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| | | Author: | popsicle  | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2023 13:05 | | Subject: | (Cancelled) | | Viewed: | 449 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| | (Cancelled) |
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| | | | | Author: | UTLF | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2023 13:25 | | Subject: | (Cancelled) | | Viewed: | 60 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| | (Cancelled) |
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| | | | | | | Author: | Nubs_Select | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2023 13:33 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 55 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| In Buying, UTLF writes:
| | A simple fix would to make quote requests mandatory in every store, that way
these things can be avoided
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Unless if there is an instant checkout alternative that the order qualifies for
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| | | | | | | Author: | popsicle | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2023 14:17 | | Subject: | (Cancelled) | | Viewed: | 69 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| | (Cancelled) |
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| | | | | Author: | Mr_Rofl | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2023 13:44 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 68 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| In Buying, popsicle writes:
| | the added after-commitment costs through inflated shipping or additional charges,
sometimes both. At least with some vendors using the invoice method.
Example: Just paid a member within the EU, for some heads. Having never transacted
with this member before, I initially thought the price good. Silly me. At least
they only used one of the two available "additional charges" columns
In moving forward, what I typically do is create a note for the member (collected
quite a few over the years) so that the next time I am pondering a buy with them,
I’ll know to factor these types of costs (shipping rate and additional charges)
before pulling the trigger. For me it’s that simple.
I gotta say though, that it's been buyer experiences like this, that have
motivated me early on to structure our selling practice with no additional charges
and low shipping costs, to the point that we often subsidize the shipping by
a small amount. I'd rather bake any ancillary costs into our prices than
hit the buyer with them afterwards.
-popsicle
|
Is it really that terrible? With all the governments wanting a piece of the action
in international business. Probably paid via Paypal who charges on every cent
transfered (so also the tax piece) and requiring at least tracking.
Try to send this order by your standards back to Europe. Your shipping costs
also start with $14,95. Do you eat the paypal fee over the government tax (in
europe around 25%) and shipping yourself?
Do know, in Europe (or EU at least) there is a free cancallation for all orders
not picked up locally. So you can cancel your order if you don`t want it.
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| | | | | | | Author: | popsicle | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2023 14:00 | | Subject: | (Cancelled) | | Viewed: | 72 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| | (Cancelled) |
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| | | | | Author: | EmblaRonja | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2023 13:51 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 71 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| Yeah - it's easy to sit in the country with the largest market in the world
nagging abut fees - not knowing anything about how it is elsewhere...
In Europe we have A LOT higher fees for PayPal than you in the states. And it
differ a lot! I pay everything between 7 to 15 % in PayPal fees for all my US
orders. But only charge 3,5 %.
If I counted correctly you paid 7,6 % in fees. That sounds like a proper calculation
of a PayPal fee for that transaction.
What about charging no fees and instead have higher price on parts? Well in EU
we have better payment methods - without ANY fees for seller or buyer. So we
want to encourage our buyers to use them instead of PayPal. If we would instead
increase the part price then every customer would have to pay "fees"
(higher price) even if there wasn't any transaction fee. Not fair either,
don't you think?
Also most EU countries are able to ship a lot cheaper than you are in the states.
So you are able to make good deals in EU shops even with the fees. You did place
the order, right?
/Niclas
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| | | | | | | Author: | popsicle | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2023 14:11 | | Subject: | (Cancelled) | | Viewed: | 77 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| | (Cancelled) |
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| | | | | | | Author: | yorbrick | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2023 14:29 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 71 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| In Buying, EmblaRonja writes:
| | Yeah - it's easy to sit in the country with the largest market in the world
nagging abut fees - not knowing anything about how it is elsewhere...
In Europe we have A LOT higher fees for PayPal than you in the states. And it
differ a lot! I pay everything between 7 to 15 % in PayPal fees for all my US
orders. But only charge 3,5 %.
|
How are you paying 15% for Paypal fees, you must be placing very small orders
for the effective paypal percentage fee to be that high. Even with currency exchange
and cross border fees, it is about 7.5% plus the smallish fixed fee 35c/30p.
.
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| | | | | Author: | LeeGo73 | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2023 17:48 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 59 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| In Buying, popsicle writes:
| | the added after-commitment costs through inflated shipping or additional charges,
sometimes both. At least with some vendors using the invoice method.
Example: Just paid a member within the EU, for some heads. Having never transacted
with this member before, I initially thought the price good. Silly me. At least
they only used one of the two available "additional charges" columns
In moving forward, what I typically do is create a note for the member (collected
quite a few over the years) so that the next time I am pondering a buy with them,
I’ll know to factor these types of costs (shipping rate and additional charges)
before pulling the trigger. For me it’s that simple.
I gotta say though, that it's been buyer experiences like this, that have
motivated me early on to structure our selling practice with no additional charges
and low shipping costs, to the point that we often subsidize the shipping by
a small amount. I'd rather bake any ancillary costs into our prices than
hit the buyer with them afterwards.
-popsicle
|
Looks like your seller charges €1,50 handling & packing and 5% for paypal cost.
Did the terms of the seller mention this?
Could you have calculated the shipping costs upfront, based on the information
available on the terms page?
€18,30 looks a bit high for shipping , but perhaps the seller makes insurance
above a certain order amount mandatory. This could increase shipping cost as
sometimes it's not possible to get insurance with smaller (cheap) parcels.
Was anything mentioned on the seller's terms page or during the order process?
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| | | | | | | Author: | popsicle | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2023 18:03 | | Subject: | (Cancelled) | | Viewed: | 42 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| | (Cancelled) |
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| | | | | | | Author: | popsicle | | Posted: | Jan 12, 2023 18:22 | | Subject: | (Cancelled) | | Viewed: | 62 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| | (Cancelled) |
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | TheBrickGuys | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 00:33 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 33 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| Okay, I have the perfect solution for you. In your last post you stated that,
in part, you are "trying to enjoy the spending of my money". Well, it
just so happens, I really enjoy "receiving" money so if you enjoy spending
it and I enjoy receiving it, why not avoid all those pesky future headaches and
just do all your future BrickLink shopping in our store.
Heck, I'll even compliment you on how good looking you are and how very smart
you are after each and every sale to help make the whole "enjoy the spending
of my money" experience even that much more enjoyable!
Sound good?
Jim.
PS. I will even throw in free shipping on every 50th order. Well as long as it
is under 4 bucks.
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Nubs_Select | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 00:38 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 40 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| In Buying, TheBrickGuys writes:
| | Okay, I have the perfect solution for you. In your last post you stated that,
in part, you are "trying to enjoy the spending of my money". Well, it
just so happens, I really enjoy "receiving" money so if you enjoy spending
it and I enjoy receiving it, why not avoid all those pesky future headaches and
just do all your future BrickLink shopping in our store.
Heck, I'll even compliment you on how good looking you are and how very smart
you are after each and every sale to help make the whole "enjoy the spending
of my money" experience even that much more enjoyable!
Sound good?
Jim.
PS. I will even throw in free shipping on every 50th order. Well as long as it
is under 4 bucks.
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | popsicle | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 06:50 | | Subject: | (Cancelled) | | Viewed: | 45 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| | (Cancelled) |
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | LeeGo73 | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 05:28 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 40 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| In Buying, popsicle writes:
| | In Buying, LeeGo73 writes:
| | In Buying, popsicle writes:
| | the added after-commitment costs through inflated shipping or additional charges,
sometimes both. At least with some vendors using the invoice method.
Example: Just paid a member within the EU, for some heads. Having never transacted
with this member before, I initially thought the price good. Silly me. At least
they only used one of the two available "additional charges" columns
In moving forward, what I typically do is create a note for the member (collected
quite a few over the years) so that the next time I am pondering a buy with them,
I’ll know to factor these types of costs (shipping rate and additional charges)
before pulling the trigger. For me it’s that simple.
I gotta say though, that it's been buyer experiences like this, that have
motivated me early on to structure our selling practice with no additional charges
and low shipping costs, to the point that we often subsidize the shipping by
a small amount. I'd rather bake any ancillary costs into our prices than
hit the buyer with them afterwards.
-popsicle
|
Looks like your seller charges €1,50 handling & packing and 5% for paypal cost.
Did the terms of the seller mention this?
Could you have calculated the shipping costs upfront, based on the information
available on the terms page?
€18,30 looks a bit high for shipping , but perhaps the seller makes insurance
above a certain order amount mandatory. This could increase shipping cost as
sometimes it's not possible to get insurance with smaller (cheap) parcels.
Was anything mentioned on the seller's terms page or during the order process?
|
It's possible, I don't know. I'll take another look. But I don't
have an advance degree in calculus nor do I wish to perform such tasks when
trying to enjoy the spending of my money.
That's just me, one that's been schooled by a successful salesman
(my father) to make it "painless for the buyer"
Though I am fully aware of how others around the world view such things. They
just sometimes don't align with my take.
Like I said to another within this thread "I'm fine with the buy and
don't exclude buying from the seller going forward. Only next time I'll
have notes to better understand the actual price"
Thanks for your input, nonetheless
-popsicle
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Addition and estimating cost based on a percentage does not require an advance
degree in calculus I think.
What happens if the seller decides to change his approach tommorrow and includes
the paypal fees and/or handling & packing fees (partially) into the price of
the parts? Maybe even in combination with a minimum order amount.
Your note on the seller is now outdated and incorrect and might make you decide
not to buy the parts and miss out on a good deal.
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | yorbrick | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 05:43 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 36 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| | | What happens if the seller decides to change his approach tommorrow and includes
the paypal fees and/or handling & packing fees (partially) into the price of
the parts? Maybe even in combination with a minimum order amount.
Your note on the seller is now outdated and incorrect and might make you decide
not to buy the parts and miss out on a good deal.
|
It is just a note so they can check. If 5% or so is going to make them miss out
on buying from that store, then it wasn't that good a deal anyway.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | popsicle | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 06:36 | | Subject: | (Cancelled) | | Viewed: | 31 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| | (Cancelled) |
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| | | | | Author: | Rob_and_Shelagh | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 06:11 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 52 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| In Buying, popsicle writes:
| | the added after-commitment costs through inflated shipping or additional charges,
sometimes both. At least with some vendors using the invoice method.
Example: Just paid a member within the EU, for some heads. Having never transacted
with this member before, I initially thought the price good. Silly me. At least
they only used one of the two available "additional charges" columns
In moving forward, what I typically do is create a note for the member (collected
quite a few over the years) so that the next time I am pondering a buy with them,
I’ll know to factor these types of costs (shipping rate and additional charges)
before pulling the trigger. For me it’s that simple.
I gotta say though, that it's been buyer experiences like this, that have
motivated me early on to structure our selling practice with no additional charges
and low shipping costs, to the point that we often subsidize the shipping by
a small amount. I'd rather bake any ancillary costs into our prices than
hit the buyer with them afterwards.
-popsicle
|
For all my time here, this has been the biggest issue raised by buyers on the
forum.
Majority of orders now go through auto checkout so for those orders, if sellers
put on additional costs at least the buyer can see the final price before committing
to the order (or not). Given this exists maybe it is time for BL to call time
on charges added to orders after the buyer has placed the order. This could easily
be done by forcing all non automated checkout orders to quote.
That said I agree with many others who say just put the charges into your prices,
we have always done that in our store. Total price = parts as priced + shipping
as stated.
Robert
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| | | | | | | Author: | popsicle | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 06:32 | | Subject: | (Cancelled) | | Viewed: | 40 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| | (Cancelled) |
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| | | | | | | Author: | EmblaRonja | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 06:44 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 35 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| That said I agree with many others who say just put the charges into your
prices,
we have always done that in our store. Total price = parts as priced + shipping
as stated.
Ha ha - this isn't true for the most states in US you have your sales TAX
after that. In EU we don't - instead we have VAT included in sales price.
Just accept there are differences in a global market.
/Niclas
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | Rob_and_Shelagh | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 07:08 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 36 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| In Buying, EmblaRonja writes:
| | That said I agree with many others who say just put the charges into your
prices,
we have always done that in our store. Total price = parts as priced + shipping
as stated.
Ha ha - this isn't true for the most states in US you have your sales TAX
after that. In EU we don't - instead we have VAT included in sales price.
Just accept there are differences in a global market.
/Niclas
|
of course markets have their differences. That should not get in the way of the
buyer seeing the final price before he buys so he can compare the offers from
different markets easily before making an informed purchase decision.
Robert
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| | | | | | | Author: | infinibrix | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 07:17 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 44 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| In Buying, Rob_and_Shelagh writes:
| | Majority of orders now go through auto checkout so for those orders, if sellers
put on additional costs at least the buyer can see the final price before committing
to the order (or not). Given this exists maybe it is time for BL to call time
on charges added to orders after the buyer has placed the order. This could easily
be done by forcing all non automated checkout orders to quote.
|
Well yes I've been calling on this for a long time and that's coming
from someone who only manually invoices. Since I don't add anything other
than my flat rate shipping/handling fee I simply quote a reasonable price and
rarely have any complaints. If anyone was unhappy I would always give them the
option to cancel!
| | That said I agree with many others who say just put the charges into your prices,
we have always done that in our store. Total price = parts as priced + shipping
as stated.
|
Exactly, adding all those extra fees at the point of purchase is just a nonsense
and done for no other reason than to appear at the top of the best price results
which is misleading. Why Bricklink still continues to allows this is beyond me?
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| | | | | | | Author: | LeeGo73 | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 09:34 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 41 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
|
| In Buying, Rob_and_Shelagh writes:
| | In Buying, popsicle writes:
| | the added after-commitment costs through inflated shipping or additional charges,
sometimes both. At least with some vendors using the invoice method.
Example: Just paid a member within the EU, for some heads. Having never transacted
with this member before, I initially thought the price good. Silly me. At least
they only used one of the two available "additional charges" columns
In moving forward, what I typically do is create a note for the member (collected
quite a few over the years) so that the next time I am pondering a buy with them,
I’ll know to factor these types of costs (shipping rate and additional charges)
before pulling the trigger. For me it’s that simple.
I gotta say though, that it's been buyer experiences like this, that have
motivated me early on to structure our selling practice with no additional charges
and low shipping costs, to the point that we often subsidize the shipping by
a small amount. I'd rather bake any ancillary costs into our prices than
hit the buyer with them afterwards.
-popsicle
|
For all my time here, this has been the biggest issue raised by buyers on the
forum.
Majority of orders now go through auto checkout so for those orders, if sellers
put on additional costs at least the buyer can see the final price before committing
to the order (or not). Given this exists maybe it is time for BL to call time
on charges added to orders after the buyer has placed the order. This could easily
be done by forcing all non automated checkout orders to quote.
That said I agree with many others who say just put the charges into your prices,
we have always done that in our store. Total price = parts as priced + shipping
as stated.
Robert
|
'just put the charges into the prices' would include the fees for paypal
I assume.
This would be unfair to a large portion of the buyers within the EU who have
the option to pay with IBAN (if the seller has this activated). With IBAN there
are no fees. Why would a buyer paying with IBAN be confronted with higher part
prices that include the paypal fees?
Sellers who are not charging additional fees, but rather hide these in inflated
shipping costs or increased part prices are actually overcharging buyers who
pay with payment methods without cost (like IBAN).
Automatic checkout makes all costs clear before you place the order. But unfortunately
it's not possible in BL to add fees based on a payment method that combines
a fixed value and % of total order. It is possible for the % of total order part,
it's the fixed value that cannot be added for any given payment method.
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | Rob_and_Shelagh | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 09:43 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 32 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
|
| In Buying, LeeGo73 writes:
| | In Buying, Rob_and_Shelagh writes:
| | In Buying, popsicle writes:
| | the added after-commitment costs through inflated shipping or additional charges,
sometimes both. At least with some vendors using the invoice method.
Example: Just paid a member within the EU, for some heads. Having never transacted
with this member before, I initially thought the price good. Silly me. At least
they only used one of the two available "additional charges" columns
In moving forward, what I typically do is create a note for the member (collected
quite a few over the years) so that the next time I am pondering a buy with them,
I’ll know to factor these types of costs (shipping rate and additional charges)
before pulling the trigger. For me it’s that simple.
I gotta say though, that it's been buyer experiences like this, that have
motivated me early on to structure our selling practice with no additional charges
and low shipping costs, to the point that we often subsidize the shipping by
a small amount. I'd rather bake any ancillary costs into our prices than
hit the buyer with them afterwards.
-popsicle
|
For all my time here, this has been the biggest issue raised by buyers on the
forum.
Majority of orders now go through auto checkout so for those orders, if sellers
put on additional costs at least the buyer can see the final price before committing
to the order (or not). Given this exists maybe it is time for BL to call time
on charges added to orders after the buyer has placed the order. This could easily
be done by forcing all non automated checkout orders to quote.
That said I agree with many others who say just put the charges into your prices,
we have always done that in our store. Total price = parts as priced + shipping
as stated.
Robert
|
'just put the charges into the prices' would include the fees for paypal
I assume.
This would be unfair to a large portion of the buyers within the EU who have
the option to pay with IBAN (if the seller has this activated). With IBAN there
are no fees. Why would a buyer paying with IBAN be confronted with higher part
prices that include the paypal fees?
Sellers who are not charging additional fees, but rather hide these in inflated
shipping costs or increased part prices are actually overcharging buyers who
pay with payment methods without cost (like IBAN).
Automatic checkout makes all costs clear before you place the order. But unfortunately
it's not possible in BL to add fees based on a payment method that combines
a fixed value and % of total order. It is possible for the % of total order part,
it's the fixed value that cannot be added for any given payment method.
|
We see Paypal fees just as an overhead, like a cost you pay for attracting the
order by offering Paypal. Typical part price might be 10pence, it is not possible
to even think about adding 0.03p to the price of the part to cover fees, rounded
to the nearest penny my part price will still be 10pence. If I were selling expensive
sets, OK 3% might make a small difference but I would still eat the cost, it
would not impact my prices, just my net profit.
Robert
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | infinibrix | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 10:34 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 31 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
|
| In Buying, LeeGo73 writes:
| | In Buying, Rob_and_Shelagh writes:
| | In Buying, popsicle writes:
| | the added after-commitment costs through inflated shipping or additional charges,
sometimes both. At least with some vendors using the invoice method.
Example: Just paid a member within the EU, for some heads. Having never transacted
with this member before, I initially thought the price good. Silly me. At least
they only used one of the two available "additional charges" columns
In moving forward, what I typically do is create a note for the member (collected
quite a few over the years) so that the next time I am pondering a buy with them,
I’ll know to factor these types of costs (shipping rate and additional charges)
before pulling the trigger. For me it’s that simple.
I gotta say though, that it's been buyer experiences like this, that have
motivated me early on to structure our selling practice with no additional charges
and low shipping costs, to the point that we often subsidize the shipping by
a small amount. I'd rather bake any ancillary costs into our prices than
hit the buyer with them afterwards.
-popsicle
|
For all my time here, this has been the biggest issue raised by buyers on the
forum.
Majority of orders now go through auto checkout so for those orders, if sellers
put on additional costs at least the buyer can see the final price before committing
to the order (or not). Given this exists maybe it is time for BL to call time
on charges added to orders after the buyer has placed the order. This could easily
be done by forcing all non automated checkout orders to quote.
That said I agree with many others who say just put the charges into your prices,
we have always done that in our store. Total price = parts as priced + shipping
as stated.
Robert
|
'just put the charges into the prices' would include the fees for paypal
I assume.
This would be unfair to a large portion of the buyers within the EU who have
the option to pay with IBAN (if the seller has this activated). With IBAN there
are no fees. Why would a buyer paying with IBAN be confronted with higher part
prices that include the paypal fees?
Sellers who are not charging additional fees, but rather hide these in inflated
shipping costs or increased part prices are actually overcharging buyers who
pay with payment methods without cost (like IBAN).
Automatic checkout makes all costs clear before you place the order. But unfortunately
it's not possible in BL to add fees based on a payment method that combines
a fixed value and % of total order. It is possible for the % of total order part,
it's the fixed value that cannot be added for any given payment method.
|
Your massively over thinking it.... I don't think many sellers are necessarily
sitting there with a calculator and adding 5% to each part to cover paypal fees,
3% to cover Bricklink fees and whatever % to cover picking and processing time.
At the end of the day A seller doesn't need any particular reason to justify
how much they charge on any given part from one week to another and so to assume
paypal fees are having a big influence over a sellers pricing strategy is rarely
the case. For instance if a seller increased their parts by 20% overnight would
there need to be a justified explanation as to their reasoning for doing so?
All sellers set their prices differently anyway?
The simple argument being made is that if a seller isn't happy with the profits
being made after fees then simply increase your prices to compensate rather than
trying to add fees after purchase as there is no justified reason for doing so
and the only reason sellers continue with this poor practice is because they
know it gives buyers the false perception that they are cheaper than they in
fact are!
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Rob_and_Shelagh | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 10:51 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 31 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| In Buying, infinibrix writes:
| | Your massively over thinking it.... I don't think many sellers are necessarily
sitting there with a calculator and adding 5% to each part to cover paypal fees,
3% to cover Bricklink fees and whatever % to cover picking and processing time.
At the end of the day A seller doesn't need any particular reason to justify
how much they charge on any given part from one week to another and so to assume
paypal fees are having a big influence over a sellers pricing strategy is rarely
the case. For instance if a seller increased their parts by 20% overnight would
there need to be a justified explanation as to their reasoning for doing so?
All sellers set their prices differently anyway?
The simple argument being made is that if a seller isn't happy with the profits
being made after fees then simply increase your prices to compensate rather than
trying to add fees after purchase as there is no justified reason for doing so
and the only reason sellers continue with this poor practice is because they
know it gives buyers the false perception that they are cheaper than they in
fact are!
|
Exactly that.
Also, another way we look at Paypal fees is: "does offering Paypal make us
more extra profit after paying the costs that if we did not offer Paypal?
For us the answer is yes so the Paypal fees are self-funding.
Same as "does selling on BL and paying BL fees generate more profit than
not selling on BL?".
Obviously yes otherwise we would not still be here after all these years.
Robert
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | yorbrick | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 11:16 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 33 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| | | This would be unfair to a large portion of the buyers within the EU who have
the option to pay with IBAN (if the seller has this activated). With IBAN there
are no fees. Why would a buyer paying with IBAN be confronted with higher part
prices that include the paypal fees?
Sellers who are not charging additional fees, but rather hide these in inflated
shipping costs or increased part prices are actually overcharging buyers who
pay with payment methods without cost (like IBAN).
|
If the vast majority of your buyers pay with IBAN, I can understand you wanting
to keep your prices low for them and then inflating prices for other buyers to
cover the PP fee. It is then how many other buyers do you put off because you
charge them more than the advertised price because they cannot pay by IBAN or
simply want to buy from a business rather than through a more personal transaction
like a bank transfer.
When I see a UK seller charging paypal fees, I normally least favourite the store.
I cannot be bothered to work out extra costs or start building a cart before
realising they charge more once you factor the paypal fees in. It is simpler
to just ignore the store as there are plenty of others. If they later decide
to stop doing it, I still ignore them as I don't go back and review least
favourites. First impressions matter.
| | Automatic checkout makes all costs clear before you place the order. But unfortunately
it's not possible in BL to add fees based on a payment method that combines
a fixed value and % of total order. It is possible for the % of total order part,
it's the fixed value that cannot be added for any given payment method.
|
Add the fixed charge to the postage costs. Or add a portion of it to the postage
costs, based on how many people use paypal.
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | qwertyboy | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 16:26 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 40 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| In Buying, LeeGo73 writes:
| | 'just put the charges into the prices' would include the fees for paypal
I assume.
This would be unfair to a large portion of the buyers within the EU who have
the option to pay with IBAN (if the seller has this activated). With IBAN there
are no fees. Why would a buyer paying with IBAN be confronted with higher part
prices that include the paypal fees?
|
Some sellers put in an additional fee to cover stuff like driving to the post
office. Pretty much anyone else agrees these costs should just be considered
overhead, and be covered in the price of the product. Then you get a request
for local pick-up, which obviously doesn't need that drive. Are you suggesting
pricing-including-travel-costs is now unfair to the person doing local pick-up?
Keep things simple, don't stack on fees but offer price-of-product plus shipping
cost.
My CAD 0.02 (for free).
Niek.
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | popsicle | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 16:33 | | Subject: | (Cancelled) | | Viewed: | 51 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| | (Cancelled) |
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| | | | | Author: | jennnifer | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 07:50 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 51 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| In Buying, popsicle writes:
| | the added after-commitment costs through inflated shipping or additional charges,
sometimes both. At least with some vendors using the invoice method.
Example: Just paid a member within the EU, for some heads. Having never transacted
with this member before, I initially thought the price good. Silly me. At least
they only used one of the two available "additional charges" columns
In moving forward, what I typically do is create a note for the member (collected
quite a few over the years) so that the next time I am pondering a buy with them,
I’ll know to factor these types of costs (shipping rate and additional charges)
before pulling the trigger. For me it’s that simple.
I gotta say though, that it's been buyer experiences like this, that have
motivated me early on to structure our selling practice with no additional charges
and low shipping costs, to the point that we often subsidize the shipping by
a small amount. I'd rather bake any ancillary costs into our prices than
hit the buyer with them afterwards.
-popsicle
|
My pet peeve is sellers who claim 'No fees!' and then inflate the postage
costs. If you are adding your 'handling' charges into the shipping charge,
then you are charging a fee just like the rest of us.
Jen
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| | | | | | | Author: | infinibrix | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 09:45 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 43 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
|
| In Buying, jennnifer writes:
| | In Buying, popsicle writes:
| | the added after-commitment costs through inflated shipping or additional charges,
sometimes both. At least with some vendors using the invoice method.
Example: Just paid a member within the EU, for some heads. Having never transacted
with this member before, I initially thought the price good. Silly me. At least
they only used one of the two available "additional charges" columns
In moving forward, what I typically do is create a note for the member (collected
quite a few over the years) so that the next time I am pondering a buy with them,
I’ll know to factor these types of costs (shipping rate and additional charges)
before pulling the trigger. For me it’s that simple.
I gotta say though, that it's been buyer experiences like this, that have
motivated me early on to structure our selling practice with no additional charges
and low shipping costs, to the point that we often subsidize the shipping by
a small amount. I'd rather bake any ancillary costs into our prices than
hit the buyer with them afterwards.
-popsicle
|
My pet peeve is sellers who claim 'No fees!' and then inflate the postage
costs. If you are adding your 'handling' charges into the shipping charge,
then you are charging a fee just like the rest of us.
Jen
|
Implementing the cost of packing materials and/or a small handling fee into your
shipping cost is standard business practice! We all know that it costs the seller
more than just the actual shipping cost to process the buyers order and so it
stands to reason not to expect to only pay the exact shipping cost? The buyer
only needs to know and wants to know a flat rate shipping/handling fee, they
don’t need to know or care to know an in depth breakdown of Shipping cost, packing
materials, processing time etc etc..
A single combined shipping/handling fee makes it simple to understand and so
what’s to be peeved about? Almost anywhere you buy from online operates there
shipping charge in this way and as long as it’s not extortionately above actual
shipping cost then I see no problem!
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | Rob_and_Shelagh | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 09:55 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 36 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| In Buying, infinibrix writes:
| | Implementing the cost of packing materials and/or a small handling fee into your
shipping cost is standard business practice! We all know that it costs the seller
more than just the actual shipping cost to process the buyers order and so it
stands to reason not to expect to only pay the exact shipping cost? The buyer
only needs to know and wants to know a flat rate shipping/handling fee, they
don’t need to know or care to know an in depth breakdown of Shipping cost, packing
materials, processing time etc etc..
A single combined shipping/handling fee makes it simple to understand and so
what’s to be peeved about? Almost anywhere you buy from online operates there
shipping charge in this way and as long as it’s not extortionately above actual
shipping cost then I see no problem!
|
Agreed and as long as it is clearly stated. Usually the price of the Lego is
more than the shipping but nobody seems interested in the seller breaking down
the price charged for the Lego
Robert
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | jennnifer | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 13:37 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 50 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| In Buying, infinibrix writes:
| |
A single combined shipping/handling fee makes it simple to understand and so
what’s to be peeved about? Almost anywhere you buy from online operates there
shipping charge in this way and as long as it’s not extortionately above actual
shipping cost then I see no problem!
|
My peeve isn't that sellers are combining costs. It's when they claim
they charge no fees and add a handling fee into the shipping cost. It's the
claim that irks me, not the process.
I say: I charge actual postage cost + $1 fee for handling: $4.99
Other sellers say: No Fees here! Shipping cost: $4.99
If you are charging no fees, then the order is the LEGO plus postage only.
Jen
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | infinibrix | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 20:03 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 78 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
|
| In Buying, jennnifer writes:
| | In Buying, infinibrix writes:
| |
A single combined shipping/handling fee makes it simple to understand and so
what’s to be peeved about? Almost anywhere you buy from online operates there
shipping charge in this way and as long as it’s not extortionately above actual
shipping cost then I see no problem!
|
My peeve isn't that sellers are combining costs. It's when they claim
they charge no fees and add a handling fee into the shipping cost. It's the
claim that irks me, not the process.
I say: I charge actual postage cost + $1 fee for handling: $4.99
Other sellers say: No Fees here! Shipping cost: $4.99
If you are charging no fees, then the order is the LEGO plus postage only.
Jen
|
Whats the difference? I really don't get your point because a shipping charge
is a shipping charge regardless of whether the seller chooses to include a small
amount of handling in that charge or not. One seller may charge $4 shipping whilst
another may charge $6 shipping but they're still just an upfront shipping
charge and unrelated to any other hidden or added fee that you or a buyer may
later take issue with!
When a seller claims "No Fees" it very much relates to any hidden fees
beyond that of the basic shipping/handling charge which every buyer already anticipates
and appreciates having to pay. This chosen shipping/handling charge amount can
vary between sellers (within reason!) and so to be concerned over delving so
heavily into the way a seller words and merges their shipping charge is just
being overly pedantic over something that the buyer really doesn't care too
much about!
The buyer just wants to know your total shipping charge, they don't need
to know a breakdown of how you came to decide upon that shipping charge as with
that logic you may as well also disclose to them how much you paid for your parts
and how much profit you're making from the sale of each of those parts!?
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| | | | | | | Author: | zorbanj | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 10:05 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 35 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| I think postage and shipping/handling are two different things that are often
conflated. Postage = the amount paid to USPS, UPS, etc. Shipping = postage paid
*and* other costs incurred to ship the order (packaging, tape, labels, driving
to the post office, etc).
When placing an order this is shown as "Shipping and Handling" but on
the invoice it is shown as just "Shipping". This is confusing and should
be changed to "Shipping and handling" in both places.
In Buying, jennnifer writes:
| |
My pet peeve is sellers who claim 'No fees!' and then inflate the postage
costs. If you are adding your 'handling' charges into the shipping charge,
then you are charging a fee just like the rest of us.
Jen
|
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| | | | | | | | | Author: | Rob_and_Shelagh | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 10:14 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 32 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
|
| In Buying, zorbanj writes:
| | I think postage and shipping/handling are two different things that are often
conflated. Postage = the amount paid to USPS, UPS, etc. Shipping = postage paid
*and* other costs incurred to ship the order (packaging, tape, labels, driving
to the post office, etc).
When placing an order this is shown as "Shipping and Handling" but on
the invoice it is shown as just "Shipping". This is confusing and should
be changed to "Shipping and handling" in both places.
|
Terminology varies. Shipping is commonly referred to here as P&P (postage and
packing). But yes, the important number for the customer is the "total shipping
price". Postage is just one of the costs to the seller. Nobody really needs
to know the breakdown of the price, we don't breakdown the Lego into cost
price, sorting and listing cost, storage cost, heat light and power, profit...
we just quote the price. What the customer needs to know is the price of his
order including shipping so he can compare it to the price offered elsewhere
(as well as considering other non-price factors in his sourcing decision).
Robert
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| | | | | | | | | | | Author: | infinibrix | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 10:41 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 35 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
|
| In Buying, Rob_and_Shelagh writes:
| | In Buying, zorbanj writes:
| | I think postage and shipping/handling are two different things that are often
conflated. Postage = the amount paid to USPS, UPS, etc. Shipping = postage paid
*and* other costs incurred to ship the order (packaging, tape, labels, driving
to the post office, etc).
When placing an order this is shown as "Shipping and Handling" but on
the invoice it is shown as just "Shipping". This is confusing and should
be changed to "Shipping and handling" in both places.
|
Nobody really needs to know the breakdown of the price, we don't breakdown the Lego into cost price, sorting and listing cost, storage cost, heat light and power, profit...
|
Shh its hard enough buying here as it is and you'll end up giving sellers
even more ideas/reasons for adding fees!!
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Rob_and_Shelagh | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 10:57 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 28 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
|
| In Buying, infinibrix writes:
| | In Buying, Rob_and_Shelagh writes:
| | In Buying, zorbanj writes:
| | I think postage and shipping/handling are two different things that are often
conflated. Postage = the amount paid to USPS, UPS, etc. Shipping = postage paid
*and* other costs incurred to ship the order (packaging, tape, labels, driving
to the post office, etc).
When placing an order this is shown as "Shipping and Handling" but on
the invoice it is shown as just "Shipping". This is confusing and should
be changed to "Shipping and handling" in both places.
|
Nobody really needs to know the breakdown of the price, we don't breakdown the Lego into cost price, sorting and listing cost, storage cost, heat light and power, profit...
|
Shh its hard enough buying here as it is and you'll end up giving sellers
even more ideas/reasons for adding fees!!
|
LOL, I can think of a few more! Really the loser in this is BL as they only earn
fees on the sale of the Lego. The customer pays the invoice price however that
is broken down but as you say it just makes it harder for the buyer to arrive
at the buying decision so we (you and us alike) try and make it easy for him
and cut out all the complicated nonsense
Robert
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | peregrinator | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 11:00 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 31 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| In Buying, infinibrix writes:
| | Shh its hard enough buying here as it is and you'll end up giving sellers
even more ideas/reasons for adding fees!!
|
"A $3 handling charge applies to all orders for envelopes, padding, tape,
gas, waiting in line*, unforeseen medical expenses, wear and tear on automobiles
and footwear, storage, proper lighting, ventilation, Bricklink fees, PayPal fees,
etc."
*queue for the UK folks
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Rob_and_Shelagh | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 11:03 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 33 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
|
| In Buying, peregrinator writes:
| | In Buying, infinibrix writes:
| | Shh its hard enough buying here as it is and you'll end up giving sellers
even more ideas/reasons for adding fees!!
|
"A $3 handling charge applies to all orders for envelopes, padding, tape,
gas, waiting in line*, unforeseen medical expenses, wear and tear on automobiles
and footwear, storage, proper lighting, ventilation, Bricklink fees, PayPal fees,
etc."
*queue for the UK folks
|
If we charged for queuing in the UK everything would be unafordable
|
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | WhiteHorseMatt | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 12:10 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 38 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
|
| In Buying, Rob_and_Shelagh writes:
| | In Buying, peregrinator writes:
| | In Buying, infinibrix writes:
| | Shh its hard enough buying here as it is and you'll end up giving sellers
even more ideas/reasons for adding fees!!
|
"A $3 handling charge applies to all orders for envelopes, padding, tape,
gas, waiting in line*, unforeseen medical expenses, wear and tear on automobiles
and footwear, storage, proper lighting, ventilation, Bricklink fees, PayPal fees,
etc."
*queue for the UK folks
|
If we charged for queuing in the UK everything would be unafordable
|
But we would still do it, and tut under our breath at those who do not.
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | 1001bricks | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 11:49 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 27 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
|
| In Buying, peregrinator writes:
| | In Buying, infinibrix writes:
| | Shh its hard enough buying here as it is and you'll end up giving sellers
even more ideas/reasons for adding fees!!
|
"A $3 handling charge applies to all orders for envelopes, padding, tape,
gas, waiting in line*, unforeseen medical expenses, wear and tear on automobiles
and footwear, storage, proper lighting, ventilation, Bricklink fees, PayPal fees,
etc."
|
For such discussions, Timothy Smith invented 15 years ago the "Stamp licking
fee"
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| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Author: | Nubs_Select | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 11:57 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 30 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
|
| In Buying, 1001bricks writes:
| | In Buying, peregrinator writes:
| | In Buying, infinibrix writes:
| | Shh its hard enough buying here as it is and you'll end up giving sellers
even more ideas/reasons for adding fees!!
|
"A $3 handling charge applies to all orders for envelopes, padding, tape,
gas, waiting in line*, unforeseen medical expenses, wear and tear on automobiles
and footwear, storage, proper lighting, ventilation, Bricklink fees, PayPal fees,
etc."
|
For such discussions, Timothy Smith invented 15 years ago the "Stamp licking
fee"
|
don’t forget the fee for the time it takes to calculate and add the fee
to the order
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| | | | | Author: | manganschlamm | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 11:23 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 38 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
|
| In Buying, popsicle writes:
| | the added after-commitment costs through inflated shipping or additional charges,
sometimes both. At least with some vendors using the invoice method.
Example: Just paid a member within the EU, for some heads. Having never transacted
with this member before, I initially thought the price good. Silly me. At least
they only used one of the two available "additional charges" columns
In moving forward, what I typically do is create a note for the member (collected
quite a few over the years) so that the next time I am pondering a buy with them,
I’ll know to factor these types of costs (shipping rate and additional charges)
before pulling the trigger. For me it’s that simple.
I gotta say though, that it's been buyer experiences like this, that have
motivated me early on to structure our selling practice with no additional charges
and low shipping costs, to the point that we often subsidize the shipping by
a small amount. I'd rather bake any ancillary costs into our prices than
hit the buyer with them afterwards.
-popsicle
|
Be happy that the seller does not charge some absurd lot limit or lot size or
whatever lot fee that is not explained properly in the terms.
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| | | | | | | Author: | popsicle | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 12:00 | | Subject: | (Cancelled) | | Viewed: | 44 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
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| | (Cancelled) |
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| | | | | Author: | BricksThatStick | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 14:53 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 46 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
|
| In Buying, popsicle writes:
| | the added after-commitment costs through inflated shipping or additional charges,
sometimes both. At least with some vendors using the invoice method.
Example: Just paid a member within the EU, for some heads. Having never transacted
with this member before, I initially thought the price good. Silly me. At least
they only used one of the two available "additional charges" columns
In moving forward, what I typically do is create a note for the member (collected
quite a few over the years) so that the next time I am pondering a buy with them,
I’ll know to factor these types of costs (shipping rate and additional charges)
before pulling the trigger. For me it’s that simple.
I gotta say though, that it's been buyer experiences like this, that have
motivated me early on to structure our selling practice with no additional charges
and low shipping costs, to the point that we often subsidize the shipping by
a small amount. I'd rather bake any ancillary costs into our prices than
hit the buyer with them afterwards.
-popsicle
|
Could be worse...
Imagine a Bricklink where sellers could make up their own fictional and inflated
exchange rates to convert from USD to their native currency when invoicing
|
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| | | | | | | Author: | Nubs_Select | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 14:59 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 35 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
|
| In Buying, BricksThatStick writes:
| | In Buying, popsicle writes:
| | the added after-commitment costs through inflated shipping or additional charges,
sometimes both. At least with some vendors using the invoice method.
Example: Just paid a member within the EU, for some heads. Having never transacted
with this member before, I initially thought the price good. Silly me. At least
they only used one of the two available "additional charges" columns
In moving forward, what I typically do is create a note for the member (collected
quite a few over the years) so that the next time I am pondering a buy with them,
I’ll know to factor these types of costs (shipping rate and additional charges)
before pulling the trigger. For me it’s that simple.
I gotta say though, that it's been buyer experiences like this, that have
motivated me early on to structure our selling practice with no additional charges
and low shipping costs, to the point that we often subsidize the shipping by
a small amount. I'd rather bake any ancillary costs into our prices than
hit the buyer with them afterwards.
-popsicle
|
Could be worse...
Imagine a Bricklink where sellers could make up their own fictional and inflated
exchange rates to convert from USD to their native currency when invoicing
|
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| | | | | | | Author: | 1001bricks | | Posted: | Jan 13, 2023 15:14 | | Subject: | Re: Still prevalent today... | | Viewed: | 46 times | | Topic: | Buying | |
|
| | | Imagine a Bricklink where sellers could make up their own fictional and inflated
exchange rates to convert from USD to their native currency when invoicing
|
Isn't it exactly what PayPal does?
I'm off to bed, still sick, freaking flu...
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USA, Washington
Canada, British Columbia
Netherlands, Noord-Holland
Sweden, Västra Götaland
United Kingdom, England
France, Provence-Alpes-Côte d'Azur
Germany, Nordrhein-Westfalen