Discussion Forum: Thread 272644

 Author: jujason View Messages Posted By jujason
 Posted: Aug 2, 2020 10:41
 Subject: Non paying buyer
 Viewed: 151 times
 Topic: Help
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jujason (2620)

Location:  USA, Oregon
Member Since Contact Type Status
Dec 17, 2003 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
Store: American Old West Store
Hi,

I wanted to ask since I haven't had to use this feature in a while, and I've
waited 1 week since the last status change, read the help, and spent some time
in the forums. I can't see to find any obvious reason, though maybe I'm
just missing it.

I have a buyer who emailed prior to ordering, asked for terms, I sent them all
terms and shipping quote, they then agreed to the terms and made the order.
As soon as they ordered the item they then requested a change from the terms
of the item, and I let them know, "no, we already agreed to the terms before
you bought the item." They then filed an order cancel request, which I cancelled
with the intent to file a non-paying buyer alert for the order.

I waited a week, and it still does not appear. I checked the buyer payment status,
and it says "none." Out of curiosity I tried it on another order and on other
orders, NPB is an option when I click on "Report Problem." On this order in
question, it isn't even an option listed, as if it is now not ever an option.

I'm confused why a non-paying buyer alert can't be filed.

Thanks
 Author: jujason View Messages Posted By jujason
 Posted: Aug 2, 2020 11:10
 Subject: Re: Non paying buyer
 Viewed: 38 times
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jujason (2620)

Location:  USA, Oregon
Member Since Contact Type Status
Dec 17, 2003 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
Store: American Old West Store
Second question regarding NPB, I have had a few orders lately for instructions
that the buyer then changes their mind when they decide shipping is too high.
I ship at actual lowest cost plus one dollar to cover shipping supplies, etc.,
but that wasn't acceptable to some buyers who don't understand the actual
cost to ship something, even after I explained this.

Does this qualify as a NPB, even when I have the shipping weight in the item
description? I'm tired to having to cancel order after order, when the buyers
don't seem to care how much time and effort it takes me to process orders
just to cancel them. I try to explain to each buyer also about the entire process
(shipping, policies, etc.), sometimes they accept that the cost is out of our
hands, and it is time consuming for me, but still decide to cancel.
 Author: alexwilcox View Messages Posted By alexwilcox
 Posted: Aug 2, 2020 11:21
 Subject: Re: Non paying buyer
 Viewed: 37 times
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alexwilcox (1326)

Location:  United Kingdom, England
Member Since Contact Type Status
Mar 21, 2003 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
Store: Bracknell Bricks
In Help, jujason writes:
  Second question regarding NPB, I have had a few orders lately for instructions
that the buyer then changes their mind when they decide shipping is too high.
I ship at actual lowest cost plus one dollar to cover shipping supplies, etc.,
but that wasn't acceptable to some buyers who don't understand the actual
cost to ship something, even after I explained this.

Does this qualify as a NPB, even when I have the shipping weight in the item
description? I'm tired to having to cancel order after order, when the buyers
don't seem to care how much time and effort it takes me to process orders
just to cancel them. I try to explain to each buyer also about the entire process
(shipping, policies, etc.), sometimes they accept that the cost is out of our
hands, and it is time consuming for me, but still decide to cancel.

Enable instant checkout and all this goes away! just my 2c.
 Author: Oakelm View Messages Posted By Oakelm
 Posted: Aug 2, 2020 11:46
 Subject: Re: Non paying buyer
 Viewed: 44 times
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Oakelm (159)

Location:  United Kingdom, England
Member Since Contact Type Status
Oct 3, 2017 Contact Member Seller
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Store: Oakelm Bricks
In Help, jujason writes:
  Second question regarding NPB, I have had a few orders lately for instructions
that the buyer then changes their mind when they decide shipping is too high.
I ship at actual lowest cost plus one dollar to cover shipping supplies, etc.,
but that wasn't acceptable to some buyers who don't understand the actual
cost to ship something, even after I explained this.

Does this qualify as a NPB, even when I have the shipping weight in the item
description? I'm tired to having to cancel order after order, when the buyers
don't seem to care how much time and effort it takes me to process orders
just to cancel them. I try to explain to each buyer also about the entire process
(shipping, policies, etc.), sometimes they accept that the cost is out of our
hands, and it is time consuming for me, but still decide to cancel.

Shipping cost being unexpected regardless of if it really is, that is allowed
grounds for a cancel order under the criteria they put on that cancel order page.
So no I wouldn’t say that would be grounds for NPB unless they hadn’t responded
in I think 7 days and you had already started the process of a NPB

You can have everything in terms, repeated several times and you will always
get cancellations on this ground, personally I think most of the time people
have simply changed their mind or found it cheaper elsewhere but won’t be honest
about that fact.

Instant checkout does remove a lot of this as most people go through that automated
process and you do see the order until it’s paid so removes this issue for the
majority of orders
 Author: Brickwilbo View Messages Posted By Brickwilbo
 Posted: Aug 2, 2020 13:32
 Subject: Re: Non paying buyer
 Viewed: 35 times
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Brickwilbo (1491)

Location:  Netherlands, Gelderland
Member Since Contact Type Status Collage
Oct 24, 2007 Contact Member Seller
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Store: Brickwilbo Betuwe Bricks
BrickLink Discussions Moderator (?)
In Help, jujason writes:
  Second question regarding NPB, I have had a few orders lately for instructions
that the buyer then changes their mind when they decide shipping is too high.
I ship at actual lowest cost plus one dollar to cover shipping supplies, etc.,
but that wasn't acceptable to some buyers who don't understand the actual
cost to ship something, even after I explained this.

Does this qualify as a NPB, even when I have the shipping weight in the item
description? I'm tired to having to cancel order after order, when the buyers
don't seem to care how much time and effort it takes me to process orders
just to cancel them. I try to explain to each buyer also about the entire process
(shipping, policies, etc.), sometimes they accept that the cost is out of our
hands, and it is time consuming for me, but still decide to cancel.

It's possible to start a NPB 5 days after the invoice.
 Author: bje View Messages Posted By bje
 Posted: Aug 2, 2020 11:41
 Subject: Re: Non paying buyer
 Viewed: 34 times
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bje (1435)

Location:  South Africa, Western Cape
Member Since Contact Type Status
May 24, 2010 Contact Member Seller
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Store: JE Bricks
In Help, jujason writes:

  I have a buyer who emailed prior to ordering, asked for terms, I sent them all
terms and shipping quote, they then agreed to the terms and made the order.
As soon as they ordered the item they then requested a change from the terms
of the item, and I let them know, "no, we already agreed to the terms before
you bought the item." They then filed an order cancel request, which I cancelled
with the intent to file a non-paying buyer alert for the order.

You have cancelled the order, you cannot now set it to NPB as it does not exist
any longer. Ideally you want to complete the NPB and then cancel if it goes to
NPX or if the buyer does not pay.

  

snip
 Author: Oakelm View Messages Posted By Oakelm
 Posted: Aug 2, 2020 11:41
 Subject: Re: Non paying buyer
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Oakelm (159)

Location:  United Kingdom, England
Member Since Contact Type Status
Oct 3, 2017 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
Store: Oakelm Bricks
In Help, jujason writes:
  Hi,

I wanted to ask since I haven't had to use this feature in a while, and I've
waited 1 week since the last status change, read the help, and spent some time
in the forums. I can't see to find any obvious reason, though maybe I'm
just missing it.

I have a buyer who emailed prior to ordering, asked for terms, I sent them all
terms and shipping quote, they then agreed to the terms and made the order.
As soon as they ordered the item they then requested a change from the terms
of the item, and I let them know, "no, we already agreed to the terms before
you bought the item." They then filed an order cancel request, which I cancelled
with the intent to file a non-paying buyer alert for the order.

I waited a week, and it still does not appear. I checked the buyer payment status,
and it says "none." Out of curiosity I tried it on another order and on other
orders, NPB is an option when I click on "Report Problem." On this order in
question, it isn't even an option listed, as if it is now not ever an option.

I'm confused why a non-paying buyer alert can't be filed.

Thanks

I think but not certain as not had to go NPB but as you cancelled you already
resolved the issue hence NPB is not available. As the NPB process basically cancels
the order in the end anyway just with a mark on the record of the buyer so they
can’t repeat it too many times. So one to remember should it ever happen again.
 Author: jujason View Messages Posted By jujason
 Posted: Aug 2, 2020 13:24
 Subject: Re: Non paying buyer
 Viewed: 45 times
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jujason (2620)

Location:  USA, Oregon
Member Since Contact Type Status
Dec 17, 2003 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
Store: American Old West Store
So this was pretty much my question. Once the buyer initiates the order cancel
request, and the seller cancels the request the order reverts to "pending."
Then, the option for NPB is eliminated? Doesn't that give buyers an unlimited
number of times to order with no intent to follow through? That is, as long
as they request to cancel before the seller requests a NPB.

That means sellers have to initiate the NPB before the buyer initiates a cancel
request, but in this case the buyer initiated a request before I knew they were
going to cancel. So in this sense, they can order and request to cancel without
ever being penalized with a NPB.

This isn't listed in the Bricklink help anywhere. It seems to give an allowance
for fraudulent orders for buyers.


In Help, Oakelm writes:
  In Help, jujason writes:
  Hi,

I wanted to ask since I haven't had to use this feature in a while, and I've
waited 1 week since the last status change, read the help, and spent some time
in the forums. I can't see to find any obvious reason, though maybe I'm
just missing it.

I have a buyer who emailed prior to ordering, asked for terms, I sent them all
terms and shipping quote, they then agreed to the terms and made the order.
As soon as they ordered the item they then requested a change from the terms
of the item, and I let them know, "no, we already agreed to the terms before
you bought the item." They then filed an order cancel request, which I cancelled
with the intent to file a non-paying buyer alert for the order.

I waited a week, and it still does not appear. I checked the buyer payment status,
and it says "none." Out of curiosity I tried it on another order and on other
orders, NPB is an option when I click on "Report Problem." On this order in
question, it isn't even an option listed, as if it is now not ever an option.

I'm confused why a non-paying buyer alert can't be filed.

Thanks

I think but not certain as not had to go NPB but as you cancelled you already
resolved the issue hence NPB is not available. As the NPB process basically cancels
the order in the end anyway just with a mark on the record of the buyer so they
can’t repeat it too many times. So one to remember should it ever happen again.
 Author: Grego View Messages Posted By Grego
 Posted: Aug 2, 2020 20:12
 Subject: Re: Non paying buyer
 Viewed: 46 times
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Grego (3894)

Location:  Canada, British Columbia
Member Since Contact Type Status
Jan 11, 2006 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
Store Closed Store: Gregos
In Help, jujason writes:
  So this was pretty much my question. Once the buyer initiates the order cancel
request, and the seller cancels the request the order reverts to "pending."

If you deny the OCR instead of approving it, then you can issue a NPB


snip
 Author: jujason View Messages Posted By jujason
 Posted: Aug 3, 2020 11:28
 Subject: Re: Non paying buyer
 Viewed: 39 times
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jujason (2620)

Location:  USA, Oregon
Member Since Contact Type Status
Dec 17, 2003 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
Store: American Old West Store
That is what I had tried to do, and listed in my first post. The option to file
non-paying buyer is no longer available.


In Help, Grego writes:
  In Help, jujason writes:
  So this was pretty much my question. Once the buyer initiates the order cancel
request, and the seller cancels the request the order reverts to "pending."

If you deny the OCR instead of approving it, then you can issue a NPB


snip
 Author: Brickwilbo View Messages Posted By Brickwilbo
 Posted: Aug 3, 2020 11:34
 Subject: Re: Non paying buyer
 Viewed: 47 times
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Brickwilbo (1491)

Location:  Netherlands, Gelderland
Member Since Contact Type Status Collage
Oct 24, 2007 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
View Collage Pic
Store: Brickwilbo Betuwe Bricks
BrickLink Discussions Moderator (?)
In Help, jujason writes:
  That is what I had tried to do, and listed in my first post. The option to file
non-paying buyer is no longer available.

Did you invoice the order?

  

In Help, Grego writes:
  In Help, jujason writes:
  So this was pretty much my question. Once the buyer initiates the order cancel
request, and the seller cancels the request the order reverts to "pending."

If you deny the OCR instead of approving it, then you can issue a NPB


snip
 Author: jujason View Messages Posted By jujason
 Posted: Aug 3, 2020 18:06
 Subject: Re: Non paying buyer
 Viewed: 51 times
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jujason (2620)

Location:  USA, Oregon
Member Since Contact Type Status
Dec 17, 2003 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
Store: American Old West Store
In Help, Brickwilbo writes:
  In Help, jujason writes:
  That is what I had tried to do, and listed in my first post. The option to file
non-paying buyer is no longer available.

Did you invoice the order?

No, this was the sequence that led to the present state:

1. Buyer placed order.
2. Buyer emails back and forth, informs me they no longer intend to follow through
with order.
3. Buyer initiates order cancel request.
4. Seller cancels order cancel request.

Now, seller (me) cannot initiate a NPB. When I click on "report a problem" the
only option visible is OCR.

Reading the help page more closely, it appears the NPB is possible 2 weeks after
the buyer "responds" which I am guessing can include a message or OCR.

I will try waiting 2 weeks and see what happens. IF OCR is the only option I'll
just use that.




  
  

In Help, Grego writes:
  In Help, jujason writes:
  So this was pretty much my question. Once the buyer initiates the order cancel
request, and the seller cancels the request the order reverts to "pending."

If you deny the OCR instead of approving it, then you can issue a NPB


snip
 Author: Grego View Messages Posted By Grego
 Posted: Aug 3, 2020 21:06
 Subject: Re: Non paying buyer
 Viewed: 39 times
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Grego (3894)

Location:  Canada, British Columbia
Member Since Contact Type Status
Jan 11, 2006 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
Store Closed Store: Gregos
In Help, jujason writes:
  In Help, Brickwilbo writes:
  In Help, jujason writes:
  That is what I had tried to do, and listed in my first post. The option to file
non-paying buyer is no longer available.

Did you invoice the order?

No, this was the sequence that led to the present state:

1. Buyer placed order.
2. Buyer emails back and forth, informs me they no longer intend to follow through
with order.
3. Buyer initiates order cancel request.
4. Seller cancels order cancel request.

Now, seller (me) cannot initiate a NPB. When I click on "report a problem" the
only option visible is OCR.

Reading the help page more closely, it appears the NPB is possible 2 weeks after
the buyer "responds" which I am guessing can include a message or OCR.

I will try waiting 2 weeks and see what happens. IF OCR is the only option I'll
just use that.


I dunno, been awhile since I looked at BL's new and improved conditions for
NPB ....but I seem to recall that in order for them to even be considered for
NPB ...you have to have invoiced them .... otherwise ...after 2 weeks of non-invoicing
THEY could NSS you ...
 Author: Brickwilbo View Messages Posted By Brickwilbo
 Posted: Aug 4, 2020 02:20
 Subject: Re: Non paying buyer
 Viewed: 41 times
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Brickwilbo (1491)

Location:  Netherlands, Gelderland
Member Since Contact Type Status Collage
Oct 24, 2007 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
View Collage Pic
Store: Brickwilbo Betuwe Bricks
BrickLink Discussions Moderator (?)
In Help, Grego writes:
  In Help, jujason writes:
  In Help, Brickwilbo writes:
  In Help, jujason writes:
  That is what I had tried to do, and listed in my first post. The option to file
non-paying buyer is no longer available.

Did you invoice the order?

No, this was the sequence that led to the present state:

1. Buyer placed order.
2. Buyer emails back and forth, informs me they no longer intend to follow through
with order.
3. Buyer initiates order cancel request.
4. Seller cancels order cancel request.

Now, seller (me) cannot initiate a NPB. When I click on "report a problem" the
only option visible is OCR.

Reading the help page more closely, it appears the NPB is possible 2 weeks after
the buyer "responds" which I am guessing can include a message or OCR.

I will try waiting 2 weeks and see what happens. IF OCR is the only option I'll
just use that.


I dunno, been awhile since I looked at BL's new and improved conditions for
NPB ....but I seem to recall that in order for them to even be considered for
NPB ...you have to have invoiced them .... otherwise ...after 2 weeks of non-invoicing
THEY could NSS you ...

Yes, a NRS if the order isn't invoiced.

It's recently changed from order date to Invoiced date:
https://www.bricklink.com/message.asp?ID=1198619
 Author: pitz8008 View Messages Posted By pitz8008
 Posted: Aug 3, 2020 23:52
 Subject: Re: Non paying buyer
 Viewed: 33 times
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pitz8008 (8981)

Location:  USA, Illinois
Member Since Contact Type Status
Dec 30, 2009 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
Store: The Pitz Playhouse
In Help, jujason writes:
  In Help, Brickwilbo writes:
  In Help, jujason writes:
  That is what I had tried to do, and listed in my first post. The option to file
non-paying buyer is no longer available.

Did you invoice the order?

No, this was the sequence that led to the present state:

1. Buyer placed order.
2. Buyer emails back and forth, informs me they no longer intend to follow through
with order.
3. Buyer initiates order cancel request.
4. Seller cancels order cancel request.

Now, seller (me) cannot initiate a NPB. When I click on "report a problem" the
only option visible is OCR.

Reading the help page more closely, it appears the NPB is possible 2 weeks after
the buyer "responds" which I am guessing can include a message or OCR.

I will try waiting 2 weeks and see what happens. IF OCR is the only option I'll
just use that.




  
  

In Help, Grego writes:
  In Help, jujason writes:
  So this was pretty much my question. Once the buyer initiates the order cancel
request, and the seller cancels the request the order reverts to "pending."

If you deny the OCR instead of approving it, then you can issue a NPB


snip


I would assume you have to send an invoice in order to be able to file an npb.
 Author: Brickwilbo View Messages Posted By Brickwilbo
 Posted: Aug 4, 2020 02:17
 Subject: Re: Non paying buyer
 Viewed: 30 times
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Brickwilbo (1491)

Location:  Netherlands, Gelderland
Member Since Contact Type Status Collage
Oct 24, 2007 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
View Collage Pic
Store: Brickwilbo Betuwe Bricks
BrickLink Discussions Moderator (?)
In Help, pitz8008 writes:
  In Help, jujason writes:
  In Help, Brickwilbo writes:
  In Help, jujason writes:
  That is what I had tried to do, and listed in my first post. The option to file
non-paying buyer is no longer available.

Did you invoice the order?

No, this was the sequence that led to the present state:

1. Buyer placed order.
2. Buyer emails back and forth, informs me they no longer intend to follow through
with order.
3. Buyer initiates order cancel request.
4. Seller cancels order cancel request.

Now, seller (me) cannot initiate a NPB. When I click on "report a problem" the
only option visible is OCR.

Reading the help page more closely, it appears the NPB is possible 2 weeks after
the buyer "responds" which I am guessing can include a message or OCR.

I will try waiting 2 weeks and see what happens. IF OCR is the only option I'll
just use that.




  
  

In Help, Grego writes:
  In Help, jujason writes:
  So this was pretty much my question. Once the buyer initiates the order cancel
request, and the seller cancels the request the order reverts to "pending."

If you deny the OCR instead of approving it, then you can issue a NPB


snip


I would assume you have to send an invoice in order to be able to file an npb.

Correct, it's recently been changed from Order Date to Invoiced date:
https://www.bricklink.com/message.asp?ID=1198619
 Author: jujason View Messages Posted By jujason
 Posted: Aug 4, 2020 19:04
 Subject: Re: Non paying buyer
 Viewed: 56 times
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jujason (2620)

Location:  USA, Oregon
Member Since Contact Type Status
Dec 17, 2003 Contact Member Seller
Buying Privileges - OKSelling Privileges - OK
Store: American Old West Store
In Help, Brickwilbo writes:
  In Help, pitz8008 writes:
  In Help, jujason writes:
  In Help, Brickwilbo writes:
  In Help, jujason writes:
  That is what I had tried to do, and listed in my first post. The option to file
non-paying buyer is no longer available.

Did you invoice the order?

No, this was the sequence that led to the present state:

1. Buyer placed order.
2. Buyer emails back and forth, informs me they no longer intend to follow through
with order.
3. Buyer initiates order cancel request.
4. Seller cancels order cancel request.

Now, seller (me) cannot initiate a NPB. When I click on "report a problem" the
only option visible is OCR.

Reading the help page more closely, it appears the NPB is possible 2 weeks after
the buyer "responds" which I am guessing can include a message or OCR.

I will try waiting 2 weeks and see what happens. IF OCR is the only option I'll
just use that.




  
  

In Help, Grego writes:
  In Help, jujason writes:
  So this was pretty much my question. Once the buyer initiates the order cancel
request, and the seller cancels the request the order reverts to "pending."

If you deny the OCR instead of approving it, then you can issue a NPB


snip


I would assume you have to send an invoice in order to be able to file an npb.

Correct, it's recently been changed from Order Date to Invoiced date:
https://www.bricklink.com/message.asp?ID=1198619


I see that now, thank you.

It states:

"b. An NPB is only fileable in Pending, Processing, Updated, Ready, Packed (and
not paid) status."


If this is the case, why would an order remain in Pending if it was invoiced?