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| | | Author: | SezaR  | | Posted: | Jan 20, 2018 02:16 | | Subject: | Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 36 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests (Entry) | | Status: | Open | |
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| Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Add 1 Part bb12va Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern Type I with 2 round contact holes (match ID 2)
* Add 1 Part bb12vb Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern Type II with 3 round contact holes (Alternate) (match ID 1)
* Delete 1 Part bb12v Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern
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| | | | | Author: | SezaR | | Posted: | Jan 20, 2018 02:28 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 73 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| I think we can easily correct the inventory for 12v modern train motors bb12v.
Sorry, but it is going to be long.
General comments:
- There are four types of black 12v train motors, but only three types for red
one. The last type (type 4) came only in black.
- On bricklink, only three types are recognized. There is no reference to the
pin located on the top of train. The types one and two came with integrated pin
whereas the types three and four with separated pin. This is because Lego realized
that the pin could break easily, so since 1982 the type three came with separated
pin. If you open the motor, you can take off the pin and replace it with a new
one.
On bricklink, there is a distinction between 3 round contact holes and 3 slotted
contact holes although there is no difference in their functionality. It would
be helpful to also distinguish types three and four.
The match between various types of 12v train motors and the "item No." on bricklink:
Type 1: bb12Va
Type 2: bb12Vb
Type 3: bb12Vb
Type 4: bb12Vc
If my request to add type 3 can be accepted, then we can rename the items as
bb12Va, bb12Vb, bb12Vc and bb12Vd.
- there is a number craved underneath of motor indicating the date the motor
was produced. For example 24 2 means the 24th week in 1982 and 38 0 mean the
38th week in 1980.
Based on this and the motors I have, the earliest and latest motor of each type
are:
Black type 1: 19 0
Black type 2: 8 1 - 24 2
Black type 3: 27 2 - 34 9
Black type 4: 45 9 - (until 1983)
Red type 1: 17 0 , 38 0
Red type 2: 22 1 - 39 2
Red type 3: 37 3 - 17 4
For example, see:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/161250705@N05/25073945478/in/dateposted-public/
Based on this:
Type one (red and black) motor was produced "probably only" in 1980. (I own a
black motor of type 2 from 8th week in 1981)
Type two black motor was produced since 1981 until mid 1982. (the latest one
I have is made on 24th week in 1982 whereas I have one type 3 made on 27th week
in 1982)
Type two red motor was produced "probably" since 1981 until "probably" end of
1982. (the latest I have is made in 49th week in 1982)
Type three black motor was produced since mid 1982 until "probably" 1993 (with
the set 7865). (need more investigation for the latest date but we don't
really need to know it)
Type three red motor was produced since 1983 until end of 1984. (no train coming
with red motor was released after 1984)
Type four black motor was produced "probably" since late 1989 until 1993.
Then we get three comments:
1) there is an inconsistency between dates of type 2 motors for black and red.
Latest black motor type 2 came in 24th week in 1982 (worst case on 26th week
but not after), but the latest red motor came in 49th week in 1982 (or later).
2) train 7727 from 1983 came first with motors made in late 1982, as there is
one made on 49th week in 1982. This is because Lego had some red motors of type
2 in his stock and used them for motors that came in market in 1983.
Now we can look at years each train or supplemental set was released (I checked
this by going through cataloges 1980-1993):
7730, 7750, 7760: 1980-1982
7740: 1980- 1984
7725: 1981- 1984
7727, 7755: 1983- 1984
7735, 7745: 1985-1990
7865: 1980-1993
5086: 1993
Based on this, we know:
7730: type 1 and type 2 (type 2 also seen and owned by many people)
7750: type 1 already changeed on bricklink (what about type 2?)
7760: types 1, 2 (type 3?)
7740: types 1, 2 and 3
7725: types 1, 2 and 3
7727: types 2 and 3 (type two need a proof but some sellers on bricklink can
confirm this)
7755: type 3 (what about 2?)
7735: type 3 (and 4?)
7745: type 3 (and 4?)
7865: type 1, 2 and 3 (and 4?)
5086: type 4 as is on brcklink
The main black hole is the type 4 coming with service pack 5086 from 1993. But
I own one from 1989. Either the service pack was released since 1989 or 1990
but not 1993, or the type 4 came also with other set or sets (7735?, 7745?,
7865?) This needs more investigation.
*********
I took bunch of photos. Maybe not of best quality, but one need to upload a photo
for comparison of these motors on bricklink. A photo of red motor bb12vb is also
missing.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/161250705@N05/albums/72157691675769324
In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Add 1 Part bb12va Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern Type I with 2 round contact holes (match ID 2)
* Add 1 Part bb12vb Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern Type II with 3 round contact holes (Alternate) (match ID 1)
* Delete 1 Part bb12v Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern
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| | | | | | | Author: | elias3 | | Posted: | Jan 20, 2018 03:54 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 25 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
| | I think we can easily correct the inventory for 12v modern train motors bb12v.
Sorry, but it is going to be long.
General comments:
- There are four types of black 12v train motors, but only three types for red
one. The last type (type 4) came only in black.
- On bricklink, only three types are recognized. There is no reference to the
pin located on the top of train. The types one and two came with integrated pin
whereas the types three and four with separated pin. This is because Lego realized
that the pin could break easily, so since 1982 the type three came with separated
pin. If you open the motor, you can take off the pin and replace it with a new
one.
On bricklink, there is a distinction between 3 round contact holes and 3 slotted
contact holes although there is no difference in their functionality. It would
be helpful to also distinguish types three and four.
The match between various types of 12v train motors and the "item No." on bricklink:
Type 1: bb12Va
Type 2: bb12Vb
Type 3: bb12Vb
Type 4: bb12Vc
If my request to add type 3 can be accepted, then we can rename the items as
bb12Va, bb12Vb, bb12Vc and bb12Vd.
- there is a number craved underneath of motor indicating the date the motor
was produced. For example 24 2 means the 24th week in 1982 and 38 0 mean the
38th week in 1980.
Based on this and the motors I have, the earliest and latest motor of each type
are:
Black type 1: 19 0
Black type 2: 8 1 - 24 2
Black type 3: 27 2 - 34 9
Black type 4: 45 9 - (until 1983)
Red type 1: 17 0 , 38 0
Red type 2: 22 1 - 39 2
Red type 3: 37 3 - 17 4
For example, see:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/161250705@N05/25073945478/in/dateposted-public/
Based on this:
Type one (red and black) motor was produced "probably only" in 1980. (I own a
black motor of type 2 from 8th week in 1981)
Type two black motor was produced since 1981 until mid 1982. (the latest one
I have is made on 24th week in 1982 whereas I have one type 3 made on 27th week
in 1982)
Type two red motor was produced "probably" since 1981 until "probably" end of
1982. (the latest I have is made in 49th week in 1982)
Type three black motor was produced since mid 1982 until "probably" 1993 (with
the set 7865). (need more investigation for the latest date but we don't
really need to know it)
Type three red motor was produced since 1983 until end of 1984. (no train coming
with red motor was released after 1984)
Type four black motor was produced "probably" since late 1989 until 1993.
Then we get three comments:
1) there is an inconsistency between dates of type 2 motors for black and red.
Latest black motor type 2 came in 24th week in 1982 (worst case on 26th week
but not after), but the latest red motor came in 49th week in 1982 (or later).
2) train 7727 from 1983 came first with motors made in late 1982, as there is
one made on 49th week in 1982. This is because Lego had some red motors of type
2 in his stock and used them for motors that came in market in 1983.
Now we can look at years each train or supplemental set was released (I checked
this by going through cataloges 1980-1993):
7730, 7750, 7760: 1980-1982
7740: 1980- 1984
7725: 1981- 1984
7727, 7755: 1983- 1984
7735, 7745: 1985-1990
7865: 1980-1993
5086: 1993
Based on this, we know:
7730: type 1 and type 2 (type 2 also seen and owned by many people)
7750: type 1 already changeed on bricklink (what about type 2?)
7760: types 1, 2 (type 3?)
7740: types 1, 2 and 3
7725: types 1, 2 and 3
7727: types 2 and 3 (type two need a proof but some sellers on bricklink can
confirm this)
7755: type 3 (what about 2?)
7735: type 3 (and 4?)
7745: type 3 (and 4?)
7865: type 1, 2 and 3 (and 4?)
5086: type 4 as is on brcklink
The main black hole is the type 4 coming with service pack 5086 from 1993. But
I own one from 1989. Either the service pack was released since 1989 or 1990
but not 1993, or the type 4 came also with other set or sets (7735?, 7745?,
7865?) This needs more investigation.
*********
I took bunch of photos. Maybe not of best quality, but one need to upload a photo
for comparison of these motors on bricklink. A photo of red motor bb12vb is also
missing.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/161250705@N05/albums/72157691675769324
In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Add 1 Part bb12va Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern Type I with 2 round contact holes (match ID 2)
* Add 1 Part bb12vb Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern Type II with 3 round contact holes (Alternate) (match ID 1)
* Delete 1 Part bb12v Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern
|
|
I confirm
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| | | | | | | Author: | SezaR | | Posted: | Jan 20, 2018 04:16 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 22 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| Correction:
be helpful to also distinguish types three and four.
I meant "It would be helpful to also distinguish types 2 and 3".
In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
| | I think we can easily correct the inventory for 12v modern train motors bb12v.
Sorry, but it is going to be long.
General comments:
- There are four types of black 12v train motors, but only three types for red
one. The last type (type 4) came only in black.
- On bricklink, only three types are recognized. There is no reference to the
pin located on the top of train. The types one and two came with integrated pin
whereas the types three and four with separated pin. This is because Lego realized
that the pin could break easily, so since 1982 the type three came with separated
pin. If you open the motor, you can take off the pin and replace it with a new
one.
On bricklink, there is a distinction between 3 round contact holes and 3 slotted
contact holes although there is no difference in their functionality. It would
be helpful to also distinguish types three and four.
The match between various types of 12v train motors and the "item No." on bricklink:
Type 1: bb12Va
Type 2: bb12Vb
Type 3: bb12Vb
Type 4: bb12Vc
If my request to add type 3 can be accepted, then we can rename the items as
bb12Va, bb12Vb, bb12Vc and bb12Vd.
- there is a number craved underneath of motor indicating the date the motor
was produced. For example 24 2 means the 24th week in 1982 and 38 0 mean the
38th week in 1980.
Based on this and the motors I have, the earliest and latest motor of each type
are:
Black type 1: 19 0
Black type 2: 8 1 - 24 2
Black type 3: 27 2 - 34 9
Black type 4: 45 9 - (until 1983)
Red type 1: 17 0 , 38 0
Red type 2: 22 1 - 39 2
Red type 3: 37 3 - 17 4
For example, see:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/161250705@N05/25073945478/in/dateposted-public/
Based on this:
Type one (red and black) motor was produced "probably only" in 1980. (I own a
black motor of type 2 from 8th week in 1981)
Type two black motor was produced since 1981 until mid 1982. (the latest one
I have is made on 24th week in 1982 whereas I have one type 3 made on 27th week
in 1982)
Type two red motor was produced "probably" since 1981 until "probably" end of
1982. (the latest I have is made in 49th week in 1982)
Type three black motor was produced since mid 1982 until "probably" 1993 (with
the set 7865). (need more investigation for the latest date but we don't
really need to know it)
Type three red motor was produced since 1983 until end of 1984. (no train coming
with red motor was released after 1984)
Type four black motor was produced "probably" since late 1989 until 1993.
Then we get three comments:
1) there is an inconsistency between dates of type 2 motors for black and red.
Latest black motor type 2 came in 24th week in 1982 (worst case on 26th week
but not after), but the latest red motor came in 49th week in 1982 (or later).
2) train 7727 from 1983 came first with motors made in late 1982, as there is
one made on 49th week in 1982. This is because Lego had some red motors of type
2 in his stock and used them for motors that came in market in 1983.
Now we can look at years each train or supplemental set was released (I checked
this by going through cataloges 1980-1993):
7730, 7750, 7760: 1980-1982
7740: 1980- 1984
7725: 1981- 1984
7727, 7755: 1983- 1984
7735, 7745: 1985-1990
7865: 1980-1993
5086: 1993
Based on this, we know:
7730: type 1 and type 2 (type 2 also seen and owned by many people)
7750: type 1 already changeed on bricklink (what about type 2?)
7760: types 1, 2 (type 3?)
7740: types 1, 2 and 3
7725: types 1, 2 and 3
7727: types 2 and 3 (type two need a proof but some sellers on bricklink can
confirm this)
7755: type 3 (what about 2?)
7735: type 3 (and 4?)
7745: type 3 (and 4?)
7865: type 1, 2 and 3 (and 4?)
5086: type 4 as is on brcklink
The main black hole is the type 4 coming with service pack 5086 from 1993. But
I own one from 1989. Either the service pack was released since 1989 or 1990
but not 1993, or the type 4 came also with other set or sets (7735?, 7745?,
7865?) This needs more investigation.
*********
I took bunch of photos. Maybe not of best quality, but one need to upload a photo
for comparison of these motors on bricklink. A photo of red motor bb12vb is also
missing.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/161250705@N05/albums/72157691675769324
In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Add 1 Part bb12va Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern Type I with 2 round contact holes (match ID 2)
* Add 1 Part bb12vb Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern Type II with 3 round contact holes (Alternate) (match ID 1)
* Delete 1 Part bb12v Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern
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| | | | | | | Author: | wannes. | | Posted: | Jan 20, 2018 09:22 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 22 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
| | The main black hole is the type 4 coming with service pack 5086 from 1993. But
I own one from 1989. Either the service pack was released since 1989 or 1990
but not 1993, or the type 4 came also with other set or sets (7735?, 7745?,
7865?) This needs more investigation.
|
I know where it could come from. I will post more on this later
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| | | | | | | Author: | SezaR | | Posted: | Jan 20, 2018 10:19 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 26 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| Correction
We don't know if 7725 came also with type 1. Seems unlikely but possible.
Here are updates based on Johan's comment:
7730: type 1 and type 2 (type 2 also seen and owned by many people)
7750: type 1 / this is already changed and corrected on bricklink (did it come
also with type 2?)
7760: types 1, 2 (type 3?)
7740: types 1, 2 and 3
7725: types 2 and 3 (and type 1?)
7727: types 2 and 3 (type 2 need a proof but some sellers/collectors on bricklink
can confirm this)
7755: type 3 (what about 2?)
7735: type 3 (and 4?)
7745: type 3 (and 4?)
7865: type 1, 2 and 3 and 4.
Main questions to be discovered for know:
I) did 7750 com with type 2 (or even 3)?
II) did 7725 come with type 1?
III) did 7735 and 7745 come with type 4? they were in market until 1990 and type
4 was produced since mid 1989.
If we distinguish types 2 and 3, then more work on inventories has to be done
In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
| | I think we can easily correct the inventory for 12v modern train motors bb12v.
Sorry, but it is going to be long.
General comments:
- There are four types of black 12v train motors, but only three types for red
one. The last type (type 4) came only in black.
- On bricklink, only three types are recognized. There is no reference to the
pin located on the top of train. The types one and two came with integrated pin
whereas the types three and four with separated pin. This is because Lego realized
that the pin could break easily, so since 1982 the type three came with separated
pin. If you open the motor, you can take off the pin and replace it with a new
one.
On bricklink, there is a distinction between 3 round contact holes and 3 slotted
contact holes although there is no difference in their functionality. It would
be helpful to also distinguish types three and four.
The match between various types of 12v train motors and the "item No." on bricklink:
Type 1: bb12Va
Type 2: bb12Vb
Type 3: bb12Vb
Type 4: bb12Vc
If my request to add type 3 can be accepted, then we can rename the items as
bb12Va, bb12Vb, bb12Vc and bb12Vd.
- there is a number craved underneath of motor indicating the date the motor
was produced. For example 24 2 means the 24th week in 1982 and 38 0 mean the
38th week in 1980.
Based on this and the motors I have, the earliest and latest motor of each type
are:
Black type 1: 19 0
Black type 2: 8 1 - 24 2
Black type 3: 27 2 - 34 9
Black type 4: 45 9 - (until 1983)
Red type 1: 17 0 , 38 0
Red type 2: 22 1 - 39 2
Red type 3: 37 3 - 17 4
For example, see:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/161250705@N05/25073945478/in/dateposted-public/
Based on this:
Type one (red and black) motor was produced "probably only" in 1980. (I own a
black motor of type 2 from 8th week in 1981)
Type two black motor was produced since 1981 until mid 1982. (the latest one
I have is made on 24th week in 1982 whereas I have one type 3 made on 27th week
in 1982)
Type two red motor was produced "probably" since 1981 until "probably" end of
1982. (the latest I have is made in 49th week in 1982)
Type three black motor was produced since mid 1982 until "probably" 1993 (with
the set 7865). (need more investigation for the latest date but we don't
really need to know it)
Type three red motor was produced since 1983 until end of 1984. (no train coming
with red motor was released after 1984)
Type four black motor was produced "probably" since late 1989 until 1993.
Then we get three comments:
1) there is an inconsistency between dates of type 2 motors for black and red.
Latest black motor type 2 came in 24th week in 1982 (worst case on 26th week
but not after), but the latest red motor came in 49th week in 1982 (or later).
2) train 7727 from 1983 came first with motors made in late 1982, as there is
one made on 49th week in 1982. This is because Lego had some red motors of type
2 in his stock and used them for motors that came in market in 1983.
Now we can look at years each train or supplemental set was released (I checked
this by going through cataloges 1980-1993):
7730, 7750, 7760: 1980-1982
7740: 1980- 1984
7725: 1981- 1984
7727, 7755: 1983- 1984
7735, 7745: 1985-1990
7865: 1980-1993
5086: 1993
Based on this, we know:
7730: type 1 and type 2 (type 2 also seen and owned by many people)
7750: type 1 already changeed on bricklink (what about type 2?)
7760: types 1, 2 (type 3?)
7740: types 1, 2 and 3
7725: types 1, 2 and 3
7727: types 2 and 3 (type two need a proof but some sellers on bricklink can
confirm this)
7755: type 3 (what about 2?)
7735: type 3 (and 4?)
7745: type 3 (and 4?)
7865: type 1, 2 and 3 (and 4?)
5086: type 4 as is on brcklink
The main black hole is the type 4 coming with service pack 5086 from 1993. But
I own one from 1989. Either the service pack was released since 1989 or 1990
but not 1993, or the type 4 came also with other set or sets (7735?, 7745?,
7865?) This needs more investigation.
*********
I took bunch of photos. Maybe not of best quality, but one need to upload a photo
for comparison of these motors on bricklink. A photo of red motor bb12vb is also
missing.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/161250705@N05/albums/72157691675769324
In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Add 1 Part bb12va Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern Type I with 2 round contact holes (match ID 2)
* Add 1 Part bb12vb Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern Type II with 3 round contact holes (Alternate) (match ID 1)
* Delete 1 Part bb12v Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern
|
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| | | | | | | Author: | therobo | | Posted: | Jan 26, 2018 09:29 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 32 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
|
| In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
| | I think we can easily correct the inventory for 12v modern train motors bb12v.
Sorry, but it is going to be long.
General comments:
- There are four types of black 12v train motors, but only three types for red
one. The last type (type 4) came only in black.
- On bricklink, only three types are recognized. There is no reference to the
pin located on the top of train. The types one and two came with integrated pin
whereas the types three and four with separated pin. This is because Lego realized
that the pin could break easily, so since 1982 the type three came with separated
pin. If you open the motor, you can take off the pin and replace it with a new
one.
On bricklink, there is a distinction between 3 round contact holes and 3 slotted
contact holes although there is no difference in their functionality. It would
be helpful to also distinguish types three and four.
The match between various types of 12v train motors and the "item No." on bricklink:
Type 1: bb12Va
Type 2: bb12Vb
Type 3: bb12Vb
Type 4: bb12Vc
If my request to add type 3 can be accepted, then we can rename the items as
bb12Va, bb12Vb, bb12Vc and bb12Vd.
|
Hi,
I think it would be the best to make a note on
[p=bb12Vb]
and adding an additional comparison image (if you could provide one), showing
the different pin situations.
The difference is not as obvious as the different contact holes, so a split of
the part is not justifiable.
| |
- there is a number craved underneath of motor indicating the date the motor
was produced. For example 24 2 means the 24th week in 1982 and 38 0 mean the
38th week in 1980.
Based on this and the motors I have, the earliest and latest motor of each type
are:
Black type 1: 19 0
Black type 2: 8 1 - 24 2
Black type 3: 27 2 - 34 9
Black type 4: 45 9 - (until 1983)
Red type 1: 17 0 , 38 0
Red type 2: 22 1 - 39 2
Red type 3: 37 3 - 17 4
For example, see:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/161250705@N05/25073945478/in/dateposted-public/
Based on this:
Type one (red and black) motor was produced "probably only" in 1980. (I own a
black motor of type 2 from 8th week in 1981)
Type two black motor was produced since 1981 until mid 1982. (the latest one
I have is made on 24th week in 1982 whereas I have one type 3 made on 27th week
in 1982)
Type two red motor was produced "probably" since 1981 until "probably" end of
1982. (the latest I have is made in 49th week in 1982)
Type three black motor was produced since mid 1982 until "probably" 1993 (with
the set 7865). (need more investigation for the latest date but we don't
really need to know it)
Type three red motor was produced since 1983 until end of 1984. (no train coming
with red motor was released after 1984)
Type four black motor was produced "probably" since late 1989 until 1993.
Then we get three comments:
1) there is an inconsistency between dates of type 2 motors for black and red.
Latest black motor type 2 came in 24th week in 1982 (worst case on 26th week
but not after), but the latest red motor came in 49th week in 1982 (or later).
2) train 7727 from 1983 came first with motors made in late 1982, as there is
one made on 49th week in 1982. This is because Lego had some red motors of type
2 in his stock and used them for motors that came in market in 1983.
Now we can look at years each train or supplemental set was released (I checked
this by going through cataloges 1980-1993):
7730, 7750, 7760: 1980-1982
7740: 1980- 1984
7725: 1981- 1984
7727, 7755: 1983- 1984
7735, 7745: 1985-1990
7865: 1980-1993
5086: 1993
Based on this, we know:
7730: type 1 and type 2 (type 2 also seen and owned by many people)
7750: type 1 already changeed on bricklink (what about type 2?)
7760: types 1, 2 (type 3?)
7740: types 1, 2 and 3
7725: types 1, 2 and 3
7727: types 2 and 3 (type two need a proof but some sellers on bricklink can
confirm this)
7755: type 3 (what about 2?)
7735: type 3 (and 4?)
7745: type 3 (and 4?)
7865: type 1, 2 and 3 (and 4?)
5086: type 4 as is on brcklink
The main black hole is the type 4 coming with service pack 5086 from 1993. But
I own one from 1989. Either the service pack was released since 1989 or 1990
but not 1993, or the type 4 came also with other set or sets (7735?, 7745?,
7865?) This needs more investigation.
*********
I took bunch of photos. Maybe not of best quality, but one need to upload a photo
for comparison of these motors on bricklink. A photo of red motor bb12vb is also
missing.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/161250705@N05/albums/72157691675769324
In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Add 1 Part bb12va Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern Type I with 2 round contact holes (match ID 2)
* Add 1 Part bb12vb Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern Type II with 3 round contact holes (Alternate) (match ID 1)
* Delete 1 Part bb12v Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | SezaR | | Posted: | Jan 26, 2018 10:24 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 41 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| This is in progress, but I have taken some photos. You can check them here:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/161250705@N05/albums/72157691675769324
In Inventories Requests, therobo writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
| | I think we can easily correct the inventory for 12v modern train motors bb12v.
Sorry, but it is going to be long.
General comments:
- There are four types of black 12v train motors, but only three types for red
one. The last type (type 4) came only in black.
- On bricklink, only three types are recognized. There is no reference to the
pin located on the top of train. The types one and two came with integrated pin
whereas the types three and four with separated pin. This is because Lego realized
that the pin could break easily, so since 1982 the type three came with separated
pin. If you open the motor, you can take off the pin and replace it with a new
one.
On bricklink, there is a distinction between 3 round contact holes and 3 slotted
contact holes although there is no difference in their functionality. It would
be helpful to also distinguish types three and four.
The match between various types of 12v train motors and the "item No." on bricklink:
Type 1: bb12Va
Type 2: bb12Vb
Type 3: bb12Vb
Type 4: bb12Vc
If my request to add type 3 can be accepted, then we can rename the items as
bb12Va, bb12Vb, bb12Vc and bb12Vd.
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Hi,
I think it would be the best to make a note on
[p=bb12Vb]
and adding an additional comparison image (if you could provide one), showing
the different pin situations.
The difference is not as obvious as the different contact holes, so a split of
the part is not justifiable.
| |
- there is a number craved underneath of motor indicating the date the motor
was produced. For example 24 2 means the 24th week in 1982 and 38 0 mean the
38th week in 1980.
Based on this and the motors I have, the earliest and latest motor of each type
are:
Black type 1: 19 0
Black type 2: 8 1 - 24 2
Black type 3: 27 2 - 34 9
Black type 4: 45 9 - (until 1983)
Red type 1: 17 0 , 38 0
Red type 2: 22 1 - 39 2
Red type 3: 37 3 - 17 4
For example, see:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/161250705@N05/25073945478/in/dateposted-public/
Based on this:
Type one (red and black) motor was produced "probably only" in 1980. (I own a
black motor of type 2 from 8th week in 1981)
Type two black motor was produced since 1981 until mid 1982. (the latest one
I have is made on 24th week in 1982 whereas I have one type 3 made on 27th week
in 1982)
Type two red motor was produced "probably" since 1981 until "probably" end of
1982. (the latest I have is made in 49th week in 1982)
Type three black motor was produced since mid 1982 until "probably" 1993 (with
the set 7865). (need more investigation for the latest date but we don't
really need to know it)
Type three red motor was produced since 1983 until end of 1984. (no train coming
with red motor was released after 1984)
Type four black motor was produced "probably" since late 1989 until 1993.
Then we get three comments:
1) there is an inconsistency between dates of type 2 motors for black and red.
Latest black motor type 2 came in 24th week in 1982 (worst case on 26th week
but not after), but the latest red motor came in 49th week in 1982 (or later).
2) train 7727 from 1983 came first with motors made in late 1982, as there is
one made on 49th week in 1982. This is because Lego had some red motors of type
2 in his stock and used them for motors that came in market in 1983.
Now we can look at years each train or supplemental set was released (I checked
this by going through cataloges 1980-1993):
7730, 7750, 7760: 1980-1982
7740: 1980- 1984
7725: 1981- 1984
7727, 7755: 1983- 1984
7735, 7745: 1985-1990
7865: 1980-1993
5086: 1993
Based on this, we know:
7730: type 1 and type 2 (type 2 also seen and owned by many people)
7750: type 1 already changeed on bricklink (what about type 2?)
7760: types 1, 2 (type 3?)
7740: types 1, 2 and 3
7725: types 1, 2 and 3
7727: types 2 and 3 (type two need a proof but some sellers on bricklink can
confirm this)
7755: type 3 (what about 2?)
7735: type 3 (and 4?)
7745: type 3 (and 4?)
7865: type 1, 2 and 3 (and 4?)
5086: type 4 as is on brcklink
The main black hole is the type 4 coming with service pack 5086 from 1993. But
I own one from 1989. Either the service pack was released since 1989 or 1990
but not 1993, or the type 4 came also with other set or sets (7735?, 7745?,
7865?) This needs more investigation.
*********
I took bunch of photos. Maybe not of best quality, but one need to upload a photo
for comparison of these motors on bricklink. A photo of red motor bb12vb is also
missing.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/161250705@N05/albums/72157691675769324
In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
| | Please make changes to the following inventory:
* Add 1 Part bb12va Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern Type I with 2 round contact holes (match ID 2)
* Add 1 Part bb12vb Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern Type II with 3 round contact holes (Alternate) (match ID 1)
* Delete 1 Part bb12v Red Electric, Train Motor 12V Modern
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Admin_Russell | | Posted: | Jan 27, 2018 13:00 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 45 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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BrickLink
ID CardAdmin_Russell
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Location:  USA, California |
| Member Since |
Contact |
Type |
Status |
| May 9, 2017 |
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Admin |
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| BrickLink Administrator |
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| In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
I have looked closely at all the photos but haven't been able to notice a
difference in the pin itself. Are you talking about the circle area around where
the pin is planted?
Lego was apparently having issues with the pin, and it finally resulted in a
complete replacement of the part:
* | | 4092 Train Bogie Plate (Tile, Modified 6 x 4 with 7mm Pin)
Parts: Train |
* | | 4025 Train Bogie Plate (Tile, Modified 6 x 4 with 5mm Pin)
Parts: Train |
Maybe some of our molding experts can chime in on this, but it looks to me as
though a round plug surrounding the pin was cut out of the existing motor casing
and replaced with another plug with a very slightly different pin. Are the pins
the same length as the earlier ones?
If there is no functional difference, I myself would not push for a new variant.
Like Ronald said, a note on the entry with some good comparison photos may be
the way to go here.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | elias3 | | Posted: | Jan 27, 2018 13:58 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 23 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| In Inventories Requests, Admin_Russell writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
I have looked closely at all the photos but haven't been able to notice a
difference in the pin itself. Are you talking about the circle area around where
the pin is planted?
Lego was apparently having issues with the pin, and it finally resulted in a
complete replacement of the part:
* | | 4092 Train Bogie Plate (Tile, Modified 6 x 4 with 7mm Pin)
Parts: Train |
* | | 4025 Train Bogie Plate (Tile, Modified 6 x 4 with 5mm Pin)
Parts: Train |
Maybe some of our molding experts can chime in on this, but it looks to me as
though a round plug surrounding the pin was cut out of the existing motor casing
and replaced with another plug with a very slightly different pin. Are the pins
the same length as the earlier ones?
If there is no functional difference, I myself would not push for a new variant.
Like Ronald said, a note on the entry with some good comparison photos may be
the way to go here.
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Russell
Right, it's about the circle area around the pin.
This pin was removable/changeable when the pin was broken on that motor. So they
changed the 'motortop'
I hope this type motor will be accept to the catalog.
Stefaan
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | SezaR | | Posted: | Jan 27, 2018 15:48 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 41 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| Dear Admin,
IF there is no difference in functionality, why bricklink distinguish between
bb12vb and bb12vc?
For 12v fans, there should be a difference between type 2 and type 3. They care
about this for various reasons. One is that they want to have the proper motor
for each set.
On other thing is that you can repair the case of the motor type 3, but you cannot
do it with type 2. If the pin of type 3 breaks, you can find a non-functional
or semi-broken motor type 3 or 4 and replace the pin. You cannot do the same
thing with type 1 or 2 unless if you replace the whole case.
I personally bought a broken 12v train motor on bricklink for using its case
and repair another motor.
I didn't find a good photo. But check the photo attached. The pin is on the
right side, besides the wheels.
In Inventories Requests, Admin_Russell writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
I have looked closely at all the photos but haven't been able to notice a
difference in the pin itself. Are you talking about the circle area around where
the pin is planted?
Lego was apparently having issues with the pin, and it finally resulted in a
complete replacement of the part:
* | | 4092 Train Bogie Plate (Tile, Modified 6 x 4 with 7mm Pin)
Parts: Train |
* | | 4025 Train Bogie Plate (Tile, Modified 6 x 4 with 5mm Pin)
Parts: Train |
Maybe some of our molding experts can chime in on this, but it looks to me as
though a round plug surrounding the pin was cut out of the existing motor casing
and replaced with another plug with a very slightly different pin. Are the pins
the same length as the earlier ones?
If there is no functional difference, I myself would not push for a new variant.
Like Ronald said, a note on the entry with some good comparison photos may be
the way to go here.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Admin_Russell | | Posted: | Jan 27, 2018 16:04 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 38 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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BrickLink
ID CardAdmin_Russell
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| Location: USA, California |
| Member Since |
Contact |
Type |
Status |
| May 9, 2017 |
|
Admin |
|
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| BrickLink Administrator |
|
| In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
| | Dear Admin,
IF there is no difference in functionality, why bricklink distinguish between
bb12vb and bb12vc?
For 12v fans, there should be a difference between type 2 and type 3. They care
about this for various reasons. One is that they want to have the proper motor
for each set.
On other thing is that you can repair the case of the motor type 3, but you cannot
do it with type 2. If the pin of type 3 breaks, you can find a non-functional
or semi-broken motor type 3 or 4 and replace the pin. You cannot do the same
thing with type 1 or 2 unless if you replace the whole case.
I personally bought a broken 12v train motor on bricklink for using its case
and repair another motor.
I didn't find a good photo. But check the photo attached. The pin is on the
right side, besides the wheels.
|
Thanks for the informative reply and the photo of the disassembled motor. I was
interpreting "separated pin" as the pin itself having a separation, i.e. the
slot in the top. But you mean that the whole plug (pin and all) can be removed,
right?
Is the plug glued or screwed in, or does it just set in place? And how hard is
it to take the motor apart?
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | SezaR | | Posted: | Jan 27, 2018 18:20 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 43 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| The case of motors type 1 (bb12va) and type 2 have two parts. The pin is part
of the top part.
But the case of motors type 3 and 4 have 3 parts. Indeed the top part of have
a hole in which the pin (the third part) fits, so why I call it "separated pin".
Because if you open the motor, you can easily take off the pin and replace it
with a good one. (see again the photo attached to my previous for comparison)
I attach few photos.
It is not really hard to open the motor. But after you need to glue it back.
What is really hard is open the motor without causing any scratch on the case.
In the post below, you can see some pictures and how you can oepn the motor.
The photos belong to a motor of type 1 or 2.
https://www.eurobricks.com/forum/index.php?/forums/topic/113994-12v-train-motorbb12v-disassembly-and-repair/
I have opened two motors type 1 or 2 (so pin integrated to the case). I didn't
follow the advice of the above post so did few scratches on the bottom part.
I have not opened a motor of type 3 or 4, so cannot make a good photo of the
separated pin. But I am sure you understand how it looks like.
In Inventories Requests, Admin_Russell writes:
| | In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
| | Dear Admin,
IF there is no difference in functionality, why bricklink distinguish between
bb12vb and bb12vc?
For 12v fans, there should be a difference between type 2 and type 3. They care
about this for various reasons. One is that they want to have the proper motor
for each set.
On other thing is that you can repair the case of the motor type 3, but you cannot
do it with type 2. If the pin of type 3 breaks, you can find a non-functional
or semi-broken motor type 3 or 4 and replace the pin. You cannot do the same
thing with type 1 or 2 unless if you replace the whole case.
I personally bought a broken 12v train motor on bricklink for using its case
and repair another motor.
I didn't find a good photo. But check the photo attached. The pin is on the
right side, besides the wheels.
|
Thanks for the informative reply and the photo of the disassembled motor. I was
interpreting "separated pin" as the pin itself having a separation, i.e. the
slot in the top. But you mean that the whole plug (pin and all) can be removed,
right?
Is the plug glued or screwed in, or does it just set in place? And how hard is
it to take the motor apart?
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| | | | | Author: | wannes. | | Posted: | Jan 20, 2018 09:19 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 27 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| In Inventories Requests, SezaR writes:
| | If my request to add type 3 can be accepted, then we can rename the items as
bb12Va, bb12Vb, bb12Vc and bb12Vd.
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I am a heavy supporter of this
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| | | | | Author: | wannes. | | Posted: | Jan 20, 2018 09:40 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 27 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| The type 4 motor also comes with the modern version of set 7865. I know this
for sure because I opened a sealed one. I still have it if you like to know the
date on it.
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| | | | | | | Author: | SezaR | | Posted: | Jan 20, 2018 10:23 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 23 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| Thanks for pointing out this. I am gonna correct inventory for 7865. Please upload
your photo under my inventory change request for 7865.
Whenever you get a chance, could you please check the number underneath your
12V motors and see if any improvements on production time for various motors
can be made?
In Inventories Requests, wannes_dn writes:
| | The type 4 motor also comes with the modern version of set 7865. I know this
for sure because I opened a sealed one. I still have it if you like to know the
date on it.
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| | | | | | | Author: | wannes. | | Posted: | Jan 20, 2018 10:36 | | Subject: | Re: Inventory Change Request for Set 7730-1 | | Viewed: | 21 times | | Topic: | Inventories Requests | |
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| In Inventories Requests, wannes_dn writes:
| | The type 4 motor also comes with the modern version of set 7865. I know this
for sure because I opened a sealed one. I still have it if you like to know the
date on it.
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the picture is not mine actually. I just took it as an example. But I can make
a picture of the new motor and his inner plastic tray that i still have. The
outer box I threw away. (I was 16 at the time i opened it).
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Canada, British Columbia
)
)
Belgium, Oost-Vlaanderen
Germany, Berlin
)
)
)
