here for 20 years and you think it’s the DSA that would make BrickLink
forbid such things?
Political ideas, disagreement with the leaders political ideas, addressing untrue
political statements, and statements regarding the competence of leadership to
add a few more things they like to censor that you left out
Those elucubrations are not part of the reasons why EU is going after the aforementioned
platforms.
Political ideas, disagreement with the leaders political ideas, addressing untrue
political statements, and statements regarding the competence of leadership to
add a few more things they like to censor that you left out
Those elucubrations are not part of the reasons why EU is going after the aforementioned
platforms.
Clearly the lack of free media is already great enough to be effecting your thoughts
of what is going on
Political ideas, disagreement with the leaders political ideas, addressing untrue
political statements, and statements regarding the competence of leadership to
add a few more things they like to censor that you left out
Those elucubrations are not part of the reasons why EU is going after the aforementioned
platforms.
Clearly the lack of free media is already great enough to be effecting your thoughts
of what is going on
There is no "free media". Every single person is biased in their own
ways, and this shows up in everything they say or do. It is the essence of the
nurture part of nature versus nurture. So, these internal biases will show up
in things that are written or filmed, including all news. What one can do to
help against internal biases is get information from many different sources so
that the biases tend to balance themselves out. In other words, if you just consume
media that confirms all your own internal biases, you are just living in an echo
chamber and not trying to understand the wider range of human emotion and opinion.
Life is complex. Don't be afraid to get out of your comfort zone and question
things. For example, why would the EU seem to be more afraid of hate speech,
etc., than other places of the world?
Please explain how EU laws apply to a US seller who only sells to the US, considering
that LEGO BrickLink, Inc.is a Delaware corporation.
Clearly, many sellers have concerns, because the DSA covers much more than simply
commercial law, including issues of free speech.
The EU is using the DSA to sue Telegram, Twitter, Facebook, and Google over user
posted content that goes against whatever some unelected bureaucrats in Brussels
determine to be objectionable.
If Bricklink wants to do this right, they will add an option for US sellers that
only sell within the US to opt out of this.
It will be down to the wording. There are ways of phrasing it such that non-EU
sellers that only sell to non-EU countries won't need to opt out.
Now I've seen the text. It does not tell me specifically which items would
be contrary to this law. It doesn't tell me anything except to self certify
to something that I have not read, and do not understand. I would like to sign
this, but I don't have a lawyer.
As you said, I've already agreed to the terms of service, (which I do understand).
Can you please direct me to the specific articles in the EU law that explain
that Bricklink is required to ask each seller to self certify?
I must ask though, was it really necessary to have it come up EVERY TIME you
update a page or click on something?!
Once you accept it, it disappears!
It’s annoying if it doesn’t go away when you don’t accept it immediately
I can’t see anything in the settings (but then I accepted and my settings may
not be complete: I never really did go through the verification, *cough* priviledge
*cough*), so maybe they need to nag you because otherwise you can’t find it again….
I must ask though, was it really necessary to have it come up EVERY TIME you
update a page or click on something?!
Once you accept it, it disappears!
It’s annoying if it doesn’t go away when you don’t accept it immediately
I can’t see anything in the settings (but then I accepted and my settings may
not be complete: I never really did go through the verification, *cough* priviledge
*cough*), so maybe they need to nag you because otherwise you can’t find it again….
I looked and couldn’t find it in my store setting either 😅
I must ask though, was it really necessary to have it come up EVERY TIME you
update a page or click on something?!
Once you accept it, it disappears!
Yes, I first read and understood the 300 page document about laws in another
country. Then, I clicked the button. Huzzah!
~Jen
Gotta keep life exciting!
so exciting i did it twice! (it popped up again when i to to my PC )
You read it all twice? Dang! That's amazing.
~Jen
gotta get my speed reading practise in! I'm telling ya, the free time from
the Canada Post strike is really helping get things done!
Did you get the go pro sorted out?
a little, but I wouldn't be able to record as due to the strike there aren't
many good orders to record 😭. however, I did make progress in learning about
improving lots of the basics for the video quality and such.
The good news is, it seems likely that the strike is less then 2 weeks away from
being over. most experts say within the next 1-2 weeks the government will likely
step in
I must ask though, was it really necessary to have it come up EVERY TIME you
update a page or click on something?!
Once you accept it, it disappears!
Yes, I first read and understood the 300 page document about laws in another
country. Then, I clicked the button. Huzzah!
~Jen
Gotta keep life exciting!
so exciting i did it twice! (it popped up again when i to to my PC )
You read it all twice? Dang! That's amazing.
~Jen
gotta get my speed reading practise in! I'm telling ya, the free time from
the Canada Post strike is really helping get things done!
Did you get the go pro sorted out?
a little, but I wouldn't be able to record as due to the strike there aren't
many good orders to record 😭. however, I did make progress in learning about
improving lots of the basics for the video quality and such.
The good news is, it seems likely that the strike is less then 2 weeks away from
being over. most experts say within the next 1-2 weeks the government will likely
step in
Did you figure out why the video quality wasn’t up to what it said it was?
I must ask though, was it really necessary to have it come up EVERY TIME you
update a page or click on something?!
Once you accept it, it disappears!
Yes, I first read and understood the 300 page document about laws in another
country. Then, I clicked the button. Huzzah!
~Jen
Gotta keep life exciting!
so exciting i did it twice! (it popped up again when i to to my PC )
You read it all twice? Dang! That's amazing.
~Jen
gotta get my speed reading practise in! I'm telling ya, the free time from
the Canada Post strike is really helping get things done!
Did you get the go pro sorted out?
a little, but I wouldn't be able to record as due to the strike there aren't
many good orders to record 😭. however, I did make progress in learning about
improving lots of the basics for the video quality and such.
The good news is, it seems likely that the strike is less then 2 weeks away from
being over. most experts say within the next 1-2 weeks the government will likely
step in
Did you figure out why the video quality wasn’t up to what it said it was?
its a bit funny it turns out, I recorded in 4k, BUT I was downloading
the videos at 720p, then the export upscaled them to 1080p. and that's what
has happened to just about every single video I've ever uploaded 😭😭😭.
Im trying Filmora for editing as it uses proxy files as my PC can't handle
4k directly, however i first need more ram as have 32gb but 28gb is perma in
use for the 120ish tabs I have open for work 😅
I must ask though, was it really necessary to have it come up EVERY TIME you
update a page or click on something?!
Once you accept it, it disappears!
Yes, I first read and understood the 300 page document about laws in another
country. Then, I clicked the button. Huzzah!
~Jen
Gotta keep life exciting!
so exciting i did it twice! (it popped up again when i to to my PC )
You read it all twice? Dang! That's amazing.
~Jen
gotta get my speed reading practise in! I'm telling ya, the free time from
the Canada Post strike is really helping get things done!
Did you get the go pro sorted out?
a little, but I wouldn't be able to record as due to the strike there aren't
many good orders to record 😭. however, I did make progress in learning about
improving lots of the basics for the video quality and such.
The good news is, it seems likely that the strike is less then 2 weeks away from
being over. most experts say within the next 1-2 weeks the government will likely
step in
Did you figure out why the video quality wasn’t up to what it said it was?
its a bit funny it turns out, I recorded in 4k, BUT I was downloading
the videos at 720p, then the export upscaled them to 1080p. and that's what
has happened to just about every single video I've ever uploaded 😭😭😭.
That would explain it!
Im trying Filmora for editing as it uses proxy files as my PC can't handle
4k directly, however i first need more ram as have 32gb but 28gb is perma in
use for the 120ish tabs I have open for work 😅
Sounds like you need to invest in another processor and ram
Im trying Filmora for editing as it uses proxy files as my PC can't handle
4k directly, however i first need more ram as have 32gb but 28gb is perma in
use for the 120ish tabs I have open for work 😅
Sounds like you need to invest in another processor and ram
I see other possibilities:
— learning to use bookmarks,
— using and learning tab-management plugins/extensions,
— using and learning a less greedy browser,
— simply learning to “let go” of unneeded tabs.
Im trying Filmora for editing as it uses proxy files as my PC can't handle
4k directly, however i first need more ram as have 32gb but 28gb is perma in
use for the 120ish tabs I have open for work 😅
Sounds like you need to invest in another processor and ram
I see other possibilities:
— learning to use bookmarks,
I’ve got about 300 bookmarks 😅. Those are used for more “long term” things
— using and learning tab-management plugins/extensions,
— using and learning a less greedy browser,
To much work
— simply learning to “let go” of unneeded tabs.
That’s the best part! As soon as a tab is no longer needed, I happily purge it!
But, every tab open is open for a specific purpose, for example 1 is open so
I remember to order business cards, 1 to order a label printer, 1 where I manage
my eBay bid snipping, like 10 for my coding stuff, about 10-15 for music, kijiji,
facebook, and eBay listing take up lots, and the list goes on and on , but,
the moment a tabs job is done, it’s happily deleted! The other month I was finally
able to close some DKIM tabs I had opened for about 2 years until I finally had
time to deep dive into that and fix it in my code and such. Tbh it’s quite fun
having lots of tabs open
I must ask though, was it really necessary to have it come up EVERY TIME you
update a page or click on something?!
The silly checkbox page AND the official help page BOTH left off the most VITAL
piece of Information that Admin Russell has mentioned earlier in this thread:
"ALL LEGO PRODUCTS FULLY COMPLY WITH EU REGULATIONS"
A Huge oversight to omit this vital bit of information.
European Union Digital Services Act (DSA) self-certification is now available.
Check your email for more details or go to our updated FAQ page: https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
for more details.
Thank you for your cooperation,
The BrickLink Team
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
Dear members,
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
European Union Digital Services Act (DSA) self-certification is now available.
Check your email for more details or go to our updated FAQ page: https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
for more details.
Thank you for your cooperation,
The BrickLink Team
The checkbox page AND the official help page BOTH left off the most VITAL
piece of Information that Admin Russell has mentioned earlier in this thread:
"ALL LEGO PRODUCTS FULLY COMPLY WITH EU REGULATIONS"
A Huge oversight to omit this vital bit of information.
European Union Digital Services Act (DSA) self-certification is now available.
Check your email for more details or go to our updated FAQ page: https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
for more details.
Thank you for your cooperation,
The BrickLink Team
The checkbox page AND the official help page BOTH left off the most VITAL
piece of Information that Admin Russell has mentioned earlier in this thread:
"ALL LEGO PRODUCTS FULLY COMPLY WITH EU REGULATIONS"
I wonder how far back that statement is true. Also they release some items only
out of EU too.
A Huge oversight to omit this vital bit of information.
I hope everyone survived the great box checkening of '24.
If it really bothers you that much, you could always try crossing your fingers
behind your back before hitting submit.
just remember... every seller now has to Guarantee all Lego parts
sold will be fully functional for 2 years after the sale.....
should we guesstimate how many of you will stop selling Reddish-Brown's...?
That, I'm genuinely curious about. Do eBay and Paypal have to overhaul things
on the EU side?
Buyer protection for items not as described cases for ebay is what? 30 days,
and paypal is 180 days. BL purges orders after 180 days.
What avenue would someone have to say their lego broke 2 years later to actually
collect a refund?
Maybe they would be in legal right to get their money back, but would have to
hire their own lawyer at that point to serve a letter to the seller to try to
recoup funds which would not be worth it for most orders.
The optimist in me hopes that the 2-year thing end up being a non-issue for those
selling to the EU, but the uncertainty is concerning.
a thought... since this EU Law will apply to all sellers, this means it applies
to ALL SALES, regardless of where the buyer lives....
No, the EU law doesn’t apply to all sellers, it applies to those who sell in
EU.
And no, it doesn’t apply to all buyers either, only those who reside in EU.
Your way of thinking reminds me of this joke:
Three guys on a bench in the park. One leaves and says “ciao!”
A few minutes later, one says to the other: “Did he say ‘ciao’ or did he say
‘miaow’?”
A few minutes later: “Because, if he said ‘miaow,’ it’s about a cat.”
A few minutes later: “And the cat, it likes milk.”
A few minutes later: “And milk, it comes from a cow.”
A few minutes later: “And the cow, it has horns.”
A few minutes later: “And what has horns? A cuckold. Eh! He insulted me!”
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
We still haven't got any explanation why sellers that do not live in or sell
to the EU are now being forced to follow EU law with this new directive!
[…]
We still haven't got any explanation why sellers that do not live in or sell
to the EU are now being forced to follow EU law with this new directive!
Yes you did: “we are committed to keeping our community safe on a global scale.”
[…]
We still haven't got any explanation why sellers that do not live in or sell
to the EU are now being forced to follow EU law with this new directive!
Yes you did: “we are committed to keeping our community safe on a global scale.”
We still haven't got any explanation why sellers that do not live in or sell
to the EU are now being forced to follow EU law with this new directive!
I am only speculating, but there is NO WAY to guarantee that any product that
YOU sell on BL will not end up in the EU. For example, a buyer can easily switch
to a Canadian shipping address and after receiving the order at that Canadian
address, the order contents or the entire parcel (with your Canadian origination
info) will be later sent to the EU without your knowledge. Thus, it can look
like you sold and shipped something to the EU even if you did not actually do
so.
We still haven't got any explanation why sellers that do not live in or sell
to the EU are now being forced to follow EU law with this new directive!
I am only speculating, but there is NO WAY to guarantee that any product that
YOU sell on BL will not end up in the EU. For example, a buyer can easily switch
to a Canadian shipping address and after receiving the order at that Canadian
address, the order contents or the entire parcel (with your Canadian origination
info) will be later sent to the EU without your knowledge. Thus, it can look
like you sold and shipped something to the EU even if you did not actually do
so.
____
Whatever happens to the package after it is delivered to the Canadian address
provided to me is not my responsibility...
We still haven't got any explanation why sellers that do not live in or sell
to the EU are now being forced to follow EU law with this new directive!
I am only speculating, but there is NO WAY to guarantee that any product that
YOU sell on BL will not end up in the EU. For example, a buyer can easily switch
to a Canadian shipping address and after receiving the order at that Canadian
address, the order contents or the entire parcel (with your Canadian origination
info) will be later sent to the EU without your knowledge. Thus, it can look
like you sold and shipped something to the EU even if you did not actually do
so.
____
Whatever happens to the package after it is delivered to the Canadian address
provided to me is not my responsibility...
+1000, You can't control what others do, you did your job, if they make a
mess then they should clean it up
Whatever happens to the package after it is delivered to the Canadian address
provided to me is not my responsibility...
Tell that to the Judge.
After you have dealt with various gub'ment Enforcement Agents who may not
buy that argument and have threatened additional penalties for non-compliance.
Whatever happens to the package after it is delivered to the Canadian address
provided to me is not my responsibility...
Tell that to the Judge.
Tell what? "Oh Mr. judge I had total control over the buyers actions and
I could have stopped him from breaking the law, I could read his mind and tell
what he was going to do, even though I never met him before and he lives in another
city hundreds of mines away."
Whatever happens to the package after it is delivered to the Canadian address
provided to me is not my responsibility...
Tell that to the Judge.
After you have dealt with various gub'ment Enforcement Agents who may not
buy that argument and have threatened additional penalties for non-compliance.
LOL!
So you are telling me that if I sell a car to someone and he robs a bank with
it that I am somehow responsible...
Whatever happens to the package after it is delivered to the Canadian address
provided to me is not my responsibility...
Tell that to the Judge.
After you have dealt with various gub'ment Enforcement Agents who may not
buy that argument and have threatened additional penalties for non-compliance.
LOL!
So you are telling me that if I sell a car to someone and he robs a bank with
it that I am somehow responsible...
The only possable way you would be responsible is if you knew he was going to
rob the bank with it, but he would have to tell you first
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
We still haven't got any explanation why sellers that do not live in or sell
to the EU are now being forced to follow EU law with this new directive!
Because (and my own conjecture here), as of February 17th 2025, TLG & BL can
say "we are in 100% compliance". That they had to suspend some percentage
of sellers is irrelevant. Everyone capable of selling on that date, has to have
agreed.
While the suspension has been mentioned (ad nasium), what has not been explained
is what capabilities (other than receiving new orders) will those sellers still
have. Can they leave feedback ? Can they deal with buyers from prior to the suspension
to do partial refunds, etc ? Will they still have any capabilities whatsoever
? More interesting is, should they wish to call it quits, and do a bulk sale
of their inventory, obviously they cannot consummate the sale on BL (because
their store is suspended). Can they even talk about a bulk sale in the Forum
without getting slapped (for offering to sell off BL) ? I'm left with the
impression that the folks who think this draconian move is necessary, have not
considered that some percentage of sellers will not comply.
Because (and my own conjecture here), as of February 17th 2025, TLG & BL can
say "we are in 100% compliance". That they had to suspend some percentage
of sellers is irrelevant. Everyone capable of selling on that date, has to have
agreed.
While the suspension has been mentioned (ad nasium), what has not been explained
is what capabilities (other than receiving new orders) will those sellers still
have. Can they leave feedback ? Can they deal with buyers from prior to the suspension
to do partial refunds, etc ? Will they still have any capabilities whatsoever
? More interesting is, should they wish to call it quits, and do a bulk sale
of their inventory, obviously they cannot consummate the sale on BL (because
their store is suspended). Can they even talk about a bulk sale in the Forum
without getting slapped (for offering to sell off BL) ? I'm left with the
impression that the folks who think this draconian move is necessary, have not
considered that some percentage of sellers will not comply.
I'd be impressed if they are an active seller and can get through two months
of the nag ware box popping up every time a page loads.
I wonder how many people won't agree to it, but also didn't read all
the terms when they first signed up, or didn't read all the hanges in terms
when changes have been made since then.
However I am unable to do that. I cannot click on the self certification until
I have read, and understand the EU law, and how it pertains to me.
Please have someone explain, here on Bricklink what article of the EU law applies
to me, which one I am supposed to be in compliance with, and which types of enforcement
or penalties I may be subjecting myself to.
Seriously, I can't sign a document without knowing the details, and I don't
have a lawyer to explain it.
However I am unable to do that. I cannot click on the self certification until
I have read, and understand the EU law, and how it pertains to me.
Please have someone explain, here on Bricklink what article of the EU law applies
to me, which one I am supposed to be in compliance with, and which types of enforcement
or penalties I may be subjecting myself to.
Seriously, I can't sign a document without knowing the details, and I don't
have a lawyer to explain it.
If you don't ship to the EU and don't intend to, then you comply with
the regulation so you can tick it.
For bricklink to operate in the EU, they must comply by having all sellers on
their platform agree to comply with the EU law.
What will BL do if you don't? I imagine retaining the EU market is more important
to BL than retaining sellers that refuse to tick the box. So my guess is that
they will suspend selling activities and hen revert those accounts to buyer only,
so the site still complies.
However I am unable to do that. I cannot click on the self certification until
I have read, and understand the EU law, and how it pertains to me.
Please have someone explain, here on Bricklink what article of the EU law applies
to me, which one I am supposed to be in compliance with, and which types of enforcement
or penalties I may be subjecting myself to.
Seriously, I can't sign a document without knowing the details, and I don't
have a lawyer to explain it.
If you don't ship to the EU and don't intend to, then you comply with
the regulation so you can tick it.
For bricklink to operate in the EU, they must comply by having all sellers on
their platform agree to comply with the EU law.
What will BL do if you don't? I imagine retaining the EU market is more important
to BL than retaining sellers that refuse to tick the box. So my guess is that
they will suspend selling activities and hen revert those accounts to buyer only,
so the site still complies.
Thank you for the advice. However the box I have to click does not require me
to attest that I don't ship to the EU, it requires me to attest I will comply
with the law. I perfectly understand that Bricklink must comply with the law,
and I would like to help them out with that, but I can't sign a form claiming
to comply with a law of which I don't know the details. Someone just quote
me the relevant article and I'll be content.
Thank you for the advice. However the box I have to click does not require me
to attest that I don't ship to the EU, it requires me to attest I will comply
with the law. I perfectly understand that Bricklink must comply with the law,
and I would like to help them out with that, but I can't sign a form claiming
to comply with a law of which I don't know the details. Someone just quote
me the relevant article and I'll be content.
Bricklink is asking me to click on a button attesting that I am only offering
products that are in compliance with EU law.
What I need to know is what products are, or are not, in compliance with EU law.
In which article of the law is that contained.
I think it would be appropriate for Bricklink to offer sellers much more information
about the details of the law, since Bricklink wants me to say I am in compliance
with it.
Thank you for the advice. However the box I have to click does not require me
to attest that I don't ship to the EU, it requires me to attest I will comply
with the law. I perfectly understand that Bricklink must comply with the law,
and I would like to help them out with that, but I can't sign a form claiming
to comply with a law of which I don't know the details. Someone just quote
me the relevant article and I'll be content.
(reposted for Calebfishn)
European Union Consumer Guarantees:
When you sell a good or a service to a consumer online or via other means of
distance communication (by telephone, mail order) or outside a shop (from a door-to-door
salesperson), the consumer has the right to return the item or cancel the service
within 14 days. This is sometimes referred to as the cooling-off period or the
withdrawal period. No reason or justification has to be given by the consumer.
EU law also stipulates that you must give the consumer a minimum 2-year guarantee
(legal guarantee) as a protection against faulty goods, or goods that don't
look or work as advertised. In some countries national law may require you to
provide longer guarantees.
After-sale responsibilities/faulty products
If the product you sold turns out to be faulty — or doesn't look or work
as advertised — within the timeframe of the legal guarantee, you are responsible
for this. In some countries this can also be the case if you are the manufacturer
or importer.
When can your customer claim redress?
Be aware that you are legally bound by any public statements you make about
your products, especially through advertisements or on labels.
If you are a retailer, your customers can ask for redress under the legal guarantee
provided by EU law - if an item:
doesn't match the product description
has different qualities from the model advertised or shown to the client
is not fit for purpose - either its standard purpose or a specific purpose ordered
by the customer which you accepted
doesn't show the quality and performance normal in products of the same type
wasn't installed correctly - either by you, or by the customer, due to shortcomings
in the instructions
If you inform your customer that the product you are going to sell has quality
problems, they cannot then claim redress from you about this particular defect.
What can your customer claim?
Your customers have the right to ask you to do any of the following without any
charge (for postage, labour, material, etc.):
repair the product
replace the product
reduce the price
cancel the contract and reimburse them in full (in some countries, the sales
contract cannot be cancelled if the fault is minor, e.g. scratch on a CD case)
Yon know what is missing from that ? There is no safe harbor for sellers, where
it says I do not, and will not, knowingly sell to anyone covered by that statute.
If a buyer circumvents every possible road-block to prevent the sale from being
sent to the EU, the law still applies. By agreeing to that statute, I am allowing
any EU buyer to apply all of those remedies, even if they used a freight forwarder,
and even if they used a US payment form to circumvent the cross-border block
I have set up at PayPal.
If I wanted to sell to the EU, then I would have to accept all of those rules
and remedies. What with the age of much of my inventory, I cannot in all good
conscience do that.
There is a safe harbor in the verbage concerning "quality problems".
I would suggest that all sellers pay very close attention to that (and cease
using terms like 'mint' or 'like new' ). Sending photos doesn't
solve this either, unless you choose to send 360º VR images taken on 3-axis of
rotation. I will also note that buyers don't read ... buyers don't
read, and if I could crank it up even larger, I would. Buyers want to go
click, click, click, complete the order as quickly as possible, get their dopamine
hit, expect the package tomorrow (day beyond at the latest), but they don't
take the time to read. And I can prove that.
Part of why we are at this crossroads is because BrickLink is now more properly
known as LEGO BrickLink. When LEGO purchased BL, it was the first time in BrickLink's
history, that it was owned by a European entity. I'm being very careful in
my wording, because even towards the end of Dan's ownership, I do not believe
the legal venue for BL was in the EU. Dan might have been in the Czech Republic,
but I believe the venue continued to remain in the USA. For a long time I thought
Brexit was dumb and stupid, but now I have to wonder (but that's a whole
different kettle of herring). BrickLink cannot avoid this because The LEGO Group
cannot avoid this.
One other much greater concern I have is that making this certification is a
one-way street. You cannot change your mind after you check the box. There is
no going backwards. Your in until at least 2-years after you make your last sale
to any address anywhere (because you never really know where that package might
end up at). There is also a concern about APO/FPO addresses which may represent
USA forces stationed in the EU. Do those addresses get covered by the EU ? I've
never seen anything discussing that.
To say this change makes me feel uncomfortable is an understatement. My best
guess is that I will be dismissing many interstitial notices for the next 72
days.
Last remark, I've been here a few years. Most of us old timers remember when
BL started out life as BB. I've seen what happens when Goliath shows up with
a team of lawyers to pick on David.
[…]
I do not believe the legal venue for BL was in the EU.
It still isn’t. IIRC, BL’s incorporated in Delaware now.
[…]
BrickLink cannot avoid this because The LEGO Group cannot avoid this.
No. BL cannot avoid this because BL serves EU consumers.
You (general/BL) want to do business with the EU? You (general/BL) adhere to
EU laws.
That has nothing to do with where you’re incorporated.
The DSA and the checkbox don’t say you have to obey every law in the EU, they
say you have to obey EU import rules when you export to EU.
Nothing really changed but enforcement: BL would be responsible when something
goes wrong and the seller doesn’t want to be responsible. So BL makes all sellers
agree they are responsible if something go wrong.
When a big seller imports toys in EU, the toys have to be conform (“CE” mark,
with rules like toys shouldn’t contain dangerous products, toys shouldn’t fall
apart and be swallowable, etc.).
With marketplaces, allegedly small sellers can sell to the EU without any care
for the rules, they pass under the radar.
That’s what the DSA is about: making the marketplace responsible and making sure
it cooperates with the justice when necessary.
As nobody seems to want to read the official sources provided by BL (https://commission.europa.eu/strategy-and-policy/priorities-2019-2024/europe-fit-digital-age/digital-services-act/europe-fit-digital-age-new-online-rules-platforms_en
), here’s what BL has to do now:
— Transparency reporting
— Requirements on terms of service due account of fundamental rights
— Cooperation with national authorities following orders
— Points of contact and, where necessary, legal representative
— Notice and action and obligation to provide information to users
— Reporting criminal offences
— Complaint and redress mechanism and out of court dispute settlement
— Trusted flaggers
— Measures against abusive notices and counter-notices
— Special obligations for marketplaces, e.g. vetting credentials of third party
suppliers ("KYBC", compliance by design, random checks
— Bans on targeted adverts to children and those based on special characteristics
of users
— Transparency of recommender systems
— User-facing transparency of online advertising
However, I am asked by Bricklink to click to attest that I am only offering products
that are in compliance with the law. I can't find information about which
products are or are not in compliance with EU law.
That is what I need to know in order to be able to truthfully make the required
attestation.
Thank you for the advice. However the box I have to click does not require me
to attest that I don't ship to the EU, it requires me to attest I will comply
with the law. I perfectly understand that Bricklink must comply with the law,
and I would like to help them out with that, but I can't sign a form claiming
to comply with a law of which I don't know the details. Someone just quote
me the relevant article and I'll be content.
Nobody has to do that and they can continue to use the service.
Whereas you will have to choose. Accept it or stop using BL as a seller.
Thank you for the advice. However the box I have to click does not require me
to attest that I don't ship to the EU, it requires me to attest I will comply
with the law. I perfectly understand that Bricklink must comply with the law,
and I would like to help them out with that, but I can't sign a form claiming
to comply with a law of which I don't know the details. Someone just quote
me the relevant article and I'll be content.
Nobody has to do that and they can continue to use the service.
Whereas you will have to choose. Accept it or stop using BL as a seller.
I absolutely would like to click the box and remain a Bricklink seller.
However, Bricklink is asking me to make a promise, without giving me adequate
information about what is included in that promise. I obviously, cannot in honesty
and integrity click "yes" on that check box without knowing what is included.
You can not sign something that you do not know or understand what you are signing.......
That in law invalidates the whole process and would not stand up in any court.
The pop-up box every click of the page is a violation of our right to use the
site when we are paying fees to do so. It doesn't apply until Feb 2025,
yet if we don't check the box, not knowing why we do it, we will get the
pop-up ever new page, for me maybe 50-100 times a day. I tick the box - message
goes away. Bricklink - REMOVE this automatic pop-up box until at least February
and allow every user some peace before the Fire from the EU Reigns dowm apon
us!.....
In Administrative, yorbrick writes:
In Administrative, calebfishn writes:
Ok. I got the pop up to self certify.
However I am unable to do that. I cannot click on the self certification until
I have read, and understand the EU law, and how it pertains to me.
Please have someone explain, here on Bricklink what article of the EU law applies
to me, which one I am supposed to be in compliance with, and which types of enforcement
or penalties I may be subjecting myself to.
Seriously, I can't sign a document without knowing the details, and I don't
have a lawyer to explain it.
If you don't ship to the EU and don't intend to, then you comply with
the regulation so you can tick it.
For bricklink to operate in the EU, they must comply by having all sellers on
their platform agree to comply with the EU law.
What will BL do if you don't? I imagine retaining the EU market is more important
to BL than retaining sellers that refuse to tick the box. So my guess is that
they will suspend selling activities and hen revert those accounts to buyer only,
so the site still complies.
You can not sign something that you do not know or understand what you are signing.......
That in law invalidates the whole process and would not stand up in any court.
The pop-up box every click of the page is a violation of our right to use the
site when we are paying fees to do so. It doesn't apply until Feb 2025,
yet if we don't check the box, not knowing why we do it, we will get the
pop-up ever new page, for me maybe 50-100 times a day. I tick the box - message
goes away. Bricklink - REMOVE this automatic pop-up box until at least February
and allow every user some peace before the Fire from the EU Reigns dowm apon
us!.....
my thoughts exactly, I want to be free from the craziness over there
for as long as possible
In Administrative, yorbrick writes:
In Administrative, calebfishn writes:
Ok. I got the pop up to self certify.
However I am unable to do that. I cannot click on the self certification until
I have read, and understand the EU law, and how it pertains to me.
Please have someone explain, here on Bricklink what article of the EU law applies
to me, which one I am supposed to be in compliance with, and which types of enforcement
or penalties I may be subjecting myself to.
Seriously, I can't sign a document without knowing the details, and I don't
have a lawyer to explain it.
If you don't ship to the EU and don't intend to, then you comply with
the regulation so you can tick it.
For bricklink to operate in the EU, they must comply by having all sellers on
their platform agree to comply with the EU law.
What will BL do if you don't? I imagine retaining the EU market is more important
to BL than retaining sellers that refuse to tick the box. So my guess is that
they will suspend selling activities and hen revert those accounts to buyer only,
so the site still complies.
You can not sign something that you do not know or understand what you are signing.......
So read about it and then decide if you want to remain a seller at BL or not.
If you don't agree with it and want to retain your right to not comply with
EU laws, then don't agree to it.
You can not sign something that you do not know or understand what you are signing.......
So read about it and then decide if you want to remain a seller at BL or not.
If you don't agree with it and want to retain your right to not comply with
EU laws, then don't agree to it.
I am happy to read about it. But I am not a lawyer. And the law is very, very,
long with over 70 articles, some of which may be applicable and some which may
not be applicable.
I'm simply asking for Bricklink to tell us which article in the law gives
me the information I need to know to promise that I will not offer products that
do not comply with the law. Then, I will be able to read it.
[…]
I am happy to read about it. But I am not a lawyer. And the law is very, very,
long with over 70 articles, some of which may be applicable and some which may
not be applicable.
I'm simply asking for Bricklink to tell us which article in the law gives
me the information I need to know to promise that I will not offer products that
do not comply with the law. Then, I will be able to read it.
First, you’re looking at the wrong place:
— The DSA regulation does not apply to sellers on BL, it applies to BL as a platform
(also) operating in EU and more particularly as a marketplace with sellers selling
to people in EU.
— The DSA does not list or explain what products are or are not complying. Those
rules are way longer than 70 articles.
— The DSA doesn’t change the EU rules of import/export. It makes platforms responsible
for what they propose to, and ask from people in EU.
Then, as already mentioned several times, by agreeing to BrickLink’s ToS, you
already agreed to follow local and international laws.
So you already needed to comply with EU laws when you shipped to EU.
The checkbox is a just more specific (and more maybe binding?) acknowledgement
of that.
(The ToS also stipulates rules of conduct on this site that already made you
limit and check your expression on this site, in a stronger manner than what
EU laws may impose. This a family-friendly website.)
As for what products comply with EU rules, as Russell said, all LEGO products
do.
The proof is that they have the CE marking, so they comply with the EU health,
safety, and environmental protection standards. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CE_marking
You can not sign something that you do not know or understand what you are signing.......
So read about it and then decide if you want to remain a seller at BL or not.
If you don't agree with it and want to retain your right to not comply with
EU laws, then don't agree to it.
I am happy to read about it. But I am not a lawyer. And the law is very, very,
long with over 70 articles, some of which may be applicable and some which may
not be applicable.
I'm simply asking for Bricklink to tell us which article in the law gives
me the information I need to know to promise that I will not offer products that
do not comply with the law. Then, I will be able to read it.
In order to remain compliant with the EU Digital Services Act (DSA), BrickLink
is introducing a self-certification procedure for all current and future sellers.
What does the self-certification look like?
On December 5th, all BrickLink sellers will be presented with the following popup
when they log in:
Existing sellers must self-certify that their products and services are compliant
with the European Union law by February 16th, 2025. Sellers who do not complete
the self-certification by the deadline will have their seller privileges revoked
on February 17th, 2025.
If sellers choose to self-certify after February 16th, they will need to go to
their Orders Received page to view the popup and check the self-certification
box.
New stores will automatically become compliant as soon as they check the applicable
checkbox during the New Seller Verification process.
What is EU Digital Services Act?
The European Union (EU) Digital Services Act (DSA) aims to create a transparent
environment for online platforms and their users via guidelines for protection
from harmful content and actions. Our team views this as an important milestone
towards keeping our community safe on a global scale.
For more information, visit our DSA help page that we will be continuously updated
as we move along with more DSA-related releases.
In order to remain compliant with the EU Digital Services Act (DSA), BrickLink
is introducing a self-certification procedure for all current and future sellers.
What does the self-certification look like?
On December 5th, all BrickLink sellers will be presented with the following popup
when they log in:
Existing sellers must self-certify that their products and services are compliant
with the European Union law by February 16th, 2025. Sellers who do not complete
the self-certification by the deadline will have their seller privileges revoked
on February 17th, 2025.
If sellers choose to self-certify after February 16th, they will need to go to
their Orders Received page to view the popup and check the self-certification
box.
New stores will automatically become compliant as soon as they check the applicable
checkbox during the New Seller Verification process.
What is EU Digital Services Act?
The European Union (EU) Digital Services Act (DSA) aims to create a transparent
environment for online platforms and their users via guidelines for protection
from harmful content and actions. Our team views this as an important milestone
towards keeping our community safe on a global scale.
For more information, visit our DSA help page that we will be continuously updated
as we move along with more DSA-related releases.
We appreciate your cooperation,
The BrickLink Team"
That mail still doesn't explain what part of the DSA applies to sellers not
selling to the EU
Was that the eye sore message from this afternoon that would harass you till
you gave in?
I was planning on clicking the box as soon as it was available, but the intrusive
way it was shoved in my face made me resent it and not want to click the box,
but I soon was so fed up I clicked it out of sheer madness and impulsive anger.
My short horror story of my experience with the DSA. Thank you for listening
In Administrative, Nubs_Select writes:
For those who may not have gotten the email, bricklink just sent this
In order to remain compliant with the EU Digital Services Act (DSA), BrickLink
is introducing a self-certification procedure for all current and future sellers.
What does the self-certification look like?
On December 5th, all BrickLink sellers will be presented with the following popup
when they log in:
Existing sellers must self-certify that their products and services are compliant
with the European Union law by February 16th, 2025. Sellers who do not complete
the self-certification by the deadline will have their seller privileges revoked
on February 17th, 2025.
If sellers choose to self-certify after February 16th, they will need to go to
their Orders Received page to view the popup and check the self-certification
box.
New stores will automatically become compliant as soon as they check the applicable
checkbox during the New Seller Verification process.
What is EU Digital Services Act?
The European Union (EU) Digital Services Act (DSA) aims to create a transparent
environment for online platforms and their users via guidelines for protection
from harmful content and actions. Our team views this as an important milestone
towards keeping our community safe on a global scale.
For more information, visit our DSA help page that we will be continuously updated
as we move along with more DSA-related releases.
Is there a way to check that we completed the self certification? I'm assuming
I did because I can still sell but just wanted to make sure because I haven't
been on the site much in the last month.
In Administrative, CE_Anastasia writes:
Dear members,
Because LEGO BrickLink is required to comply with the EU Digital Services Act
(DSA), we are introducing seller account self-certification. The DSA requires
that all sellers must certify that they are providing products and services that
are in compliance with European Union law by February 16, 2025. This requirement
applies to all BrickLink sellers, regardless of whether they ship to the European
Union or not.
We will be sharing more details shortly. Keep an eye out for updates through
the BrickLink Team emails, the BrickLink Forum, or our DSA Help page:https://www.bricklink.com/help.asp?helpID=2655
The EU Digital Services Act regulates, among other things, online marketplaces
such as BrickLink. Its goal is to provide a transparent and safe online environment
by establishing a unified set of rules and regulations for illegal online content.
We appreciate your understanding.
The BrickLink Team
USA, California
Canada, Ontario
France, Nouvelle-Aquitaine
Netherlands, Drenthe
Spain, Comunidad Valenciana
United Kingdom, England
Australia, Queensland
